My new mandolin is a real piece of s--t!

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 27 Mar 2005 1:14 pm

And when I say that, it's an insult to fecal matter.

When my vintage Epiphone (a Gibson in every way but the name on the headstock) mandolin broke last December, I spent a fair amount of time looking for a replacement. I chose a wonderful but very expensive one, but that one is that is too valuable to use for bar gigs. So I also bought a second one, a solid body specifically for that purpose. It arrived yesterday.

This is the worst piece of junk I've ever seen. The frets are not parallel, and some of the upper frets are further apart than lower ones, the nut is about 3/16ths of an inch high, and the fretboard seems to be made out of balsa wood.

I expected this to be a low end instrument that needed a lot of tweaking before it could be made playable, but this goes beyond my worst expectations. This thing cannot even be called a real instrument. It falls into the catagory of a fraud perpetrated on unsuspecting people thinking they are buying something that can be used to make music.

I am appalled and angry that anybody would even make something like this. It is in the same league as the "batbox" psuedo-guitars of the 50s and 60s.

I still need a solid body electric for bar gigs, so I'm going to get a new neck from Stewart-Macdonald and graft it in place, but I can't stress enough how shocked and bitterly disappointed I am at the quality of this piece of garbage.

The brand name is "Galveston." Be forwarned.

Bill Llewellyn · Post by **Bill Llewellyn** » 27 Mar 2005 1:37 pm

My new mandolin is a real piece of....

Mike, what could you possibly mean? Salt? Shot? Silt? Soot?

I'm so confused.

Seriously, very sorry you're so disappointed. I myself bought a used brand name keyboard a year or so ago, and found its celebrated "piano action" eventually breaks spontaneously. Manufacturing defect. Grrrr.

Alan Shank · Post by **Alan Shank** » 27 Mar 2005 1:51 pm

What kind is your new good one?

Way back in about 1968, my friend Dave Elson (Mike, you probably remember him from Ash Grove days) took some Social Security money he got after his dad died and bought instruments for a couple of us so we could become a rock band (we were playing Bluegrass back then). He bought me an electric, solid-body mandolin. I wonder whether it was better, worse or equal to yours. 1st, the scale was too long, so I couldn't reach the 7th fret with my pinky. It didn't even come close to fretting true, either.

BTW, I have been playing mandolin again for the last 2-3 years, and I purchased a new Loar copy from a local builder, who died a few months ago, Cliff Sargent. I love it! At first I was very reluctant to spend $7K, but my brother Erik told me to look on it as an investment. When I did that, my reluctance disappeared

Good luck with the re-building project, Mike.
Cheers,
Alan Shank

Eric West · Post by **Eric West** » 27 Mar 2005 2:32 pm

Sooo.. Other than that, how is the tone?

(ducks..)

EJL

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 27 Mar 2005 3:03 pm

Alan, I remember Dave Elson very well. How is he? I also remember your brother.

My good mandolin is a Rigel A+ deluxe. This is an exquisite instrument. Better than the one that broke. Mine is a blue sunburst. Here are some links.

http://www.rigelmandolin.com/

http://www.rigelmandolin.com/A+Deluxe.html

This link is to a fellow holding a different model, but the same color as mine.

http://www.rigelmandolin.com/images/eschliman.jpg

Dave Burr · Post by **Dave Burr** » 27 Mar 2005 3:53 pm

Mike,

How about this link to a picture of you holding your mandolin... It's posted on Rigel's website. http://www.rigelmandolin.com/images/perlowin.jpg

Nice looking mando! Sorry to hear about the troubles with your cheapo.

Respectfully,
Dave Burr

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 27 Mar 2005 5:53 pm

I didn't know Rigel posted that picture. I think I look really dumb in it.

There's a much better picture of me on the MSA web site.

http://msapedalsteels.com/html/m__perlowin.html [This message was edited by Mike Perlowin on 27 March 2005 at 05:54 PM.]

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 27 Mar 2005 6:00 pm

Mike, let me guess. That mando wasn't made here in the states?

Also, are you sure that's not Mitch Miller's picture on the MSA website?

David Cobb · Post by **David Cobb** » 27 Mar 2005 7:20 pm

harmonycentral.com seems like a good place to compare opinions on instruments. Example: Beautiful reso guitar on eBay.
I checked the exact make and model at HC and nobody who had bought one had a good word to say about it.

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 27 Mar 2005 7:26 pm

Galveston is the brand huh? I don't know 'nuthin about them. I needed a cheapo for a backup and found a solid top "Kentucky" sunburst A-style for under $200. Cheap, kind of ugly, and made in Asia. But it's a good mandolin after a setup and some tweaks. It honestly sounds better in every respect compared to the $3, $4, and $5k Gibsons. Sidenote: I've been shocked at the horrible build quality of these new Gibson A and F style mandos. Unforgivably sloppy workmanship and the tops are so thick they sound like crap. That company is riding on name alone it seems. They'd have no idea how to clone a Loar.

Brad

Larry Clark · Post by **Larry Clark** » 27 Mar 2005 9:39 pm

Any opinions from you mandolin guys on the Michael Kelly stuff? Most of what I've heard is "pretty decent for the money" type comments. Never had a chance to hear one myself so any feedback would be appreciated.

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 27 Mar 2005 9:55 pm

Any opinions from you mandolin guys on the Michael Kelly stuff?

Our fellow forumite Michael Johnstone has one. Perhaps you ought to ask him what he thinks about it. [This message was edited by Mike Perlowin on 27 March 2005 at 09:56 PM.]

Lefty · Post by **Lefty** » 28 Mar 2005 3:49 am

My wife plays mandolin. She has a vintage Gibson A style that was her aunt's, a decesed music instructor who taught at Miami College, Ohio. I wanted to get her a substitute for playing out to save wear and tear etc. I bought her an Ovation (Electric Acoustic, American made) for 370.00 used. It is a really good sounding and playing instument. It has a preamp and graphic EQ built in, but sounds really good acoustic. I also found a Kentucky F style at a pawn shop. Very good condition 225.00, and it sounds pretty good. Made im China, I believe, but the workmanship is pretty good. I thimk the Ovation sounds the better of the two, though.
Good luck. I have heard the Flatiron madolins are good also.
Lefty[This message was edited by Lefty on 28 March 2005 at 03:50 AM.][This message was edited by Lefty on 28 March 2005 at 03:51 AM.]

Jerry Hayes · Post by **Jerry Hayes** » 28 Mar 2005 6:32 am

I have an old Gibson F-style fitted with the Fishman bridge that has the pickup imbedded in it for most gigs but when I really need to crank up with a lot of volume I use a Fender A-style which has the magnetic pickup and a regular volume and tone control just like an electric guitar. It doesn't need a pre-amp which is cool and you can run all sorts of effects and play as loud as any other lead instrument on the bandstand...JH in Va.

------------------
Livin' in the Past and Future with a 12 string Mooney Universal tuning.

John Rosett · Post by **John Rosett** » 28 Mar 2005 7:54 am

mike-
you must play in some pretty rough joints. i have been gigging with a fairly expensive and very nice mando for years (flatiron, weber, arrow). i play in bars all over, and haven't had any problems with theft, damage, etc. (knock on wood)
i think that you should forget about the junk and just gig with that great playing rigel. after all, that's what it's made for.
we poened for the gourds a couple of years ago, and kevin russell was touring with his teens gibson A, and seemed to be doing fine with it.
good luck either way!
john

Bill Hatcher · Post by **Bill Hatcher** » 28 Mar 2005 8:50 am

Mike. If you bought the mando from somewhere on the net or a mail order place and had it shipped to you and expected to get a good playing/sounding unit---no way. You have to go to music stores that carry these and look through dozens to find even one that might be a bar beater.

There is a Guitar Center on my way home here in Atlanta. I stop in about once a week and look through all the cheap Chinese junk with Fender on the headstock. I am amazed at the wide variation of playability/quality between guitars of the same make. Some have horrible neck/body wood and some have the nicest tight grain woods and just sound fine.

You roll the dice when you buy sight unseen/unplayed.

Send it back.[This message was edited by Bill Hatcher on 28 March 2005 at 08:52 AM.]

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 28 Mar 2005 10:31 am

I've decided to send the mandolin back (if the store will accept it) and either buy something better, or buy a neck from Stu-Mac and a piece of wood, and make something.

BTW, I sometimes play with a blues rock band and use distortion, so I specifically want a solid body instrument that won't feed back.

Dave Burr · Post by **Dave Burr** » 28 Mar 2005 12:41 pm

Mike, Are you wanting a 4, 5 or 8 string solid body?

db[This message was edited by Dave Burr on 28 March 2005 at 12:48 PM.]

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 28 Mar 2005 1:50 pm

Mike, Are you wanting a 4, 5 or 8 string solid body?

8. I want my mandolins to sound like mandolins, not soprano guitars. (I have one of those too.)

John Rosett · Post by **John Rosett** » 28 Mar 2005 2:17 pm

mike-
the wendler electrocoustic mandolin sounds like the axe for you. i've been looking at these too. solid body 8-string with a magnetic pickup and a piezo pickup with a blending preamp built in.
check it out at www.electrocoustic.com and www.jazzmando.com
certainly more expensive than some other options, but it sure looks like a great instrument.
john

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 28 Mar 2005 2:43 pm

John, I've alread looked at the Wendler, and it seems like a real winner (as do their guitars.) But as you pointed out, these a fairly expensive instruments, and having bought the Rigel, I'm now somewhat limited in how much more I can spend.

Both the Wendler mandolin and guitar are on my fantasy "if I win the lottery" list of things I'd buy, along with a new Millenium, a Legend and a Promat P-P (just for something different.)

I think that my best option at this point is to get a new neck and fretboard from Stu-Mac and graft it on to the one I have. As far as I can tell, the body itself is OK, and I saved the grover tuning pegs and custom made Seymour Duncan stacked humbucking pickup for mandolin from the one that broke.

BTW, the store that sold me this piece of garbage is called Music Pals. I wrote to them and told them I was dissatisfied and wanted to return the instrument, (I use the term loosely) and they refused, and in fact were quite nasty about it.

It seems to me that any reputable dealer would not sell crap like this in the first place, and would honor the request of a dissatisfied customer for a refund.

I will never do business with this dealer again, and I would advise anybody else planning to buy something from them to look elsewhere.

Alan Shank · Post by **Alan Shank** » 28 Mar 2005 3:39 pm

"Alan, I remember Dave Elson very well. How is he? I also remember your brother."

Dave is fine, living in Santa Clara. In November, he came out to Woodland, where Erik and I live, for the Bluegrass Festival. We picked for a couple of hours here at my house, then for about six hours at the festival. (We only watched a couple of bands.) Afterwards, we went to a bar and drank beer and talked until about 1AM.

Dave is playing only guitar now, his old J-200 and a couple of electrics. He gave up fiddle and banjo years ago. I always thought he would be a great steel player, considering his banjo skill and his ear for music, but he has never played one.

My brother lives here in Woodland now, and is playing the banjo quite well. I have about 200 Bluegrass songs/tunes programmed into BIAB, so we just use the guitar and bass tracks. We are looking for human pickers, but slim pickings out here.
Cheers,
Alan

Andy Volk · Post by **Andy Volk** » 28 Mar 2005 4:33 pm

Sorry to hear about your bad luck, mike. Sounds like your mando is in the same ballpark as the Estaban guitar. Here's a sampling of reviews from Harmony Central:

"This guitar is hypersensitive to any motion or movement as it will go out of tune. I find this helps to predict earthquakes. PLEASE ADVISE: AFTER TUNING, DO NOT PLAY. With the gap between the neck and the strings, I'm thinking of hanging myself----but the guitar would fall apart before I reached that point. I put vice grips on this thing as a capo. If Estefrauds head was in front of me I'd put vice grips on that too."

"sucks sucks sucks sucks sucks.....was the video over an hour, or did it just seem that long? Can't even use the video to tape stuff over because that's junk too. The gig bag is a body bag for this junk. End of story. Segovia taught this loser? I bet he's rolling in his grave right now. The only billboard charts this guy is on is for the hearing impaired."

"There was no set up. Probably made buy a cardboard box company. Three of the frets were sticking out enough to tear off a knuckle.The fretboard is covered with some kind of goo. I tried to play the thing for a couple of minutes and the ends of my fingers were black from this stuff. One of the tuning pegs had this same sticky goo all over it. When I tried to remove it I noticed that it had melted part of the plastic peg. The finish looks like flooring varnish."

Caveat Emptor! Do your homework when buying any instrument - especially sight unseen/sound unheard.

Gary Lee Gimble · Post by **Gary Lee Gimble** » 29 Mar 2005 12:52 am

Mike, if your purchase was a mail order deal and 30 days haven't come to pass, you can get a full refund. The merchant is within their rights to pass on a reasonable restocking charge. If you paid for the item with your credit card, you have even more leverage, mail order or not, call your credit card ASAP to contest the charge if this is the case. Then return the item via a shipping store, let them do the boxing up so the music dealer can't say it was returned damaged. Send the mandolin back certified mail, "No Return Receipt." If you make them sign for it as in "Receipt Confirmation," you are giving them the option to refuse the delivery.
gLg

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 29 Mar 2005 3:42 am

Thanks Gary. I will check into that. I will be contacting the better buisness bureau tomorrow and find out exactly what I can and can't do.

I should mention that the amount of money involved is only a hundred bucks, but there's a proinciple involved. People should not sell merchandise that does not do what it's supposed to, and cannot be made to work properly.

When I was a teenager and gave guitar lessons, I occasionaly ran into a guitar of this quality, and when I did I refused to attempt to teach the student or charge for my time. We've probably all seen, and been appalled by, these unplayable objects that look like instruments but in fact are fit only for firewood.