What Does 'Warm' Mean?

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 4 Feb 2003 6:43 pm

I've heard people say that one sound is 'warmer' than another. What does that mean? More midrange?

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<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6), Roland Handsonic, Line6 Variax (coming soon)

Roy Ayres · Post by **Roy Ayres** » 4 Feb 2003 6:46 pm

To me, it's always meant less highs; a "softer" tone; less of a "shrill" tone. I've heard some jazz guitarists also call it a "brown" tone.

JB Arnold · Post by **JB Arnold** » 4 Feb 2003 6:48 pm

The above, plus:

Tubes.

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Fulawka D-10 9&5
Mullen Royal Precision D-10 8 & 5
"All in all, looking back, I'd have to say the best advice anyone ever gave me was 'Hands Up, Don't Move!"
www.johnbarnold.com/pedalsteel
www.buddycage.net

http://www.nrpsmusic.com/index.html

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 4 Feb 2003 7:57 pm

some jazz guitarists also call it a "brown" tone

Brown 25 looks warm.

chas smith R.I.P. · Post by **chas smith R.I.P.** » 4 Feb 2003 8:09 pm

The resonant frequency of the earth is about Eb, so it's close to that...

Jody Carver · Post by **Jody Carver** » 4 Feb 2003 9:36 pm

Is that what Van Halen called his sound?

The Brown Sound?

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 4 Feb 2003 10:29 pm

Jody,
You must be thinking of "The Brown Crown" that Valerie Bertinelli's lawyers left on Eddie's head last july.

Bob

Dave Boothroyd · Post by **Dave Boothroyd** » 5 Feb 2003 12:40 am

Warm, if analysed, means a timbre in which even numbered harmonics predominate, the frequency spectrum is close to that of a human voice heard from close up, and the reverberation is consistent with a small, diffuse and non reflective environment. Dynamics should be limited by a very smooth transition towards a lowish threshold.
In other words, if it sounds like somebody special murmuring quietly into your ear, in soft and cosy surroundings , it's warm!
Cheers
Dave

Jim Smith · Post by **Jim Smith** » 5 Feb 2003 5:05 am

I've also heard that even harmonics sound warm and odd harmonics sound harsh, in descriptions of amps anyway.

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 5 Feb 2003 6:04 am

Gibsons/Sho-Buds are warmer than Fenders/Emmons, and Naples, FL is a darn sight warmer than Muswell Hill in North London.....

Mark Ardito · Post by **Mark Ardito** » 5 Feb 2003 6:19 am

That is pretty funny.

I worked as an engineer at a studio before moving into the computer field. I heard musicians use all sorts of goofy terms to describe their tone; "Glassy, Warm, Brown, Transparent, Barky, Rough, Lots-0-bite, ballsy and mellow". I even had one guy tell me to "put some sheen" on his guitar when we were mixing his record. I added some verb and then a tiny bit of compression and he liked it. I guess as an engineer you just learn to take the goofy adjectives and translate them into effects you have in the control room.

Mark

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Sho~Bud Pro I, Fender D-8 (C6&E13) http://www.darkmagneto.com

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 5 Feb 2003 8:18 am

Speaking of 'goofy adjectives', Mark - we were rehearsing for "Always - Patsy Cline" at Mill Mountain Theatre in Roanoke, VA, and the director (who also happened to be the playwright) paused, reflected for a minute, then asked us if we could sound more 'yellow'.

To this day, I have no idea what he wanted, but the moment passed, and we kept our 'gig' - I guess we were 'yellow' enough after all.....

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Roger Rettig

Terry Edwards · Post by **Terry Edwards** » 5 Feb 2003 8:37 am

Warm is soft.

Cold is harsh.

When talking amplifiers, "warm" is analog tube sounds. Strictly digital is thought to be more harsh. Although they have tube preamps now to "warm up" the sound.

When talking recording, analog tape machines are thought to be "warmer" than digital. With the higher sampling rates and software tube emulators I digital recordings sound just fine these days.

And analog toasters and ovens are so warm that manufacturers won't even develop a digital version.

Terry

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Terry Edwards
Fessy D-10; Nash 1000
Martin D-21; Flatiron F-5

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 5 Feb 2003 9:17 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Warm is soft.
Cold is harsh.

When talking amplifiers, "warm" is analog tube sounds.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

These two definitions of "warm" have always seemed contradictory to me, because I associate harsh=tube and soft=solidstate. So to me, tube amps sound cold and ss amps sound warm.

Michael Holland · Post by **Michael Holland** » 5 Feb 2003 10:45 am

I think that abstract terms are entirely appropriate when describing sound. Even if no one else has a clue, I certainly understand what I mean. And I am unanimous in that!

Dave, that's a lovely sentiment. Would you be my special friend?

Jim Cohen · Post by **Jim Cohen** » 5 Feb 2003 11:15 am

I've been told by a studio engineer that "warm" actually means "distortion"...

chas smith R.I.P. · Post by **chas smith R.I.P.** » 5 Feb 2003 11:48 am

I've always thought of tubes as 'soft'and 'saggy', whereas solid state was 'hard' and 'snappy'.

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 5 Feb 2003 12:23 pm

Most tube amps I've played through sound brighter and harsher than solid state amps. If "warm" means less highs, then "warm tube" is a contradiction (unless it's referring to temperature).

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<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6), Roland Handsonic, Line6 Variax (coming soon)

Stephen Gambrell · Post by **Stephen Gambrell** » 5 Feb 2003 2:00 pm

I had a Texas guitar player tell me, that my beat-up Twin sounded "wombly." Any of you Texas guys know if this was a compliment??

David Doggett · Post by **David Doggett** » 5 Feb 2003 2:17 pm

I've always though Jim Cohen's studio engineer had it right. Acoustic instruments don't have pure frequency sounds. The materials of the instrument add or take away certain harmonics. That's why a fiddle playing A does not sound like a trumpet playing the same note. But solid state electronic sounds can be made to approach pure frequency sounds. But that sounds sterile, hollow, and cold to us. Tube amps can add some harmonics and tasteful distortion that sounds "warmer" to us, meaning more like some kind of acoustic instrument with its overtones.

Jody Carver · Post by **Jody Carver** » 5 Feb 2003 2:46 pm

I beleive I was the first musician to develop
the "Brown Sound". It was during my first ever recording session at RCA Victor Records
in Manhattan with Perry Como.

I was handed my chart and when Mitchell Ayres
23 piece band started to play,I was scared to death.

I was not able to play my part. The arranger came over and asked me what was wrong? I said nothing,he said,please stand up.

I said I cant,he said Why?? I said I am so nervous I had an accident,he said what kind?
I said I have the "Brown Sound"

He said
OK leave it in and take it from the top. I had no choice but to "leave it in"

I was able to finish the session with a new
change of clothes

.

And here I am today,no one realizing it was me who created the "Brown Sound"

edited,I meant not to offend anyone,but someone e mailed me and said what I posted was in poor taste.I didnt want to delete what
I posted as I know most of you have read what I posted and didnt want to call your attention to what I wrote.

If I offended any of you,I'm sorry,that was not my intention,but that was a true story.

And I like "tube amps" best.They sound warm to me and those tubes get mighty warm as well

Thanks.[This message was edited by Jody Carver on 05 February 2003 at 05:35 PM.]

Jim Smith · Post by **Jim Smith** » 5 Feb 2003 2:51 pm

I bet it was warm too, huh!

Mark Ardito · Post by **Mark Ardito** » 5 Feb 2003 4:16 pm

Yes, in Physics tubes (or "warmth") is actually DISTORTION! Tubes add more 2nd level harmonics to the frequencies of music instruments. Some people find that very pleasing and some people really enjoy SolidState amps. I prefer tubes, but I do not call them warm. I am with b0b on this one and find them bright over solid state amps.

Mark

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Sho~Bud Pro I, Fender D-8 (C6&E13) http://www.darkmagneto.com

Reggie Duncan · Post by **Reggie Duncan** » 5 Feb 2003 4:52 pm

I am amazed that some the comments are apparently the exact opposite of each other!
When doing a mixdown, I process the final mix through a tube effect I thought warmed the sound. It seems to take off the edge, compress and fatten the sound. I associate tubes with warmth, and solid state with cold.
Maybe I need a hearing aid!

Jack Francis · Post by **Jack Francis** » 5 Feb 2003 7:52 pm