push pull pickup change outs

Steven Welborn · Post by **Steven Welborn** » 20 Oct 2003 5:56 pm

Who's changed out their original pickups on their p/p's. What did you change to and for what reason. Did your axe have that sound before and after? I'm particulary curious about those Trutones. Thanks.

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 20 Oct 2003 6:21 pm

Steve,

Interesting you should ask. I was one of the one's who did NOT have "that" sound on my '69 Emmons P/P. Never did have it until two days before I shipped it; after I had sold it on this forum.

I felt bad about shipping a guitar I KNEW did not have the sound that the buyer was probably expecting. Suddenly I realized that my dear friend Mac Atcheson had given me a pair of pu's to try years before. I never felt they would make any difference so I never replaced them.

But I said, "just maybe". So I yanked the originals out, put the other two in. And I had the shock of my life. THERE was the sound. 20 yrs I had that guitar. Never cared for the sound. I could not believe it. But there it was.

I could have backed out of the deal. But that would NOT have been right. So I shipped it with THAT sound. And may Jesus richly bless the lucky person who got it. It had 10 and 12!

carl

Steven Welborn · Post by **Steven Welborn** » 20 Oct 2003 6:38 pm

Those are pretty stout principals. Must of been difficult shippin that sound off. BTW, what pickups were those if you can remember Carl?

Larry Bell · Post by **Larry Bell** » 20 Oct 2003 7:06 pm

I'll bet dollars to doughnuts it was a single coil.

The only pickup I'd replace mine with is another single coil. TrueTone works great.

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Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 21 Oct 2003 4:15 am

Steve,

The originals were around 14k ohms (single coil). The ones that gave "that" sound were around 19K single coil. Interestingly, when I posted this info sometime back on this forum, several prominent P/P guru's indicated that in no way could PU's give "that" sound.

It is conceivable that I do not know what "that" sound is. But replacing those pu's made a world of difference in what I had always heard and NEVER cared for. So in any case, I would never have sold the guitar had I EVER gotten the sound I got with the replacement pu's.

"Ve grrrrruuuu tuu soont oldt und tuu late schmart"

carl

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 21 Oct 2003 1:07 pm

I've got a '66 bolt-on push/pull. They say it's the benchmark standard for Emmons tone. George L's even make's a pickup called the E-66 as an attempt to make a humbucker that sounds similar to the stock '66 pickup (mine is wound to 15.5kOhm DCR). There's nothing like that original pickup in there. Magic tone. However, I have a number of gigs that are full of neon lights and dimmers and the hum is unbearable. So I've tried some humbuckers. Tried the Lawrence L-710 and it's too clean and hot sounding. Tried a L-910 and it's too dark, not enough sparkle. Tried the E-66 and have settled on that. It's a pretty nice sounding pickup. It's not the same as the single coil, but nothing is. But, it really sounds sweet and it helps the Emmons sound like an Emmons should. It really brings out that Emmons p/p "cry".

To me, tone is in the hands and in the guitar. The pickup is more like a microphone. You can put 10 different mic's in front of a singer and it will always sound like that singer. You pick the mic that helps enhance the strengths of the singer's voice. Same for pickps in my book. The pickup will not change the timbre or overtone structure of the guitar but it will help to bring out it's best characteristics. So far the E-66 is the winner for both my '66 and '69 push/pulls. I want to try a True-Tone but it's a single coil and it will hum. I've heard nothing but raves about Jerry's pickups.

Jay Dee Maness uses an old Danny Shields "Craptrap" and his tone is great in his old p/p. I think those pickups are rare. Anyone tried a L-705 in a p/p?

Brad Sarno

Larry Bell · Post by **Larry Bell** » 21 Oct 2003 1:24 pm

Brad,
I've found the TrueTone to be much less prone to 60Hz than any other single coil I've ever used. The 'scatter winding' process that Jerry uses seems to make a difference. Might be worth a try, but some places just aren't conducive to s/c pickups. I haven't put one in the Beast yet, but the one in the Fessy has never exhibited any hum, either in the studio or at gigs. I found the same thing you found with the BL pickups, but never tried the E66.

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Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps

Jim Smith · Post by **Jim Smith** » 21 Oct 2003 1:27 pm

I want to try a True-Tone but it's a single coil and it will hum.

Surprisingly, they don't hum!

I was skeptical before I got mine, but you owe it to yourself to try them. I think you'll be hooked.

Frank Parish · Post by **Frank Parish** » 21 Oct 2003 2:50 pm

I bought my 66 bolt-on and had the BL 710's put in so they were in there when I first played it. I liked the sound and played it for about a year and one half. I then put the original single coils in and it's much better now. The E9 is 15.2 and the C6 is 16.5 and it's just great. If I were to ever change them it would be the JW singles coils to be sure.

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 21 Oct 2003 3:40 pm

Thanks for the advice on the True-Tone. I had heard that they're less prone to hum. I gotta try one!

Brad Sarno

Jody Carver · Post by **Jody Carver** » 25 Oct 2003 3:21 pm

E 66 is the route to go.

Larry Moore · Post by **Larry Moore** » 29 Oct 2003 9:35 pm

Steven, I replaced the Pickups on my 67 PP several years ago with a later year model some where early 90's LeGrande about 19.5K on both necks. I think it sounds a lot better has a bigger fatter sound than the originals 14.4K
Larry

James Quackenbush · Post by **James Quackenbush** » 30 Oct 2003 6:39 am

I have experimented very little with Jerry's TrueTones, but the 17.5 k that he reccomends for the E9 and the 18.5 that he reccomends for the C6 seem to work very well in a D-10....I also tried a 18.9 k in an S-10 that I had..It gave a decent mid and bottom, but lost some of the sparkle of the single coil..All my other TrueTones have been 17.5 k for the E9...I'm gonna drop down to 15.5 on my next pickup from Jerry
Your highs decrease as the power of the pickup increases...I think that the midway point is the 17.5k that Jerry has so wisely picked for the E9 is a great mid way tone between the lows and highs.. Everyone has their own idea of what they want tone wise, but for me the Emmons is a steel that let's harmonics fly around easily, and is an airy sounding steel, therefore I'm not looking for it to be "FAT" with tone nessisarily...I'm looking for that tone that cuts thru and has that sweet cry to it !!...YMMV....Jim

Mark van Allen · Post by **Mark van Allen** » 30 Oct 2003 8:40 am

It seems obious that what really suits one guitar pickup-wise may not be the answer for the next guitar. But it's expensive and time consuming to experiment! I replaced the E-66 and 10-1 in my Carter with Truetones, and was totally knocked out by the difference in tonal quality. On that particular guitar at least there's no question in my mind that the Truetones give much superior output in several areas. I wouldn't be surprised if the same were true for other Carters, and other guitars in general. (They do seem to have a very small noticeable hum characteristic, when the volume pedal's wide open, but so far it's not been a problem). But here's my quandry- I recently got a nice Legrande II with factory Emmons Humbuckers. I was sure I'd be wanting to replace those with Truetones, but every time I play the guitar, I'm knocked out by the tone, especially in recording sessions, very clean and clear, nice low end, beautiful up the neck. And of course no hum (big deal on sessions). Anybody else have these in their guitar? It's a lot to go through to get two new pickups, de-string, de-solder, resolder, restring, to see if it gets "a little better". No brainer on a crappy sounding guitar, but the Emmons already sounds great. Hmm. Of course, if I'd just spent another four grand I suppose I could have a neat little door and just slide a new pickup in to check it out- that would be nice... ;o

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Stop by the Steel Store at: www.markvanallen.com
[This message was edited by Mark van Allen on 30 October 2003 at 08:42 AM.]

Steven Welborn · Post by **Steven Welborn** » 30 Oct 2003 9:03 am

Same quandery exactly Mike. By no means am I dissatiafied with the tone of my P/P. But I sure would like to hear an A/B'er with the Truetones. Maybe some day when Im all caught up and looking for something to do.