Volume pedal

Tony LaCroix · Post by **Tony LaCroix** » 14 Jul 2003 5:27 am

I finally started using a volume pedal, and so far, I don't like it. Doesn't it move when you're engaging your knee levers? It's keeping me from concentrating on my practicing. Do any of you guys play without one? Or maybe set it off to the side, so that your foot isn't always on it?

Thanks

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 14 Jul 2003 6:41 am

The only levers you should be involved with with your volume pedal leg are the right and left knee levers. Nothing up and down. You really have to get used to using the foot volume control as it is indispensible when playing a steel guitar.
Erv

Bob Carlson · Post by **Bob Carlson** » 14 Jul 2003 7:04 am

A lot of that "Sound" comes from the vol pedal. Gotta get used to using it.

Bob

Tony LaCroix · Post by **Tony LaCroix** » 14 Jul 2003 7:14 am

So why don't 6-string players usually use one? I can see the value of being able to adjust the volume quickly and do swells, but for music outside of the country ballad realm, I don't see why I'd want to change the volume of each chord I play. Why not a knob instead of a constant pedal? I'm not trying to challenge convention here; I'm just wondering if the use of a volume pedal isn't particular to Country and Swing music. My leanings are towards Rock n roll and blues.

Is there anybody out there not using one?

Tony Orth · Post by **Tony Orth** » 14 Jul 2003 8:23 am

There are several uses.

1. Expression (feel)
2. Sustain
3. Change volume from backup to solo work
4. Get above the lead guitarist when he's playing too loud.

Tony

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 14 Jul 2003 9:01 am

Sometimes you just don't have a hand available to adjust volume. The use of a foot volume pedal isn't just limited to country or swing music. It originated with Hawaiian. I learned on this kind of music and always used a volume pedal. It is very necessary when doing harmonics. If you flub and miss the harmonic, you can deaden it in a heartbeat but if you're lucky enough to get it to ring out, you can emphasize it with a volume swell.
Now don't argue! Just learn to use it!
Erv[This message was edited by Erv Niehaus on 14 July 2003 at 10:04 AM.]

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 14 Jul 2003 9:14 am

The problem with the volume pedal, when used by some guitar players,(and some steelplayers)is that often they don't understand it's purpose.

Some of them equate the steel sound with 50 year old saturday afternoon movies. They play a chord and then "swell" it to infinity...like in the old Gene Autrey movies of 50 years ago....that "ain't" what it is supposed to do!
www,genejones.com [This message was edited by Gene Jones on 14 July 2003 at 04:24 PM.]

Tony LaCroix · Post by **Tony LaCroix** » 14 Jul 2003 9:15 am

OK OK!!! If a fellow Minnesotan insists, then I give up, I'll learn to use the darn thing...sheeesh...

Tony LaCroix · Post by **Tony LaCroix** » 14 Jul 2003 9:17 am

I mean oofda.

Rex Thomas · Post by **Rex Thomas** » 14 Jul 2003 9:47 am

Tony Orth: I ESPECIALLY like #4.

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 14 Jul 2003 9:48 am

Among regular guitarists, John McLaughlin, Steve Morse and Eric Johnson use volume pedals in their setups - not too bad company to be keeping.

Tony LaCroix · Post by **Tony LaCroix** » 14 Jul 2003 9:59 am

Good point, David. The guilty truth is that I use a volume pedal for regular guitar when playing quiet music. However, I've been exploring blues and rock on the steel- not exactly quiet music. I think I need to get out and watch how some of the great steel players around here use the volume pedal.[This message was edited by Tony LaCroix on 14 July 2003 at 10:59 AM.]

Carl West · Post by **Carl West** » 14 Jul 2003 11:03 am

Tony, keep at it, you'll love it but it will take some getting use to.
I couldn't do with a volume pedal. The advantages far greater than you can imagine.

Carl West
Emmons LaGrande

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 14 Jul 2003 1:12 pm

Tony,
Where are you from in Minnesota?
Erv

Tony LaCroix · Post by **Tony LaCroix** » 14 Jul 2003 1:58 pm

Born and raised in Plainview, Erv. Missing it right now...

LARRY COLE · Post by **LARRY COLE** » 14 Jul 2003 1:59 pm

To me the volume pedal is as much a part of the sound of pedal steel as reverb and most of the knee levers.

------------------
Playing For JESUS,LC. WILLIAMS U12, SHO-BUD PRO1,CARVIN TL60

Jerry Overstreet · Post by **Jerry Overstreet** » 14 Jul 2003 6:02 pm

Hi Tony, there has been some discussion on this subject in the past...About a year ago, I believe....search the Pedal Steel board archives reference "alternative volume controller". Lew Houston had a Lamar pedal steel that had the volume control on top....he operated it using his pinky.
I think you'll find that 99% of pedal steel pickers use a foot volume control.
That doesn't mean you have to....
The guitar players that I jam with on Fri. nite use foot volume controls...
Whatever works....I'm just a weekend
warrior picker so consider that....but
personally, I don't like a foot volume control on 6 string guitar. I also get to use my "cat can", tuned to open D or E, on some rock and blues tunes and I have installed a vol. control on it ala the 6 string guitar,but NEVER run it through the foot volume...FWIW....nor do I on slide or 6 string.
Best of luck with whatever you decide!
And, oh yeah, be sure and read Mr. Reece Anderson's Expression Pedal post over on the Steel Players board

[This message was edited by Jerry Overstreet on 14 July 2003 at 07:11 PM.]

LARRY COLE · Post by **LARRY COLE** » 14 Jul 2003 6:23 pm

Tony here is a thread about the pedal. Read Jody Carfers second reply.t's kinda long but he nails it about as good as anyone can.
[link]http://steelguitarforum.com/Forum15/HTML/004378.html[/link]
------------------
Playing For JESUS,LC. WILLIAMS U12, SHO-BUD PRO1,CARVIN TL60

[This message was edited by LARRY COLE on 14 July 2003 at 07:24 PM.]

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 14 Jul 2003 9:22 pm

Yes, necessary is right. In the very early days when playing a lot of Hawaiian Music we always called it the "Expression Pedal". as Reece mentioned on his post. Good post...al

------------------
[url=http://www.cmedic.net/~almarcu ... ~almarcus/ [/url]

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 14 Jul 2003 11:17 pm

I don't use a volume pedal in my regular practice setup through a little mixer with headphones. I'm fairly new at this pedal steel thing, and I think that for me it's most important to concentrate on right hand technique, tone and the pedals. However, I'm already very familiar with volume pedals, reverb, distortion and so forth from 30+ years of standard guitar, so I can usually "dial in" the effects I like and get pretty close without too much fiddling for performance. Like you (Tony) I'm not that interested in conventional country playing, but you've got to admit these guys have mega-chops to spare and have already figured out a lot of things that don't need to be figured out twice.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 15 Jul 2003 2:00 am

Another Tony chimeing in..

I think what our pal Gene said above is closest to reality.

It is a volume pedal, yes..but it's not really used for volume..does that make sense.

When we play fills and rides we don't slam the dang thing to the floor but we do gently use it to add sustain and dynamics. Or at least we are supposed to..

The correct (stage) volume level I believe should be set where your foot is most comfortable, probably half way or a little more, whatever works for you.

If a player (or the rest of the band)is getting "motion sickness" from the volume pedal, take it away and set your foot right on the floor. Practice like this until you are comfortable with your right knee lever changes and then bring the pedal back into the mix. If you need to raise your right foot cut a small 8 inch piece of 2X4 and put it where the volume pedal goes and use that during your practice sessions. Just don't try to plug anything into it.

Ain't no way the volume is gonna change with a piece of 2x4 under your foot.

This topic never goes away as it is one of the most difficult steps to conquer with the Steel. I hope to conquer it myself in the next decade.

Oh yeh..Most six string players don't use a volume pedal becasue they would have no excuse to turn the volume down ! And they ( me included here) have little round volume knobs that they are supposed to use right there next to the little finger..thats why it's there.. most six stringers have those little knobs on their axes for looks.

Tony P ( not Tony Palmer)

[This message was edited by Tony Prior on 15 July 2003 at 03:07 AM.]

Johan Jansen · Post by **Johan Jansen** » 15 Jul 2003 2:59 am

Tony,I guess the name for a volumepedal in use with a pedalsteel should have been expression-pedal.See the importancy of using it at the same level as playing with fingerpicks or not. Try to master it.
try to pick a string with your pedal 1/4 th open.use the pedal to let the tone sustain at the same level.
A lot of beginners on steel have difficulties to get behind this simple excersize, but it's one of the basic things you should get in your system.
If you like to listen to the real master in using volume-pedal,listen to Curly Chalker. He uses the pedal to emulate a hornsection or a Hammond.What he could do with it is from another planet.JJ

------------------

Click on the pic!

[This message was edited by Johan Jansen on 15 July 2003 at 04:02 AM.]