Newer instrumentals and the ISGC ?

Dustin Rigsby · Post by **Dustin Rigsby** » 27 Jan 2014 12:42 am

Somehow I ended up reading a thread earlier where some folks were saying that they didn't want to hear " a way to survive " and "cheating heart" at the ISGC. My question is to the 20 somethings - 40 somethings, what newer-ish songs would you like to hear as instrumentals ? No holds barred....let 'er rip, I'm eager to see some responses !

Craig Schwartz · Post by **Craig Schwartz** » 27 Jan 2014 6:48 am

APACHE as a suggetion once a day

How about a song list with each player for starters
I want to hear what this guitar can do also.

I love the songs you mentioned alot, even though I`m not from that beautiful era, But I don`t want to hear each song more than once a day, I dont mind doing penance. But man I`ve been there and I`ve seen that happen more than once. "BORING" Man I cant wait to get out of there sometimes. everything starts to sound the same and it gets in your head and leaves a bad taste.

I will say that They`re all impressive players and I want to see them play and spend time and money with alot of them and the vendors, just dont kill me with the same music over and over. I will choose not to go, It needs to be loosened up a bit and let the vendors make some thumbs up money. Don`t loose your vendors especially Doug Jernigan.

I am not directing this statement at anyone in particular, Its Just my own cruel self venting in a gone crazy America.

Peace and God Bless

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 27 Jan 2014 7:04 am

Hearing the same song from different players doesn't bother me. They usually have their own interpretation of the song, so even though its the same song it is "different".

The issue with what instruments or instrumentals comes down to what audience do you want. For example, I'm in the old school (old farts) category and went to my first ISGC in 1978. If I had to listen to "modern" music with distorted guitars it would not interest me and I wouldn't go.

Ray Harrison · Post by **Ray Harrison** » 27 Jan 2014 7:40 am

While playing bass at the Texas and Phoenix shows, I've heard "Borrowed Angel" 17 times in one weekend. I know that the talented steel players we see and hear know and have the ability to play a wider variety of material than some of these.
I understand that there are standards that the crowd will want to hear, but if the player ahead of you plays a song, can't you substitute another song if it is also on your list.

Bill Moran · Post by **Bill Moran** » 27 Jan 2014 8:40 am

Now days if you have seen one steel show you have seen them all. We have lost most of the great players. Now that Jeff, Hal, Jimmy, John and more are gone and Buddy has retired no one can fill there shoe's.
We still have Paul, Tommy, Lloyd and a few more but they only make 1 out of 100 shows. Just glad I was here to take it all in.
Do you guys think history will repeat it's self ? LOL

Wally Moyers · Post by **Wally Moyers** » 27 Jan 2014 8:46 am

Ray Montee (RIP) · Post by **Ray Montee (RIP)** » 27 Jan 2014 9:52 am

I attended my first steel show back in 1978, Scotty's Int'l Show.

I must've heard the "GIRL from EEEEPPPANEEEMAHHH"
1,000 times at that convention. I never want to hear it again!

I'd rather hear four or five players, playing no more than four or five tunes each........each of which is exciting to hear, pleasant to hum along with, and enough originality to make it worth while to listen to.

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 27 Jan 2014 11:02 am

Invite Gary Carter, Joe Goldmark, Mike Perlowin, Jim Cohen, Bruce Kaphan, Dave Easley, Debashish Bhattacharya, Daniel Lanois and Dan Tyack and I seriously doubt if you'd get to hear "Steel Guitar Rag", "Mansion on a Hill" or "Sleepwalk."

Maybe Robert Randolph or Susan Alcorn would come play it for you....

Wally Taylor · Post by **Wally Taylor** » 27 Jan 2014 12:08 pm

I think Zane King would be a breath of fresh air.

Dustin Rigsby · Post by **Dustin Rigsby** » 27 Jan 2014 12:14 pm

Now were drifting off topic. I didn't want to solicit complaints about shows....I wanted to solicit instrumental ideas ! Songs fellas, interesting songs that maybe you've never heard in this format that you'd like to hear.....

Dustin Rigsby · Post by **Dustin Rigsby** » 27 Jan 2014 12:17 pm

Zane is challenging folks to get outside the box !

Danny Letz · Post by **Danny Letz** » 27 Jan 2014 4:29 pm

Tommy Dodd will play you some different stuff.

Ed Heins · Post by **Ed Heins** » 27 Jan 2014 4:53 pm

I'm just starting to waddle through this instrument, and find it so much more versatile than I expected. I listened to Sarah Jory do "Last Horizon" on youtube, and man it brought goosebumps. I love classic country as well, but I agree there's more to play than "Faded Love" (although I truly love that as well)

David Shepack · Post by **David Shepack** » 28 Jan 2014 4:37 am

Ray, so sorry to be contradicting you AGAIN.
I did Girl From Ipanema at a Bluegrass festival. They loved it. People were either laughing, giving me a thumbs up, or looking at me like I was a genius. I don't remember ever hearing that song at a Bluegrass event before or since.
Our paths in life are so different, there must be a lesson there somewhere

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 28 Jan 2014 2:42 pm

Playing different stuff can be a two-edged sword. On one hand, it shows you can play the "out of the box" stuff. But on the other, a lot of the older crowd may not care for it. I've seen some players walk out of the ISGC when Chalker played, and a couple did the same when Wally Murphy started really crankin'. (No, they weren't just going to the men's room - they were vocal about "Not wanting to hear that crap".)

When I played regularly, I'd do "out of the box" stuff sometimes by playing songs that everyone knew, but that you'd never heard on steel - TV themes! Though we had good arrangements on some songs, we never did "charts". Shows like "Dick Van Dyke Show", "I Dream Of Jeannie", "The Andy Griffith Show", and the "Tonight Show" all had themes that were cute...and easy to play on the spur of the moment, because all the musicians I played with were great ear-players.

Joe B. Long · Post by **Joe B. Long** » 28 Jan 2014 7:38 pm

I love the older shuffles and big band swing stuff on steel, but would enjoy hearing something "out of the box." Sitting here I can't come up with a tune just off the cuff, but there is some good music being written and arranged these days.

Mike Neer · Post by **Mike Neer** » 28 Jan 2014 7:42 pm

I only have four words: Buddy Emmons Mardi Gras.

Buddy killed it and they loved it, at least from what I can hear on the tape.

Dustin Rigsby · Post by **Dustin Rigsby** » 28 Jan 2014 8:26 pm

Donny this is what I'm talking about ! Theme songs are fun. What about a song like "feels so right" by Alabama or maybe even "Jessica" by the Allman Brothers. I'm not a jazz nor western swing aficionado, but understand that rock n roll might turn off a lot of the older crowd. I recall seeing a vid of Sara Jory doing an ABBA medley and thought that was cool. Not too far off of the beaten path,but,it's not "a way to survive" either. Don't get me wrong, I love classic country.I was just trying to make a point. Something different,yet beautiful at the same time.

Jim Palenscar · Post by **Jim Palenscar** » 29 Jan 2014 7:22 am

The Phoenix show is alive w non-standard stuff- Skip Edwards doing Lloyd Price's "Personality", Boo Bernstein doing some Latin favorites, and Doug Livingston playing Bach or Chet Atkins are 3 that come to mind - it is truly a show not to be missed as every year there are wonderful surprises and the special moments are numerous.

Keith Hilton · Post by **Keith Hilton** » 29 Jan 2014 8:23 am

I have played many steel gutiar shows. I have played Scotty's big show in St.Louis two times. I was the first player on the first Texas steel show Charlie Norris started. I can explain why you hear some of the same songs over and over. Even a 3 chord country song can be complicated if the band does not know it. To avoid a train "wreck", players pick songs they think the band will know. If you bring your own band you can play complex new songs, and hope the audience likes new material. So for the player on a steel show, picking material means avoiding a disaster. Just my opinion.

Joe Casey · Post by **Joe Casey** » 29 Jan 2014 10:35 am

It's so very true that the audience that continues to attend yearly ,faithfully,truly can't get enough of the Shuffles and Traditional Country and are not very receptive to most other genres. But as the age of the crowd grows, the crowd gets smaller. Replacements are hard to come by. Really great players are limited to only playing what any crowd relates too. Thus at times limiting their talents for showcase. If I have my choice I love to hear it all even though I'm bone ass Country and myself stuck in a time warp. When I had my bands I lost good players because they wanted to be more than a fill in Steel player and I always looked for material to let them Honk.. I don't care for and don't listen to the new so called Country, But I do listen to good Music such as Jazz, Good old Rock and Roll and popular music like the Sinatra /Niel Diamond stuff. Even Neil had a Steel in his shows. The Steel guitar is more than a one Genre instrument although no other fits true Country as a Steel does.T.A.I.S.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 29 Jan 2014 2:42 pm

Dustin Rigsby wrote: I recall seeing a vid of Sara Jory doing an ABBA medley and thought that was cool. Not too far off of the beaten path,but,it's not "a way to survive" either.

Dustin, back in the '80s, our group did some really far-out stuff, even for a kickass country band (think: Travis Tritt). Songs like "Movin' Out" by Billy Joel, "One In A Million You" by Lionel Ritchie, "No Matter What" by Badfinger, and "Just A Gigolo" by Louis Prima kept the young crowd jumpin', while the Hag, Jennings, and Don Williams songs gave the older crowd a chance to relate and dance. We did such an on-and-off variety that our audience knew that if they didn't like what we were playing, we'd be doing something different in a few minutes.

I think the key to mass appeal is variety.

Rudy Hawk · Post by **Rudy Hawk** » 29 Jan 2014 6:18 pm

I believe Keith nailed it. Trying any song (old or new)not widely known is a big risk if the band says there're not familier with it. We shouldn't expect the each band at most of these shows to know everything out there. Without any chance to rehearse with the band its a tough call, with everyone watching.IMHO

Bill Cunningham · Post by **Bill Cunningham** » 30 Jan 2014 4:28 am

Mike Neer wrote:I only have four words: Buddy Emmons Mardi Gras.

Buddy killed it and they loved it, at least from what I can hear on the tape.

Yes but Mike, is that really "newer"? That was in 1977, almost 40 years ago!

I will never forget St. Louis in either 1985 or 1987. Paul Franklin, Brent Mason, David Hungate et al played a well arranged killer set of modern jazz. (Chick Corea's Spain, Paul's Tune 88, The Wiz, etc) I was really loving every note until I was interrupted by an elderly blue haired lady behind me who said "I wish they would get off there. Everything they do sounds the same. They need to get another one of of those good Hawaiian players back up there". Well flame me but I would not last 10 minutes listening to Hawaiian even if Jerry Byrd returned from the grave to play it. It's just not my thing.

How to broaden the audience at the shows and promote the participation is a very interesting challenge. I also don't think the average 25 year old is going to get very excited about steel guitar hearing one of their own recycle Weldon, Lloyd, et al. It is not what their ears are looking for.

Jim Cohen · Post by **Jim Cohen** » 30 Jan 2014 5:39 am

I've given this a lot of thought over the years and, honestly, I don't think you can get there from here. I think the next generation(s), if they are at all interested in an instrumental-oriented "steel show" format (which may not be the case at all), will have to create their own, because the organizers of the current shows (a) aren't going to risk their base (which is fragile enough) to include enough of the new stuff to reach critical mass to attract that younger audience to the show; and (b) don't follow that music enough (if at all) to know who's out there to even invite. The younger guys and gals who come to the present steel shows tend to be (almost by definition) "steel guitar geeks" (like us!) who especially like retro music styles, so they're cool with the shows, but there aren't enough of them coming to fuel the shows into the next half century.

So what do we do? Let the shows die on the vine? I think Dallas and Phoenix are doing relatively well and Phoenix is attracting an LA-based bunch of players who mostly don't get heard at other steel shows and who tend to have quite eclectic tastes within a range that doesn't turn off the country die-hards (or at least not for long). Phoenix has always welcomed musical diversity. Dallas is more 'mainstream' musically (centered on country and western swing, with some occasional jazz or pop) but seems to have a loyal following, perhaps in part due to the broadening range of mini-seminars happening. This creates a different form of interest that keeps people coming back for more. IMHO, it's got to be somewhat - but not totally - different every year, to maintain interest and keep people coming back.

But as for the "younger generation(s)", unless they're steel-geeks, I think they're gonna have to create their own, if they want one. Kind of like the "sacred steel" shows: Having a few SS players on the main stage at any of the mainstream shows would be great and would expose a lot more folks to this style, some of whom would really dig it, and some of whom would probably walk out (just as they did on Paul Franklin, as Bill described above). And, having just a few SS players on the program buried in a mix of standard country and western swing will not be enough critical mass to attract the SS audience beyond a few local friends of the players themselves. So they had to create their own show, with critical mass that, from what I hear, gets a great reception with a lot of interest and energy. That's what the youngin's need to do to... if they even want any kind of a "steel show" which, as mentioned previously, may be a dubious proposition.

The Steel Guitar Forum

Newer instrumentals and the ISGC ?

Newer instrumentals and the ISGC ?

Bacl in 1978............

We're drifting off topic !

Donny is getting warmer

Re: Donny is getting warmer