Cma11 Tuning

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 7:11 pm

Cma11 Tuning

High to Low
F D B G E C

Low To High
C E G B D F

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 11 Aug 2013 8:09 pm

"C Tuning" for the 6 string lap steel. CEGBDF

That looks more like Cmaj11 or Cmaj11 add9

Mike Ihde · Post by **Mike Ihde** » 11 Aug 2013 8:58 pm

If it's low to high, it's Cmaj7/9 add 11 if it's the other way, it's G13 add11.

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 9:06 pm

Yea, I wrestled with different names. As I thought about it, how many times have I played a Cmaj11add9 chord, or Cmaj9sus or whatever you call it? I think never. The chord has inherent void tones. The sus (1st string) conflicts with the 3rd (5th string).
Since the tuning has all the notes of the C major scale except "A:, I thought it more fitting to call it "C Diatonic Tuning". I didn't feel comfortable naming the tuning by a dysfunctional chord.
In the end you can call it whatever you want. The name is abratary.

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 9:09 pm

It's Also.
Dmi6,9,11
We can go all day with names. That's why I call it the "C Diatonic Tuning".

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 11 Aug 2013 9:16 pm

...I call it the "C Tuning".

Problem is... it's not a C tuning.

Why don't you call it C/Bdim ? A combination tuning, like Jerry's C6/A7 tuning. The bottom 3 strings are a C chord and the top 3 strings are Bdim. "C/Bdim" won't make sense to other musicians but at least the steel players will know that it's a combination tuning.

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 9:23 pm

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 9:34 pm

One of the things that also made me think to just call it a "C Diatonic Tuning" is that you get all these chords from the key of C with the open strings.

C - 654
Cmaj7 - 6543
Cmaj9 - 65432

Dmi6,9,11 654321

Emi - 543
Emi7 - 5432

G - 432
G7 - 4321

Am911 65432

Bdim - 321

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 9:42 pm

The slash chord is a good idea! C/Bdim. I like that a lot better than Cmaj9sus or whatever...

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 11 Aug 2013 9:43 pm

Since the tuning has all the notes of the C major scale except "A", I thought it more fitting to call it "C Tuning".

Since you're looking at it as a scale based tuning, you should probably call it C Diatonic.

Jerry's C Diatonic tuning also has the notes of the C major scale except for D (2nd or 9th). He said he tried adding the D, but it seemed to get in the way so he omitted it. He still referred to it as Diatonic.

I think his 7 string version was like this:

1 E
2 C
3 B
4 A
5 G
6 F
7 E

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 9:45 pm

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 9:48 pm

The funny thing is I see it as a chordal based tuning. I made the tuning to maximize my chord possibilities.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 11 Aug 2013 9:48 pm

What I'm saying is those notes do not spell out a C chord. Steel guitar tunings are defined by the chord they spell out. Unless they are Diatonic.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 11 Aug 2013 9:49 pm

Yes, absolutely, there are also many chord possibilities with a scale based tuning.

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 9:52 pm

Ahhh. Now I see what your saying. GOOD POINT! Ok Doug, you just renamed the tuning to C Diatonic Tuning.

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 9:53 pm

I changed the the first post.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 11 Aug 2013 9:54 pm

Yeah, I think that's the best way to go. Problem solved!

Diatonic tunings offer a lot of beautiful sounds, but they're not as user friendly as some other tunings. They require more selective picking of the strings, string skipping, less strumming across the strings. Have fun with it.

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 10:02 pm

Is there a way to delete this whole thread?

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 11 Aug 2013 10:09 pm

You can edit the Title and that might make more sense. Or you could ask the administrator to delete the entire thread. Sometimes they do that. Actually, I like this thread! It's kind of interesting, and maybe other members have more thoughts to add.

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 11 Aug 2013 10:27 pm

Thank you!

Guy Cundell · Post by **Guy Cundell** » 12 Aug 2013 1:10 am

I would call the tuning C tertian (or chordal) as it is the C scale laid out in thirds as opposed to Byrd's tuning which is fundamentally secundal or scalear. There are lots of interesting slant options and a cool symmetrical harmonisation of the major scale as one of the videos shows.

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 12 Aug 2013 7:51 am

Tertian is new term for me. It is no doubt the most accurate way to describe the tuning. Unfortunately is also not a very well know term. I think it would confuse more people than anything.
I'm trying to figure out how to pronounce it? I think I will use this term if I ever teach this tuning to anyone.
Thank you Guy. I need some to time to process this (new to me) term.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 12 Aug 2013 9:37 am

I've been noodling with this tuning today and it has a lot of possibilities. I tuned my C6 down to B diatonic so I would break any strings. The same intervals as your C diatonic, just 1/2 step lower.

I experimented with JBs C diatonic a couple of years ago, and that that too has a lot to offer, but I could never really warm up to that tuning. Too much string skipping IMO. This one seems a little more user friendly.

Steve Cunningham · Post by **Steve Cunningham** » 12 Aug 2013 10:04 am

Cool tuning...I've been doing the same thing as Doug, messing with the tuning down a half step, and really like it. Thanks Mike!

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 12 Aug 2013 4:04 pm

When I first discovered the tuning I used Bb Diatonic (Whole step down from current tuning). What I found was the open Bbmaj7 of Bbmaj9 chord was a bit muddy for my taste.
Did you guys find the video and the pdf doc you can download from video youtube pages helpful?

I'm glad you guys like it! I have felt very alone in the world with this tuning.

FYI Stuff..

I have a 23" scale lap steel. Here are the string I use. I order singles from juststrings.com to make the set.

String Gauges
Daddario Plain Steel and Chromes Flat Wounds
1F-Plain Steel .013
2D-Plain Steel .015
3B-Plain Steel .019
4G-Flat Wound .024
5E-Flat Wound .028
6C-Flat Wound .035