Letter To My Band

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 21 Oct 2007 6:46 am

For the short time I've been playing with these young guys (mid 20's) Banjo Jack we have played four shows and there were issues with the drummer's gear each time. Some of the gigs required the two other guys who are roommates at whose apartment we practice to haul the rehearsal room drum-set to the gig---the drummer lives on the far reaches of the city and has no wheels. Other gigs used a house kit that required the drummer to carry his own misc. stuff---an email to the venue would answer the question of 'what do I need to bring', just as my email to them has answered questions like 'is the back line twin reverb on your web site going to be there when I play there next Saturday?'---simple due diligence.
So after a show last night without a snare drum (the bass player was supposed to bring the rehearsal room snare but forgot), here is the letter that I am about to send:
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Sh*t happens. I expect to give and receive understanding if there is a rare equipment problem or oversight at a gig. Chronic equipment problems, whether something is busted or it simply failed to be at the show are simply slack, lazy and not giving a lotta f**k.
I DO NOT WANT TO HEAR A SINGLE WORD about why there was a problem on any of these occasions and I don't want to hear about who didn't say, remind, or check or double check what. None of that matters at all.
It looks like the only way to make sure that everyone has taken care of their responsibilities is for me to make sure of it. And that will not happen. I've got enough to do to cover my own equipment needs and haulage.

I'm not getting together for another rehearsal, let alone a gig, unless I hear something that tells me that everyone gets it. An attempt to get me to 'understand' any one of these incidences, to point out that there was a circumstance beyond someone's (or everyone's) control will be indication that what I'm saying is not understood at all.

This is a junior high school level of professionalism. I saw it, lived it, and got past it back then. I'm sure as hell not returning to those glory days.

--JL

<hr><hr><hr><hr>
Anyone been there, done this?
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Let me add----I play with these guys because I dig the music. How much? I guess we will see, won't we?

Mike Kowalik · Post by **Mike Kowalik** » 21 Oct 2007 7:44 am

If I were you...I'd move on!!

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 21 Oct 2007 8:16 am

Good enough chance of that. I've added the following lines:

If this is an issue that doesn't bother anyone else in the band all that much, we probably can't work this out.

It bores the hell out of me to be the heavy. I'm not interested in being in a situation that calls on me to have to be.

Barry Blackwood · Post by **Barry Blackwood** » 21 Oct 2007 9:16 am

Yeah, definitely time for a new band ....

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 21 Oct 2007 9:20 am

Maybe add:

'Not wanting to be the heavy' is besides the point.
'Liking the music' is besides the point.
'Understanding' is besides the point

If this on-going debackle is not corrected totally,
the band will not GET ANY return gigs,
and so any further rehearsals will be a waste of time.

Be PRO from haulage to performance.
There is NO alternative.

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 21 Oct 2007 9:24 am

Hi Jon,
Your letter sounds a little harsh to me.
Maybe something like...

"Hey Guys, I'm not going to be able to continue with the group without resolving the drummers gigging gear issue. I know everyone is going to have a gear issue now and then, but having funtional gear and a way to get it to the gig is the most basic issue a band member must have consistantly under control.
Please let me know that this is no longer an issue before scheduling our next rehearsal or gig."

fwiw,
I once played with a drummer who had to go out back a make a set of drum sticks out of tree branches.
Two flimsy, green, pieces of tree branch.
Oy Vei!

Stu Schulman · Post by **Stu Schulman** » 21 Oct 2007 9:34 am

Jon,You don't need to be a baby sitter...it's hard enough to take care of your own stuff.

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 21 Oct 2007 9:54 am

This has been twisting my innards since last night so even though I posted this for the purpose of seeing some objective feedback, I couldn't sit on it and it was sent a while ago, hence it's too late for suggestions of what I might have or should have said (although I truly appreciate the input).
I agree with everything that has been said. The only thing I'd have to sit and wonder about is Pete's comment. Normally I totally agree that a communication free of undo emotion and histrionics is most productive. But I'm not sure if my tone & anger here are merely because it feels good to vent or also because "now maybe I've got your attention". This issue has not blown up before but it has come up and I've mentioned it and expressed myself re: being serious, being professional.

As I write this, emails are starting to fly--bass player is telling me to clarify who I am talking to because as far as he knows, he had all his stuff (he knows exactly what I'm talking about because we talked briefly after the show), drummer is blaming bass player for not bringing snare "and don't tell me I should have texted you to remind you", so perhaps predictably this is turning into what I told them I wasn't interested in---who specifically did or didn't do what, and when.
Could be I handled this wrong. Or could be this will be a necessary blood-letting. Time to go to the mattresses?

John P. Phillips · Post by **John P. Phillips** » 21 Oct 2007 10:09 am

Yup ! FWIW, time for either a new drummer or a new band !!!

James Cann · Post by **James Cann** » 21 Oct 2007 4:37 pm

Sh*t happens . . . and not giving a lotta f**k.

Since you mention a junior high school level of professionalism, what do you think this is?

If you want to talk like this with your mates, go ahead, but when it's time to get professional about a serious issue, this doesn't hack it anywhere.

Don't cut yourself off at the knees with the language of the losers.

Cliff Kane · Post by **Cliff Kane** » 21 Oct 2007 6:23 pm

John, I hate using email to resolve issues like this. Talking face to face is a lot more productive and positive. People react, say things, and come across differently in emails, and usually not for the better. It's fine for positive or nuetral communications, but for problem solving it seems to make things worse. Good luck, sounds like fun music, but a drag to play with.

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 21 Oct 2007 7:49 pm

Jon, I understand that you've already let the original email fly. But I honestly didn't think it had enough clarity to really make your point. What I read was anger and frustration, but lacked the specifics they can understand and act on. So it doesn't surprise me that they want you to clarify.

To me - if you really won't or can't deal with what's going on and want to even consider continuing to work with these guys - I think you need to tell them:

a. That each player clearly needs to understand the he, and he alone, is responsible for his equipment. Any help given by someone else doesn't alleviate that responsibility, that this is a minimal standard of professional behavior, and you aren't willing to work with anything less than that or take on baby-sitting duties for them or their equipment.

b. That what's been happening to date - and be specific about the incidents - are unacceptable, and that you simply must bail out if they don't agree to fix these problems immediately. I would also explain that I like the music and this isn't personal - but that I just don't have time to mess around with the musical equivalent of the Keystone Cops.

I have been in this situation. I honestly would state all this in a completely neutral tone, and be prepared to move on if I don't get a rapid and firm resolution from them, with very clear positive action at the next few rehearsals and/or gigs.

IMO, the problem with focusing on the anger is it honestly dilutes your position and lacks clarity. Although I agree with James C. that a lot of profanity isn't called for, I sometimes find that when dealing with intransigent musicians, club owners, managers, maitre d's, and so on, a single but strategically placed expletive is sometimes a good attention-getter. But I think this is best done in a very crisply worded, concise, and otherwise polite directive, where it stands out all that much more clearly.

Although face-to-face talks have their place - especially in more informal discussions - when push comes to shove, there's nothing like crisply worded prose that puts it in black and white, and nobody can run away from when there are questions about exactly what was agreed to. IMO.

I do think it's a bad idea to start down this road unless you are really ready to move on if postive change isn't made. I definitely go with the Harry Truman adage of "speak softly and carry a big stick." I also think the stick should be used as little as possible, but used decisively when needed.

Let me admit that my own actions don't always live up to my advice on this kind of thing. But when I ignore it, I usually come to regret it. If I could just fully internalize that.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 22 Oct 2007 1:46 am

Jon, your introduction prior( no pun) to the EMAIL you sent pretty much tells the story.

It WREAKS with the lack of responsiblity and personal commitment , like in LIFE.

being in a band with NO car is quite a trick.

A month or so back I was invited to play with a local guy who doesn't have a Car..he's like 35...He needs a ride to every gig. He is the show.

The bad news for him is I don't know how he is gonna get to any gigs, because the good news for me is I ain't taking him

Actually , even better, I won't even be there

In your case it is decision time, if you send this letter they may just flip you off..It would be way better to be CALM, tell them if anything like this ever happens again you are out.

And start looking for another gig ( which is very hard) in the meantime.

One thing is for sure for many of us ..uhh..Older players. We've pretty much been there dun that and we are not willing to do it again.

tp

Eric West · Post by **Eric West** » 22 Oct 2007 4:10 am

Nice letter but..

How are they going to get it...?

Email?

Text Msg?

Phone?

Could they read it iff'n they did?

I had a guy actually blow up and try to charge me storage for the old Uhaul trailer that I used to haul him and his PA /Bass stuff to gigs in when I wanted to call in a couple hundred bucks worth of "account" that he had been shorting me on pay so he could "make it". I made a call and gave the trailer away before the next day was over.

I think if you did a survey, you'd find that at least one person in every band doesn't have a car, and one more has one but his/her license is suspended..

No news in this story..

EJL

Joe Casey · Post by **Joe Casey** » 22 Oct 2007 4:14 am

I never minded helping a guy out once or twice..But I'd certainly draw the line at being responsible for other's equipment or lack there of....I once had a blind musician who always found a way to have his equipment set up on stage and ready to play..I always respected the fact that this man never made his problems the bands problems..although I know any of us would have helped him at the drop of a hat..

Ray Minich · Post by **Ray Minich** » 22 Oct 2007 5:00 am

If you're gonna do something for someone, that they should be doing for themselves, you can only do it ONCE!
The second time, you become obligated...

(paraphrased from Abraham Lincoln...)

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 22 Oct 2007 6:02 am

Eric West wrote:
I think if you did a survey, you'd find that at least one person in every band doesn't have a car, and one more has one but his/her license is suspended..

No news in this story..

EJL

Jon, best of luck in this situation. Band turmoil can give you ulcers. I play in a band with my brother. It's like this all the time.

Barry Blackwood · Post by **Barry Blackwood** » 22 Oct 2007 7:26 am

I definitely go with the Harry Truman adage of "speak softly and carry a big stick."

Dave, not that it matters much in the context of this thread, but I believe it was Teddy Roosevelt who said that.

Jon, upon reading your original post, let me revise my two cents and say that changing drummers seems to be the easiest and most logical solution here.

Marc Jenkins · Post by **Marc Jenkins** » 22 Oct 2007 7:44 am

Hey, I'm one of those guys without a car! I do, however, bribe drivers with beer or dinners, and I have a dolly that I push to rehearsal with my Sho~Bud, a pedal case with a lot of electronics in it, my seat, music stands, and a Blues Jr.

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 22 Oct 2007 8:16 am

Barry - of course, you're right. I've been writing for three days, and my brain is tired.

If you're gonna do something for someone, that they should be doing for themselves, you can only do it ONCE!
The second time, you become obligated...

(paraphrased from Abraham Lincoln...)

Absolutely. I don't argue that sometimes there are special circumstances where someone might need help. I've been there, and so have people that I have helped. But there's old Yankee proverb that I think fits: "God helps those who help themselves." Needing help doesn't necessarily automatically dump the entire responsibility on everyone else. But that could get close to politics, and I don't wanna go there.

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 22 Oct 2007 8:56 am

in my experience ...people dont change.

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 22 Oct 2007 9:55 am

I would have just let it ride. When other band members forget some of their equipment, it just makes the music more interesting and challenging. Ever forget your volume pedal? It opens a whole new musical space.

A banjo band without a snare drum can't be that big of a problem (can it?).

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 22 Oct 2007 10:01 am

Definitely amateurville. You are playing with personally irresponsible hacks. A band is a BUSINESS. We have weekly meetings to set both marketing and playing agendas. Everyone is aloud ONE mistake. If it repeats, they're gone. Everyone knows it. So know one does it, mostly out of respect, part out of just being responsible. We get paid premium. Hacks are a waste of time.

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 22 Oct 2007 11:03 am

Years ago, I was in a band that had a 'problem guy'. He was our singer/guitar-player, and he was/is(?) amazing! He WILL be known to some members of this Forum so I will abide by the advice given to me by Prince Charles - "Never drop names..."

He didn't drive, and this gave him plenty of latitude when it came to expecting a ride to every gig, as well as his indulgence at the bar. He slowly wore out his welcome with each of us, one by one. The last I heard, nothing had changed - he's still at it!

I do recall our drummer's wife remarking, after one of his transgressions:

"He'll never get to Heaven!"

Our drummer didn't miss a beat....

"He will if he gets a lift..."

RR

John Steele (deceased) · Post by **John Steele (deceased)** » 22 Oct 2007 11:33 am

Everyone is <b>aloud</b> ONE mistake.

Ok, that's one.

So <b>know</b> one does it

Whoops... that's two. Sorry. Please turn in your licence to condemn others as amateurs and hacks.

-John
Co-Chairman of the musicians' literacy campaign

p.s. Good luck, Jon. I feel your pain.