Boss RV-5 vs Holy Grail vs POD XT?

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 13 May 2007 4:15 pm

I'd like to add reverb to the signal chain in front of my Fender Princeton. I have a POD XT that can do the job, but I wonder if a dedicated reverb unit like the Boss RV-5 or the EH Holy Grail would be better. Has anyone ever done a comparison of reverb units for steel?

KENNY KRUPNICK · Post by **KENNY KRUPNICK** » 13 May 2007 5:49 pm

b0b, get you a RV-5.

Dave Zirbel · Post by **Dave Zirbel** » 13 May 2007 5:55 pm

You can borrow my Holy Grail for comparing if you like.

Dave

David Higginbotham · Post by **David Higginbotham** » 13 May 2007 6:49 pm

Bob, for that purpose alone I would use the Holy Grail. I have used all three and have acheived the best sound with the HG. Easy to adjust, great sound, and very quiet unit.
Dave

Keith Hilton · Post by **Keith Hilton** » 13 May 2007 8:20 pm

b0b, I have had a little experience with the Holy Grail. It makes noise if you feed it a pre-amped---line level signal. I am certain it was designed to see a low level magnetic guitar pickup signal. A few years ago I was playing a steel guitar show with Tom Brumley. He went on after I played and ask if I would help him get set up. He was using a Holy Grail reverb unit. At first we hooked it down stream of some powered devices and it made a clicking noise. When we put it first in the signal chain the noise went away. This told me the Holy Grail needed to see the voltage and current produced by a passive magnetic pickup. Hope this information helps.

Jay Ganz · Post by **Jay Ganz** » 14 May 2007 5:31 am

Gee whiz....I don't think either unit will be all that
much better than the PODxt reverbs (which are actually
more adjustable if you really get into it). I've stuck
with it for a few years now and mix in a little delay as well.

I mean, it doesn't hurt to check the others out, as long as you can return them if you want.

Greg Cutshaw · Post by **Greg Cutshaw** » 14 May 2007 6:25 am

I like the RV-5 reverb as well as the Fender Deluxe tube reverb! I use Plate and Hall exclusively. The Spring setting is pretty worthless as it has programmed into it an atificially high number of reverb "pops". I run the effect level at 10 to 12 o'clock and all other settings at 12 o'clock. I even bought a second one so I can keep one in my steel setup and one one my 6 string guitar.

Greg

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 14 May 2007 9:21 am

Greg Cutshaw wrote:I like the RV-5 reverb as well as the Fender Deluxe tube reverb!

Greg, is this what you mean? . . .

Dave Zirbel wrote:You can borrow my Holy Grail for comparing if you like.

I may take you up on that, Dave.

Joe A. Camacho · Post by **Joe A. Camacho** » 14 May 2007 10:40 am

I like the Holy grail when playing my tweed Super or Bassman, not noisey at all. I "jump" channels with and have it set up in between the normal output and bright input, hence I plug into the normal input.

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 14 May 2007 3:50 pm

I used a Holy Grail for a while, and it sounded very authentic. I had no noise issues with mine. The spring setting was especially nice. However, with the one knob controlling the level and the decay, it was hard to control the length of the reverb. I traded it for an RV-3, couldn't dial in anything to my satisfaction, and went back to the amp 'verb in my Session 400. But I would recommend the Holy Grail as the most authentic old-school reverb out there.

Darryl Logue · Post by **Darryl Logue** » 14 May 2007 8:02 pm

Our guitar player used the 65 Deluxe pedal between his guitar and tube amp. Even when it was off it affected his sound in an unpleasant way. When I turn my Holy Grail knob past halfway I start to loose low end response ?

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 14 May 2007 10:11 pm

Holy Grail is the way to go in my book. I see them in top studios all the time these days. Amazing units. I use it on most every session I get.

Lynn Oliver · Post by **Lynn Oliver** » 14 May 2007 10:18 pm

There's a similar discussion going on over in the steel without pedals forum: http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=104017

Chip Fossa · Post by **Chip Fossa** » 16 May 2007 6:06 pm

Holy Grail = Warmth

Boss RV3/RV5 = Hard Edged

HG - A simple unit, and very very close to the best reverb of all time - The Fender Twin. (MHO)

The BOSS's have TOO many settings. I have an RV3 and half of it deals with echo and delay.
All I wanted was just a REVERB, alone, unit.

IMHO there's just too much goin' on with the BOSS's.

The reverb is pretty hard. But maybe that's what you're after.

b0b, this digital reverb issue has many threads in the archives, too. I think I even a posted a few. This reverb deal has gone round and round quite a bit.

Michael Pierce · Post by **Michael Pierce** » 18 May 2007 6:05 am

For the benefit of a relative newbie, could someone explain the advantages of an "outboard" reverb unit versus the unit that is part of the amp. For example, what should I expect from using either the Holy Grail Unit or the RV-5 versus the amp reverb in my NV 112? I've also heard about the "lush-ness" of Lexicon reverb units (which are rack mounted)... any inights appreciated. thanks, MP

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 18 May 2007 2:00 pm

I have a Lexicon MPX-100 and it sounds really good, but I don't want to haul a rack around when I'm using a Fender Princeton. The Princeton is for very small rooms or sessions. That's why I'm asking about these stomp box units.

Jim Sliff · Post by **Jim Sliff** » 19 May 2007 6:18 am

b0b, I have all 3, and up until a recent trade ran them through a '62 Princeton - not a bad platform for similar comparisons.

The RV's I do not care for at all - as someone else mentioned, they have a biting "edge" to them - that sounds cool at first, and is headache inducing after a while. They just have a cold, digital sound I don't like.

The reverbs in the POD are very good, and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them. BUT they seem to be more suited for recording than running through a dry amp as an "effect". Through an amp there always seems to be eithe rtoo much or not enough - it's the "in between" settings that are more amp-like, and I haven't found one yet that emulates a Fender amp.

IMO you absolutely cannot beat the Grail, unless you buy a resissue spring reverb unit. It's so close to the natural spring reverb of an amp you want to keep kicking the thing to make a "crashing" sound - the only thing it lacks. And while some don't care for it, I like the "flerb" effect as well - good for spacey, textural sounds.

When you add one of these to a non-reverb Fender amp it sounds VERY close to the reverb versions, lacking only the additional gain of the reverb channel.

You could borrow Dave's and try it - but honestly, even though you have the POD I'd just go buy one. I'm absolutely sure you'll like it.

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 19 May 2007 7:09 am

Thanks, Jim. Sounds like you and I have the same taste in amps and effects. I'm going to try Dave's, and I suspect that I will end up buying one.

The POD XT has so many effects and tones, it just seems like it complicates the sound. It's hard to tell what's the POD and what's the Princeton.

I'm also using a Real Tube distortion box with this amp. It's a very simple crunch sound, the first stomp box distortion I've found that I actually like.

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 19 May 2007 7:39 am

One thing you should know----the Grail power supply is tip-positive. So you can't daisy chain it with other 'standard' Boss type tip-neg. units. This means another wall wart on the power strip. This doesn't deter me---I use the Grail anyway. But it is a nuisance when I'm trying to keep a real small footprint on a small pedalboard and end up with spill-over because of power supplies. On my new monster upright pedalboard that I will soon unveil here, this is not an issue due both to the luxury of abundant space and to the use of a Voodoo Labs power supply with isolated outputs that allow mixing & matching polarities.

Eric West · Post by **Eric West** » 20 May 2007 7:12 pm

b0b.

Don't discount the Podxt.

You can edit the reverb to reduce the "decay" and get virtually any reverb you want. In other words, you limit the amount of "repeat" or "muddiness". I use the largest "cavernous" reverb with ZERO "decay", and it's clean, adding delay at the desired level.

On the xt, the level is adjustable with the reverb knob. The "decay" is edited through the editing program. (The XtLive is not that way.)

That "'65 Pedal" looks interesting.

EJL

John McClung · Post by **John McClung** » 20 May 2007 9:27 pm

I did a short A/B comparison at Guitar Center of the Holy Grail vs. Line6 Verbzilla. Verbzilla won handily. The HG was a bit too noisy and hissy, just a 6-string guitar > HG > headphones. VZ was dead quiet and had lots of great reverb sounds.

But I also love the reverbs in my Lexicon MPX-110, and in the PodXT. After one gig with the Verbzilla, I exchanged it for the PodXT, it's a great little unit, and ideal for quick-change, one-set gigs.

KENNY KRUPNICK · Post by **KENNY KRUPNICK** » 21 May 2007 6:28 pm

I've heard too,that the Holy Grail was kind of noisy.
Why would this be? The BOSS units are quiet.

Chip Fossa · Post by **Chip Fossa** » 22 May 2007 2:06 am

My Holy Grail is noiseless. I also have it's wall wart plugged into a 6-plug electrical strip with another walwart and there is no conflict, noise-wise.

It's a great unit, to me.

And the price, well, can't be beat.

What with all the sheckles we steelers lay out, all the time, for this beloved instrument, what is another $80-$100 to try out, IMHO, a truly fantastic
reverb unit? C'mon!

Chipper

KENNY KRUPNICK · Post by **KENNY KRUPNICK** » 22 May 2007 6:33 pm

Chip, have you tried the HG for lead guitar?On different amps? Maybe the individual/s,that had noise problems with their unit didn't have a proper ground.The one thing I see that I would like about it,is one setting for a spring reverb.I think it has another also, but the main draw is that good warm spring reverb. I'd like to hear b0b's comments when he tries one out too.

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 23 May 2007 2:48 am

Jon - you can get a polarity-reversing adapter from 1 Spot for a couple of bucks - as long as the Grail is 9v, it will work fine in a chain. I know Elderly has got them, but anyone selling Visual Sound products should be able to get them.
http://elderly.com/accessories/items/VSRPC.htm
They also make adapters for 1/8" plugs (DOD, old EH), bigger Digitech units, 2.5mm plugs, and battery clip converters.

P.S. (I love the 1 Spot power units, $20, perfectly quiet and they run cool forever - it's cheaper in the long run to just replace all the old-fashioned hot ones that keep burning up.)