A Stupid Question

Carroll Hale · Post by **Carroll Hale** » 22 Mar 2007 4:47 am

I have been playing guitar 40 years and I have always seen the bridges on most guitars...(not the cheapies) have a "slant/angle" on them...ie..the strings do not all cross at the same angle...
can someone explain that to me....I am a chemist with 2 college degrees....so I am not really dumb..just curious...(as are most scientists)..
thanks to anyone who can help...

ch

Jon Moen · Post by **Jon Moen** » 22 Mar 2007 5:52 am

Have a look at this

Carroll Hale · Post by **Carroll Hale** » 22 Mar 2007 7:01 am

Jon Moen wrote:Have a look at this

interesting reading......I thought these bridge alignments had something to do with proper intonation...but,had never investigated...
..hope it is ok to print a copy to take home and read.....looks to complicated to read while doing my regular job...

thanks for posting this for me.
ch

John Sluszny · Post by **John Sluszny** » 22 Mar 2007 12:27 pm

Yes,very interesting indeed.Thanks !

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 22 Mar 2007 12:54 pm

can't someone just tell me what it says ? Or do I actually have to read it for myself ?

Carroll Hale · Post by **Carroll Hale** » 22 Mar 2007 1:17 pm

Tony Prior wrote:can't someone just tell me what it says ? Or do I actually have to read it for myself ?

gonna print a copy and try to read tonite....
some light reading material..after a hard day..

hopefully, I can give my "simple interpretation".

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 22 Mar 2007 3:57 pm

Carroll, don't feel bad. Some guitars (like the ones on the website below) almost defy explanation in this respect. Are ya ready...

Hoooooo boy - check it out.

http://www.novaxguitars.com/

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 22 Mar 2007 9:09 pm

There are a lot of reasons that bridge compensation is needed on many guitars. Strings are not perfectly flexible - as one gets to the clamping point, it's internal stiffness prevents the string from vibrating freely. Other things being equal, this tends to get worse as the string gets thicker. In addition, the string is deflected when fretted, which changes the tension a bit. In reality, compensation is generally determined empirically.

On the Novax guitars - I just saw probably the most prominent Novax user tonight, Charlie Hunter, who plays an 8-string Novax. The guitar has fanned frets with 5 treble-end guitar strings and 3 bass strings. I presume that an important point of the fanned frets is to allow a longer scale length on successively lower strings, while still maintaining proper equal temperment.

Let me say that Charlie makes it sound great.

Carroll Hale · Post by **Carroll Hale** » 23 Mar 2007 9:01 am

well....took home a printed copy to read.....
woke up a few hours later...still ignorant and with a partial hangover from the johnnie walker red & H2O that I had along with the reading material...
tonite, I think I will just play some music and let the why/wherefore of "staggered bridges" be studied by the great physicists of our time....
yall have a great weekend..
ch

Larry Robbins · Post by **Larry Robbins** » 23 Mar 2007 1:22 pm

And if your not confused enough allready....... check out this compensated nut...the latest thing in intonation....and BTW, thats what you get for putting that evil"water" in with Johnny Walker! Water is bad for you...a man could drown in the stuff!

Robert Leaman · Post by **Robert Leaman** » 23 Mar 2007 7:04 pm

It is an elementary procedure to place a guitar bridge at the proper point or to adjust a bridge that has individual segments for each string.

1. Tune the string for its correct pitch.
2. Place a finger on the string so that the 1st harmonic is produced. This is the exact midpoint of the string. Pick the string and then quickly remove the finger. A pitch one octave higher than the tuned note will be heard.

3. Fret the string at the 12th fret. If the fretted note is higher than the harmonic, move the bridge farther from the 12th fret (Make small adjustments).
If the fretted note is lower than the harmonic, move the bridge closer to the 12th fret.

When the harmonic note and the fretted note are exactly the same, the bridge for that string is in the correct position.

4. Repeat the exercise for the remaining strings.

Brint Hannay · Post by **Brint Hannay** » 23 Mar 2007 9:53 pm

If I'm not mistaken, that article explains, at least in principle, the rationale behind the much-ballyhooed and much-maligned "Buzz Feiten Tuning System".

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 24 Mar 2007 2:39 am

Q for Larry Robbins: I though the offset on the third (G) string on the compensated nut was specifically designed to "fix" intonation problems caused by using an unwound, plain third string, yet you're using a wound G string? I have been interested in these, but I seem to be leaning more and more towards wound third strings so I have held off until I settled out exactly which guitars were to be used as "benders" and which weren't. If the Earvana is approriate for a wound third also, I might just pop one on soon - did you install it yourself? (I have made a lot of nuts & stuff).

Larry Robbins · Post by **Larry Robbins** » 24 Mar 2007 8:22 am

Dave, No I did not install it myself but my luthier did and along with the re-slotted bridge (recomend on the Earvana site) I can tell you I enjoy intonation like never before! Check out there instalation guide for a lot of good Q & A's..

https://www.earvana.com/

What is recommended for the installation?

Check the intonation at the 12th fret before removing the existing nut. If the guitar reads sharp at the 12 fret with the original nut, you should not have to move the bridge forward. Even without moving the bridge, you will enjoy an improvement.

···Also, when using a wound G-string the compensation at the G block on the nut top must be filed back. Recommendation is to start slow and check it on the tuner as you file slowly back. Never go past the D string block!

Bo Legg · Post by **Bo Legg** » 21 Apr 2007 6:24 am

Why is it that we have all kinds of compensation on bridges and nuts of a standard guitar and none at all on the pedal steel guitar.

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 21 Apr 2007 7:18 am

Larry Robbins wrote:Dave, No I did not install it myself but my luthier did and along with the re-slotted bridge (recomend on the Earvana site) I can tell you I enjoy intonation like never before!

https://www.earvana.com/

I have Earvana nuts on all my guitars except a 100% original vintage Gretsch. The first thing I do when I get a guitar is install The earvana nut and straplocks.

They really do make a significant difference. It's not subtle. You can really hear it.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 22 Apr 2007 3:47 am

Stuart Legg wrote:Why is it that we have all kinds of compensation on bridges and nuts of a standard guitar and none at all on the pedal steel guitar.

Because so many of the variables on a straight guitar (fret height, neck flex, string height, push angle, fret shape, fretboard "cup", fretboard radius, neck "bow", and widely differing string guages) just aren't an issue on a steel.

The Steel Guitar Forum

A Stupid Question

A Stupid Question

Intonation