How Many Players Finance Steel Guitars? Worth it?

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 22 Jul 2007 7:50 am

For me, two steels is a necessity if I'm gigging. I'm busy enough with my day gig that I just don't have time to constantly set up and break down my steel to practice. I find that, practically speaking, I just don't practice unless I have one set up permanently at home and another in its case ready for gigs. YMMV on that, but for many, it may well affect how much seat time they get in.

The other thing is that you are gigging a lot - probably a lot of club work, not exactly the easiest environment on an instrument. Steels are mechanical, and need maintenance. A good 6-string guitar is, in my experience, less prone to unexpected mechanical issues, but I don't know many - if any - hard gigging guitar players that don't have any kind of backup. In fact, many players I work with would consider me "unprofessional" if I broke a string onstage during the middle of a set and didn't have a backup ready. I'm not saying it can't be done - but I'd rather not do it.

So I think having a second steel is important for a gigging musician. But that goes to the second aspect - how to pay for it. I agree that it's generally better not to take loans. But I agree with T.C. - if it's not a depreciating asset, I'm a lot more comfortable with it. I know some people pay cash for a house - but I think it's a small percentage. I guess that most people borrow to buy a car - and that's definitely a depreciating asset.

It is possible - if one is disciplined - to put money aside in an annuity. But that is not always a good idea - if the goods you are trying to buy are appreciating, it's possible to wind up spending more money this way than simply getting a loan when you find a good deal. This is about money, isn't it? You obviously want a second Sho Bud, right?

Overall - I would look over your whole financial situation and consider this in the bigger picture. I know that my unwillingness to borrow to buy a steel when I wanted one many, many years ago kept me from playing steel until I was much older. I just couldn't justify putting the money away for that - there were too many other pressures. Unless I had a mandatory payment to make, the money just disappeared to other stuff. In hindsight - not all of those other things were that important.

Since you prefer an old Sho Bud S-10, I can't see any reason to buy a student model steel. You just had to let one go by for around a grand. Again - look at the big picture.

Of course, all IMO.

T. C. Furlong · Post by **T. C. Furlong** » 22 Jul 2007 8:44 am

Chris,

You only need to walk 100 yards with your steel? Man, I would invest in a lightweight body only case and get a gig bag with a shoulder strap for the legs, rods and pedal bar and start taking your steel home with you right away. That may allow you time to get a good deal on another S-10 and maybe even restore it. When I do a session in downtown Chicago, sometimes I need to carry a D-10 for what seems like miles. Parking can be a real hassle. Many of the parking garages near studios are full during the day. The body only case with a Martin Backpacker bag for the rest sure lightens the load!
TC

A. J. Schobert · Post by **A. J. Schobert** » 22 Jul 2007 9:08 am

Chris just think of all the exercise you will be missing out!

I agree with DM if you gig alot and it sounds like a major source of income to you then I am surprised that you don't have a second or third steel already.

Just be smart about the financing and shop around.

Also if I was going into debt I would get me a new guitar atleast it has a warrenty with it.

And be careful leaving your steel trust me there is a market for "hot" PSG, I think that last few months of threads is evidence enough. I used to live in what is a very nice neighborhood very low crime rate yet in front of my house me car got broke into, stupid stuff was stollen, but my steel was safe in my home.

Scott Swartz · Post by **Scott Swartz** » 22 Jul 2007 9:16 am

A two wheel dolly is very handy for those "have to park far away" gigs.

I have one of those convertible ones that is an upright dolly or a 4 wheel cart depending on how you attach the handle.

A few hundred yards over pavement is no problem with this.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 22 Jul 2007 10:05 am

This is what makes it easy for me. It oonly takes me a few minutes to break down, and a few more minutes to setup my steel. I write it off as "Goes with the territory". I do agree, sooner or later, a second guitar would be pretty important, if for anything, one needs maintenance/repairs.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 22 Jul 2007 11:06 am

...to haul a 50-pound pedal steel about 100 yards every night

A very simple solution!

I just loaded one of these into my car... not 10 minutes ago! along with my other gear. The place I'm playing tonight has one main entrance for load in, and then a hallway, and long walk across a huge dance floor to the bandstand. This hand-truck makes life a lot easier. You GOTTA have one if you're playing gigs, even if you only need it once in a while.

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 22 Jul 2007 11:13 am

Yes, the carts are practical for most places, but I have two obstacles: snow banks/slush for 9 months of the year, and hoards of drunken idiots concentrated in one area: between me and my vehicle. George Street is a mess after 3am. There's a better chance of stuff getting stolen off the cart on my way to the car.

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 22 Jul 2007 11:16 am

I have a fold-up dolly exactly like James. I think it was $30 or $40 at Lowes, and stowes efficiently with my gear. Don't leave home without it.

Right now, I'm not playing a lot of gigs, but I have always packed up and hauled pretty much every gig - just seen too many thefts. I never leave guitars onstage overnight. It's one thing leaving a PA and even amp back line set up, but never guitars. Why put temptation in front of people? Of course, it depends on the situation and YMMV, but most people I know who have done that have also had stuff stolen.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 22 Jul 2007 11:31 am

Chris, It sounds like you would be comfortable leaving your steel guitar in the club overnight (low crime area, a secure place), so I'd say just do it. I left my pedal steel in the same club for 5 years solid. If a place is secure there is no problem, unless the place burns down

Believe me, a PSG is the last thing a thief will take. Even a thief doesn't want to haul it! They would take smaller, lighter things, like guitars.

IMHO you should buy a cheap used S-10 and leave That in the club. You really need two pedal steels.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 22 Jul 2007 12:11 pm

Here ya go, Chris, Tie one of these to your dolly. Actually, scrap the dolly idea. Just put a doggy pack saddle on this ole boy and let HIM carry your gear!! Get a long stick, a string and a seal flipper, and you could make him go anywhere you want!!

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 22 Jul 2007 12:39 pm

James, I'll never live the seal flipper thing down as long as you and T.C. are there to rib me about it.

Dave, I guess it's that obvious I want another 'Bud. Ha-ha....

Doug, I think you're right....I need a second steel. After all, how else will I be able to work on your Intros and Hot Licks courses while my steel is at a gig?

Thanks again, everyone, for your help here. It's really giving me a lot to consider, but I feel less confused now.

Cliff Kane · Post by **Cliff Kane** » 22 Jul 2007 12:48 pm

Hey Chris, is the George St. you speak of in Hamilton, Ontario? Lots of cool clubs and drunken idiots there, fer sure (been there and done that myself many times

). Maybe George St. in Canada is like Main St is in the USA., a common name for streets. BTW, do you know Claude LaRousch (spelling?) he's a Newfee who used to own or run Mermaids on George St. in Hamilton.

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 22 Jul 2007 12:55 pm

We get a lot of offers for no interest or low interest credit cards. I could have paid cash by cashing in a CD, but the CD makes more interest then the credit card, so I make payments (never the minimums ) and my savings are earning so I come out ahead. And I have two steels, I do wish they were alike.

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 22 Jul 2007 2:56 pm

since I`m in the proces of filing for bancruptcy you can probably guess hwere I stand when it comes to financing.Stay away from any credits or financing.Only thing you probably need to finance is your house,everything else you should pay for in cash.Credit is living over your means and if you need to get a credit for something that means that you can`t really afford it.So I would stay away from any kind of financing.I see you play S-10, you could get wonderful Pro I for around $1000 or brand new S-10 Jackson or maybe nice MSA for around $1200-$1500

$995.00 and they say it sound just like an Sho~Bud

Db

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 22 Jul 2007 6:42 pm

Cliff, no....the George Street I'm talking about is in St. John's. Newfoundland. But it sounds similar to the one you're talking about. I've heard of Claude but don't know him personally.

Damir, I played one of these in Dallas. They're great guitars. $995 is the base price for two levers and no case. A 3+4 Blackjack with a case, plus shipping and taxes, is up around the $1,600 area for me. Still worth it, though. I really liked playing it, and it does sound like a Sho~Bud. I've given this guitar a good bit of thought since last March.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 22 Jul 2007 7:42 pm

Hey Chris, Nobody knows the situation where you are like you do. In the end, it all boils down to what works best for you. And everyone on this thread only wants the best for you and to see you successful. Our best to ya!!

Jerry Malvern · Post by **Jerry Malvern** » 22 Jul 2007 7:53 pm

Chris, as a gigging player, a second steel is a must. And so is all the reasons you state. You like Sho Buds and since they go up in value, even the finance charges will be mute if you keep the guitar long enough. One thing I'll caution you on is...all the reasons you stated for a second guitar...work for a third.

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 23 Jul 2007 7:56 am

Damir, I played one of these in Dallas. They're great guitars. $995 is the base price for two levers and no case. A 3+4 Blackjack with a case, plus shipping and taxes, is up around the $1,600

huh,there we go, from $995 to $1600 in a second, good old advertisment tricks...Promat is actually around $645.05 but with pedals,case,rods,knee levers,taxes and few other things comes up to almost $5K...interesting how this new world advertisment works.

Db

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 23 Jul 2007 8:07 am

Damir,

The case for the Blackjack is $195, and the additional levers are $150 each. So before shipping or taxes, a 3+4 Blackjack with a case costs $1,500. I will pay 15% of that in taxes, converted to Cdn, plus shipping at around $150, and brokerage fees at around $150-$200. So I underestimated what a Blackjack would cost me.......it would be more like $2,100.

Brandon Ordoyne · Post by **Brandon Ordoyne** » 23 Jul 2007 7:54 pm

I have financed all of my steels...Carter-Starter, Pedalmaster SD-10, and an Emmons D10 Push/Pull, and also my Nashville 112...All are paid off now except the Emmons, bought it about a month ago.

Banks love it!

Brandon

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 23 Jul 2007 7:56 pm

That's the spirit I like to hear, Brandon!!

Gary Shepherd · Post by **Gary Shepherd** » 23 Jul 2007 10:30 pm

I'm about to "finance" a 2nd pedal steel for $1500 on a credit card. I know that I'll pay a little interest on it but I'll have it payed off by the end of the next tax season. I've carried a balance on at least one credit card for the last 20 years. Maybe this year will be the year I finally get them all paid off. I got close last year but it didn't quite reach.

Anyway, I've found a Carter SD-10 for $1500 and that's exactly what I was looking for. I might even end up selling my D-10. I never touch the back neck anyway.

Paul King · Post by **Paul King** » 24 Jul 2007 4:27 am

I borrowed some money from the credit union to buy the steel I have now. I lost on the last guitar so a loan was necessary. A good banker is a good friend the way I see it. My creit union will allow $2500 loans with just a signature. Anything above that requires another individual for an unsecured loan. However, I would sure advise against a credit card. With their interest rates and low monthy payments it takes forever to get them paid off. I use them only as a necessity.

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 25 Jul 2007 11:06 am

Well, I found my new steel: a Sho~Bud 6139 with 3+4. It's the long lost twin of my current guitar. I ultimately took Bob Hoffnar's advice and went with two identical steels for setup consistency. It makes sense. The only differences are the card cluster, the E66 pickup and three straight knees/one teardrop knee (as opposed to my current 4 teardrops.) And I added a Coop "Pro 1 Custom" decal to mine.

Mine:

The one I just bought:

It should be here in a few weeks. And yes, I "sort of" financed it.

David Fields · Post by **David Fields** » 25 Jul 2007 12:06 pm

The deal that Doug got was the climax to this thread....I mean it was all good, but to get an older P/P Emmons for $850.00?????
Wowzers, what a deal!

Want to sell it Doug?
HAHAHAHA.....thought so!

Dave

The Steel Guitar Forum

How Many Players Finance Steel Guitars? Worth it?

finance

Update

An Emmons P/P for $850.00