Easy approach to minor chords

[Matthew Prouty]

What do you all recommend for playing minor chords. I guess in my head I have them mapped out to what ever kind of relation they are to a 6th chord. Maybe it is called relative minor or something. For example playing a Am with the C6th position at the first fret with the E lowered.

Is this the easiest way or is there an easier pattern?

M.

[Joey Ace]

We had a really good discussion of this topic on the old Forum at
http://steelguitarforum.com/Forum5/HTML/008550.html


Lots of good thoughts there.


FWIW, the original post was by Tim Tweedale, who I didn't know at the time. I later worked with Tim when he did the Tab for the Mooney Instructional DVD.
Small world. If you live long enough you eventually meet everybody.

[chas smith R.I.P.]

Well, for instance, an A-7 and a C6 chord have the same notes in them.

1st pedal, A pedal, B->C# makes a VI-. Move up to the 8th fret (E neck) so we're in the key of C. The 1st pedal raises the G to A and makes an A- chord, the VI- chord. The knee lever that lowers the 4th and 8th strings, C->B makes an E- chord, the III-. Push the B and C pedals raising G and C to A and D and it makes a D- chord, the II-.

[Joey Ace]

Assuming know your Major Chords in the "AF position"
(You should. If not learn them, along with the ""AB Position" and "No Pedals Position") ....


In the AF position, release your KL.
Now you have the same chord, only it's minor.

Example: 8th fret AF is an A Maj, 8th fret A pedal only is an Am.

This is because the 4th string in the AF position is the "third scale tone of the chord". When you remove the F lever, you are flatting the third, which is how a minor chord is made.


That being said, I usually don't think in this way.
I think in the "Relative to the Major" way, described in the old post, linked to in my previous thread.

[Matthew Prouty]

Thanks for the replies. I was at a jam session last month and the song dropped into an Em and I had no idea what to do. It was the only song with a minor and now I am planning on jamming with this guy that uses a lot of minor chords in his songs and want to be ready for it. I think the AF (-F) position will be easyiest for me on the fly to find minor chords. I will try it out when I get back to my guitar.

M.

[Joey Ace]

Don't overlook the BC pedals for Minors.

From the No Pedals position, BC gives you a 2m.

So if you want an Em, you know E is at the the 12th fret, play two frets lower (10th fret) and press BC.

Another EZ trick, that I use on Dobro a lot, is only play the 1st and 5th tones of the triad.
Don't play the 3rd. The other instrument(s) will, and you sound like you're playing the minor.

[Ray Minich]

Every time I go to watch Jeff Newman's video set on Minor Chords (Minor Chord Connection), I get about one-third into it, and my head explodes...
Excellent material, I just need to take it in 15 second intervals.
The minors are where it's at though...

Run a scale on 4, 5, and 6, with B & C, and you're in the minors.

[Delvin Morgan]

Chas Smith, "A7 and C6 have the same notes". Not quite, A7 is A C# E G and C6 is C E G A.[/quote]

[Jerry Malvern]

I lower the 6th string, g# to g, then you have a minor at the same fret as the major chord. ie 3rd fret, strings 8,6,5, G chord, lower the 6th string, and you have a G minor. It's an old change, but it works when you gotta play on the fly.

[Larry Strawn]

With my lack of theory I have a hard time with this kind of discussion, but my ears are telling me with strings 5,4,3 with A+B pedals down then dropping string 5 a half tone it is turning this chord into a minor. Am I correct in this thinking? It seems to fit in with the rest of the instruments.

Larry

[Joey Ace]

You are correct Larry.

Here's the explaination:

Major chords are made up of the 1st, 3rd, and 5th tones of a scale.

In the key of C the scale is:
C D E F G A B C

You can see a C Major chord is made up of the notes C, E, G. They can be in any order.

Minor chords are made by flatting the 3rd note. (resulting in 1, b3, 5)
Thus a Cm would be C, Eb, G.

When you're at the third fret with AB pedals down, strings 5, 4, and 3 are E G C .
That's a C Major chord.

To make it a minor you have to lower the E note to Eb. The E note is on the 5th string, which has the A pedal engaged.

The A pedal is raising the string a whole tone (two frets).

If you half pedal the A it only raises it a half tone, which changes the E note to an Eb.
The result is a Cm chord - C, Eb, G.

[Larry Strawn]

Thanks Joey,,

I'm dropping the 5th string back down a half tone with my LKV. I tried the half pedal without very much success. [in fact none at all it just didn't work for me]

Larry

[chas smith R.I.P.]

Delvin, an A-7 and a C6 chord have the same notes in them, A C E G.

I did go back and change the 7th fret to the 8th fret.

[b0b]

http://b0b.com/infoedu/e9theory.htm

The 3 most common positions for minor chords are:

"A" pedal - gives you Am at the 8th fret
"E" lever - gives you Em at the 8th fret
"B+C" pedals - gives you Dm at the 8th fret

There are others, of course, but these are the basics. When you hear that a song in a major key suddenly goes to a minor chord, chances are that one of these three positions will give you what you want real close to where you are.

[Delvin Morgan]

Sorry Chas, I missed the little minus sign depicting the minor.

[Bob Hoffnar]

I use the AB pedals for minors. At the 3rd fret with AB pedals down strings 10, 7, 6,5,3 and 1 are a basic A minor triad. If I want to add a dom 7th to the chord I use strings 8 or 4.

Going from a C major chord to an A minor chord in the pedals down position involves nothing more than changing one note from the 8th or 4th string to the 7th or 1st string.

Example:

C major pedals down 3rd fret: strings 8,6,5

A minor pedals down 3rd fret: strings 7,6,5

[mike nolan]

I use the A+B position a lot too. I add the lowered 9th string so you get a cool unison with 10.... try 10 9 7 6 with A+B and 9 lowered, strum 9+10 and rock the A pedal.

If you get the Am with 6 7 and 9 lowered, you can release 9 to get the F chord... lots of in and out of the minor stuff down there.

[chas smith R.I.P.]

Delvin, that's ok, I missed a whole fret. Maybe that's why I'm not getting the calls....

[Larry Strawn]

Bob H.

I hadn't looked at the aspect of using strings 7 or 1 as you mentioned. As soon as I get some of todays real day job washed off I'm going out to my music room and check it out, thanks for eye opener.

Larry

[John DeBoalt]

When I first started playing, I'd get frustrated trying to transpose from the major positions to get the correct minor chord. Hopefully I'm better at it now. Anyway, when I ordered my new Carter, I had them set up the vertical knee to raise the 1st string 1/2 step, and lower the 3rd, and 6th 1/2 step. If the song started in a minor key, I could go right to the minor in the major chord position, and work my way around from there. I don't use that change much anymore. Can anyone suggest another use for that knee?

John DeBoalt

[b0b]

I don't use that change much anymore. Can anyone suggest another use for that knee?

Lower your 5th string a half step.

[Brint Hannay]

When I first started playing, I'd get frustrated trying to transpose from the major positions to get the correct minor chord. Hopefully I'm better at it now. Anyway, when I ordered my new Carter, I had them set up the vertical knee to raise the 1st string 1/2 step, and lower the 3rd, and 6th 1/2 step. If the song started in a minor key, I could go right to the minor in the major chord position, and work my way around from there. I don't use that change much anymore. Can anyone suggest another use for that knee?

John DeBoalt

BASIC PREMISE: These things are a matter of personal preference and/or accustomation (yes, that word exists--I looked it up).

I can't imagine why you "don't use that change much any more". Given how it provides not only the minor triad across all the standard string grips, but:

with A pedal: dominant seventh chords (without root) (A7 in open position), and

with A pedal: incomplete diminished seventh chords (without one note, but differently voiced from the F-lever-only incomplete diminished seventh, which is also minus one note of the chord), and

minor(major 7th) chords (with string 2), and

minor 7th chords (with string 9, or string 2 lowered 1/2 step) and

minor 6th chords (with string 2 lowered 1 whole step or 9 lowered 1/2 step), which are also

m7b5 chords, e.g. Cm6=Am7b5,

it's a change that I personally would absolutely have, and use a lot, in a setup with 5 knee levers.

The only thing I'd lose would be the string 1 change-- with 3 & 6 lowered the 1st string unchanged is a good melody note, or 9th for the minor or m7 or m6 chord, or 13th for the dominant seventh chord.

[Al Terhune]

Jerry, I'm with you. I use my C pedal to lower the G#'s (I raise my high E with the vertical knee lever), and it works good with how I play.

[Brint Hannay]

Larry, to get a C minor chord from the 3rd fret A+B pedals C major position: rather than try to 1/2 pedal the A pedal, or combine A pedal and a 1/2 step lower lever, you can just go up to the fourth fret and hit the E (4 & 8) lowers lever only (no pedals).

[Terry Sneed]

The easiest way for me to remember my minor chords, is for instance, playing in G 3rd fret.These are just the positions to get your 2,3,and 6 minor on same fret

2m/am> b&c pedals down strings3,4,5,6 or strings 567 pedals down
3m/bm> lower E to Eb knee lever
6m/em> A pedal down

key of C 8th fret>
2m/dm> b&c pedals strings 3,4,5,6 or strings 567 pedals down
3m/em> lower E lever
6m/am> A pedal down

works in any key, but I'm like the guy in the post above, it's best to remember all your different minor positions. I'll be the first to admit, I don't know every minor position.

Terry