Sustainiac ordered. Anyone ever tried it on a steel?

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 8 Apr 2007 7:49 pm

I've been talking to Alan Hoover at Maniac Music and just ordered a Sustainiac kit. It's like the Fernandez Sustainer but has more options and allows me to keep my current pickup configuration.

I'm going to have the single-coil driver installed at around the 17th fret of my Guyatone steel.

Has anyone ever tried one of these?

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 10 Apr 2007 6:50 am

You all are telling me that, with all the talk of sustain around here(and eBows), that no one has tried a sustainer installation?

Seems like a natural match with a steel guitar.

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 10 Apr 2007 8:01 am

I don't know, I've never had any problem with sustain on any of my steels.

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 10 Apr 2007 8:51 am

Well, I can get good sustain as well, but I like to have the ebow running on a string so I can reach over and tap a harmonic after holding a note for a couple of seconds. I just can't get that kind of sustain out of my steel without some help.

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 10 Apr 2007 11:05 am

James, I've thought about it, but never tried it either. Sure seems to me like it could be the ultimate, infinite sustain, Ebow experience with multiple strings and all. Let us know if what you learn.

Brad

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 10 Apr 2007 11:17 am

Wow, I guess I'll be the Guinea pig.

One of the attractive features is that, once the sustainer is activated, the instrument's tone knob can be turned to increase or decrease the intensity. Full clockwise is just for sustaining fundamentals, full counter-clockwise is harmonics. I could see riding this knob while playing to get some interesting effects. Also, the knob can be pulled for "mix" mode, whatever that is.

I have to install a third knob to keep the ability to control the tone when the sustainer is on.

I hear that playing chords with a sustainer results in the root note coming to the foreground after a few seconds(or less) which means that it really won't sustain chords that well. However, it sounds like an effect that could be pretty dramatic.

Unfortunately, I have to chop into my fretboard to install the system. The 1/4 jack has to be moved to the side to make room the the tone knob. One of the empty holes on the bottom, where there were was once a leg bracket, will be used to house the 9v battery.

Should be done in the next couple of weeks.

Craig Stenseth · Post by **Craig Stenseth** » 10 Apr 2007 4:44 pm

I'm curious why you're installing the sustainer pickup/driver at the 17th fret. I have a Hamer guitar with the sustainiac factory installed, it's in the normal neck pickup position (I can't remember off hand if it's a 22 or 24 fret neck). It also has a 3 way switch for generating different harmonics.

Dean Parks · Post by **Dean Parks** » 10 Apr 2007 5:49 pm

-edited to omit-

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 10 Apr 2007 6:16 pm

Craig, the driver needs to be about 4 inches from the nearest pickup that you wish to use with it. Since I have two pickups, like a Stringmaster, I'm having it installed 4 inches from the "neck" pickup so I can use both pickups with the driver. That places the driver around the 17th fret.

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 11 Apr 2007 1:53 am

The required right-hand technique will be interesting, to say the least - my guess is you'll have to drop the picks, because muting/blocking will be more important than picking. It could be an ambient-music monster, but rhythmic accenting may be mushy. I can already hear it in my head - a stringed organ with an infinite whammy bar and re-tunable chords. Neat idea!

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 11 Apr 2007 7:31 am

Yeah, the right hand will be tricky. I rarely play any rhythm on steel so I'm not worried about that. Chord work will have to be practiced before jumping on stage with it.

For single note leads, I can mute all but one string with the left hand. What I mean is, using a Shubb SP2(Stevens style with rounded nose) I lift the bar at an angle so it only touches on string and my left hand fingers mute the unused strings.

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 11 Apr 2007 8:40 pm

I have a Fernandez guitar with the built in sustainer, and while it is a wonderful tool, it requires that the guitar be played finger style so that I can dampen the unwanted strings. Otherwise they will all start to ring out.

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 12 Apr 2007 6:26 am

"I'm going to have the single-coil driver installed at around the 17th fret of my Guyatone steel."

Correction: the 19th fret.

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 18 Apr 2007 3:26 am

What is the status of this experiment? Have you done it? Did it work?

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 18 Apr 2007 7:47 am

The installation is supposed to be finished this week, hopefully today. The luthier predicted that it could get hairy but I should get it back by this weekend, at the latest.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 18 Apr 2007 8:02 am

I feel it's a "gimmick"...with little practical application, unless you're doing experimental-type music or just playing subtle background stuff. I think you'll discover that playing typical melodies with it will prove quite difficult.

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 18 Apr 2007 8:20 am

Donny, you may be correct. I love the sound of just laying the eBow near the pickup and using both hands to play melodies on the activated string. It's my favorite "overdrive pedal", if you will. It's pretty cool to be able to hold a note for a couple of seconds before tapping a screaming harmonic that sustains indefinately.

I do plan on using it for both subtle background textures and for experimenting.

Listen to the track "One Hundred Forty-Five" on this page: http://www.purevolume.com/modernruins

This guy is using a steel with a Fernandes Sustainer installed and it sounds great.

When it's time to play a typical melody, I figure I can just turn the sustainer off and go at it.

My disclaimer: I do not, nor do I plan to, play any sort of traditional music. My flamenco guitar background has given me all that I can bear concerning attempts to sound like someone else. I feel that the lap steel is the perfect experimental instrument. The pedal steel, even moreso.

When I meet other musicians and they ask what I play, I stick to "guitar" as my answer. The steel guitar limits the conversation for some reason. If I say "steel guitar", they usually want to talk about about Robert Randolph who I have seen live and whom I really don't enjoy listening to. If my answer is simply "guitar", then people ask "what style?".

In the back of my head, I have plans to play flamenco and other eastern inspired melodies on steel. I want to be able to play vocal inspired lines and I can envision a sustainer enabling that idea. My point is that I am a guitarist, not a steel guitarist, so a sustainer makes more sense.

I bet you didn't expect your post to get this kind of response, eh?

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 18 Apr 2007 9:30 am

James Mayer wrote:

In the back of my head, I have plans to play flamenco and other eastern inspired melodies on steel.

You can't do that. It's against the rules.

I'm going to tell my mommy on you.

Greg Gefell · Post by **Greg Gefell** » 30 Jul 2007 8:47 am

I know this threads been idle for a while but I'll add my related experience with a sustainer. I put a fernandes sustainer on a old strat copy that had been converted to a fretless guitar. There are some great possibilities on that for experimentation. The nature of being fretless sort of limits you to 2 or 3(max) note chords, but I found the real beauty in the beast to be the ease at which you can play with one hand. Pressing any string against the neck will cause it to ramp up and then sustain until you release. 2 note chords sound especially great with slides. If you combine open strings with sliding notes it begins to emulate some pedal steel movements.

Ron Whitfield · Post by **Ron Whitfield** » 30 Jul 2007 1:23 pm

Jerry Byrd used the 'gimmick' to musical effect quite well on at least one recorded tune.

Mike Wheeler · Post by **Mike Wheeler** » 30 Jul 2007 1:32 pm

So, James, how has this worked out for you? Any success?

James Mayer · Post by **James Mayer** » 30 Jul 2007 8:44 pm

I had it installed on my guyatone that was stolen earlier this month.

It worked pretty well, but wasn't perfect. In the end, I like the ebow better.

It didn't "start" as easily as an ebow does and was prone to die if you played over the lower frets or accidentally damped the strings with your bar hand. It's just not as powerful as the ebow. The ebow has a more intense, pure tone as well.

I liked the idea of being able to pull a pot and activate it. I also like to be able to play chords, which were possible, but when you strum a chord, one of the notes would immediately start to take the foreground. It also sounded wild with some great feedback sounds.

Another thing to note is that the Sustainiac "harmonic" mode is not the same as the ebow where you get the harmonic in the same pitch as the note being fretted. The Sustainiac would play a 3rd above what was being actually played. This sounded really cool and was easy to activate by just ramping up the mode knob.

If they made one that could be easily mounted on a steel with high action, without routing, I would consider it again.

the biggest problem was the lack of power. The ebow is just so much stronger. Of course, one of the downsides of the ebow is that you have rool down the volume and/or tone when using it in the same song as straight steel playing.

the ebow remains my favorite "overdrive" effect. I just wish it worked on multiple strings.

Stu Schulman · Post by **Stu Schulman** » 31 Jul 2007 1:54 pm

A friend of mine dropped off a Fernandez Native guitar with the Sustainer in it yesterday,I only got to mess with it for about twenty minutes last night,Still trying to figure it out.