Nix The Picks

Mike Shefrin · Post by **Mike Shefrin** » 27 Dec 2006 11:15 am

I don't use picks( although I know how and can use them if I choose) and I like the tone I'm gettting. I can still play fast, and can also block well. I'm lucky however since my fingernails are naturally super strong and never break.

George Redmon · Post by **George Redmon** » 27 Dec 2006 11:44 am

break a string, you guys really break strings?..i haven't broke a string on my keyless since....since....since...since...i will get back to ya on this one....let's see...since...ummm...since.............

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 27 Dec 2006 12:42 pm

I had a Sho-Bud Professional not all that long ago, BIG body, 20 keys..

I never broke a sting on that Steel..Ever..

Never, not one time...

But I also never played it much ..

happy almost New year

t

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 27 Dec 2006 1:10 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Buddy E. said he liked playing
with no picks, until he broke a finger nail before a set.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So in the brief period that Buddy Emmons played without picks, he picked with his fingernails, not with his fingertips. That makes a little more sense to me. I don't see how one could achieve a “good clear tone” with bare fingers.
The same is true on a regular guitar. I play a couple of bluegrass instrumentals on guitar using metal finger picks and a thumb pick. There is no way I can get the same speed, volume, brightness, and clarity of notes with bare fingers. The tone is radically different without the picks. the tone is more mellow. No comparisons are required for that. That’s just plain common sense.

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My Site - Instruction

Greg Simmons · Post by **Greg Simmons** » 27 Dec 2006 1:21 pm

Daniel Lanois always sounds sublime on his "Church in a Suitcase" with either no picks at all or w/thumbpick only

He's often found playing (gasp!) through a Vox AC30 too

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6vfeTC80LU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZZAyYUoAu4
[This message was edited by Greg Simmons on 27 December 2006 at 01:29 PM.]

Jerry Hayes R.I.P. · Post by **Jerry Hayes R.I.P.** » 27 Dec 2006 1:35 pm

Like Doug, I play bluegrass instrumentals on guitar and some on steel with a thumbpick and fingerpicks. I've tried but I just can't play as fast without the fingerpicks. There's a little bit of "drag" that occurs with a bare finger that you don't get with a fingerpick. For years now, I've used my ring finger with a hardended nail as an addition to my fingerpicks for grabbing an extra note in a chord. Sometimes on steel I like to try a couple of Merle Travis things and I use bare fingers at times for that, depending on the tune.......JH in Va.

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Don't matter who's in Austin (or anywhere else) Ralph Mooney is still the king!!!

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 27 Dec 2006 1:37 pm

You can pick your guitar.

And you can pick your nose.

But you can't pick your guitar with your nose!

Jerry Hayes R.I.P. · Post by **Jerry Hayes R.I.P.** » 27 Dec 2006 1:37 pm

Like Doug, I play bluegrass instrumentals on guitar and some on steel with a thumbpick and fingerpicks. I've tried but I just can't play as fast without the fingerpicks. There's a little bit of "drag" that occurs with a bare finger that you don't get with a fingerpick. For years now, I've used my ring finger with a hardended nail as an addition to my fingerpicks for grabbing an extra note in a chord. Sometimes on steel I like to try a couple of Merle Travis things and I use bare fingers at times for that, depending on the tune.......JH in Va.

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Don't matter who's in Austin (or anywhere else) Ralph Mooney is still the king!!!

BJ Jenkins · Post by **BJ Jenkins** » 27 Dec 2006 2:29 pm

Friends , May I suggest ???
Let those who wish to use Picks....Use PICKS !!
Allow those who prefer Bare Fingers......USE BARE FINGERS !!!! Where IS the DEBATE ???

bj

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BJ Jenkins

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 27 Dec 2006 3:29 pm

B.J.J., if you're serious about making light of the picks versus fingernails "debate", let me be the first to remind you of repercussions that exists amongst players. Chester Atkins' lightning fast guitar licks apparently have gone unnoticed by advocates of steel picks. He once indicated that the proper length and care of the fingernails was a primary concern for finger style playing. Playing without finger picks seems to denote a player who is out of the system, and is fishing behind the net. On the contrary, combining five note grips without picks, will turn the worm in short order, as far as producing sounds unheard with traditional 3 tone techniques. Another feature is a blocking technique that isn't easily accomplished while wearing picks;
if at all.

[This message was edited by Bill Hankey on 27 December 2006 at 03:32 PM.]

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 27 Dec 2006 4:27 pm

I tend to agree that blocking bare-naked is a treat in itself - if you're of the bent to plug into some delays and fuzztones and stuff, playing naked can cut way down on the "click" that is associated with pick-blocking while playing through several stages of gain. Also, if you're playing with your fingers and the tone is "too mellow" or "too soft", you can always just REACH OVER AND CRANK ON THE KNOBS, DUDE - for Pete's sakes, you've got 210 watts there... buy yourself a fuzztone, dude....

However, if you want to make noises similar to what all the other boys and girls are doing, you've got to use the picks. I've been coming at this from the opposite direction - trying to add picks to my six-string playing to save my poor fingertips. The effect of the picks on the tone is really global, all throughout the frequency range - you can't just notch it out with an equalizer and flail away.

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 28 Dec 2006 1:04 am

David M., some things are not worth a whoop. Did you ever experience coming in contact with a nest of hornets, or bees in general? Some threads receive the same welcome as bees protecting hives. After a few stings, and a fast retreat from the hive area, the bees settle down until something stirs them up again. Nix the picks amounts to about the same likeness of smoking out the bees. I've been stung many times by yellow jackets, white hornets, wasps, and one bumblebee. The contrariness associated with one merely suggesting a variation of picking techniques, restores my confidence, by realizing, that opinions are just that, opinions, and nothing more. The hesitancy to step on toes is not my favorite thing. The dismantling of unsavory opinions is a worthwhile approach to satisfaction.

Alan Coldiron · Post by **Alan Coldiron** » 28 Dec 2006 6:13 am

I find this a very interesting thread. I am a new steel player. I'm a bass player as far as my main instrument but almost 2 months ago I bought a used left handed Sho Bud S-10 (yes I play bass left handed with the string setup right handed). I have been having a terrible time using picks and have thought about dumping them. I have found that at this point I play much better with out them. I attribute that to the fact I play bass with bare fingers. I have thought about for now using my fingers and switching to picks once I get some chops. Any opinions?

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 28 Dec 2006 7:05 am

Alan C, the first thing to maintain is the use of a thumb pick. They sell many varieties at music stores. The thumb will be called upon to handle at least 50% of the work load. It's an entirely different stance than the "attack" on those huge bass strings. I must iterate the importance of the thumb pick. I've seen a few players fumbling around without a thumb pick. I frown on that bad habit.

Barry Blackwood · Post by **Barry Blackwood** » 28 Dec 2006 7:05 am

Bill, your last sentence kind of reveals the reason you started this thread. Do you consider any opinions that differ from yours "unsavory"
and in need of "dismantling" for your own pleasure?
Personally, it doesn't matter to me if anyone uses picks or not - we're all free to choose.
After a virtual lifetime of playing with picks, I have never encountered any evidence whatsoever of them being responsible for breaking strings .... My two cents.

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 28 Dec 2006 7:21 am

It seems heretical, no doubt it is...
but I really like my tone playing,

no picks into a Vox AC30 patch in Ampfarm,
and then into a old Fender cab model.

I most often find myself using the AC30.
Wish I had one for quiet live gigs.

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 28 Dec 2006 7:46 am

Barry B., my remarks are made and directed in broad terms, as I never single out an individual for criticism. I have too many faults of my own to deal with. I've enjoyed your support of the thread's subject matter.

Charlie McDonald · Post by **Charlie McDonald** » 30 Dec 2006 6:35 am

I think it must be natural for a bass player to play without picks. Finger blocking is already a skill.
I like the feel of the strings on my fingers.

CrowBear Schmitt · Post by **CrowBear Schmitt** » 30 Dec 2006 7:19 am

i prefer playin' without picks - ( w: the meat no nails )
i find it's a warmer sound
not so good fer speedin' tho'

But i do use picks too cause i learnt that it's better to know how to play w: picks rather than play w: the bare fingers & NOT know how to use picks

Heck, do both

Twayn Williams · Post by **Twayn Williams** » 30 Dec 2006 2:25 pm

I've always found it strange when people say to play faster you need to use fingerpicks. I've always found that fingerpicks slow me down significantly and inhibit my ability to hit the right strings. Of course, 25 years of classical guitar might have something to do with that! Even more than fingerpicks I hate thumbpicks. I seem to recall reading somewhere that Chet Atkins regretted learning with a thumbpick in his formative years.

None of this is meant to imply that fingerpicks and thumbpicks are somehow "bad" or "incorrect." Heck, if it works for you, use a sledgehammer on the strings! The most important thing is to make sure that however you play, that you don't cause repetitive stress injuries or nerve pinches or things like that.

Geoff Barnes · Post by **Geoff Barnes** » 30 Dec 2006 3:44 pm

Alan Coldiron wrote:I find this a very interesting thread. I am a new steel player. I have been having a terrible time using picks and have thought about dumping them. I have found that at this point I play much better with out them. I have thought about for now using my fingers and switching to picks once I get some chops. Any opinions?

Yep... I’m new to steel also, but have been a flatpicker for the last few decades. I just have been having a really hard time with the fingerpicks.. Not being able to feel the “bite” of the string under my nail means I am often not hitting the strings I’m aiming at… If I have them too tight, it feels unpleasant…if I have ‘em too loose, they fall off.
So I have been using a flat-pick and 3 fingers “pick and claw” style, and feeling a little guilty about it, because it is not “correct” technique as I understand it.
But I love that I can remove my guitar, sit down, pick up a bar and be right back in there…. I also like that I can use palm, thumb and finger muting/pinched harmonics etc.. on the steel… using habits acquired over a lifetime of playing this way.
Until I read this thread, I figured I would need to change to finger picks when I found someone who could give me some serious tuition.

It’s like I know this has gotta be soooo wrong, but at least I can get a tune out of it this way!

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 30 Dec 2006 4:12 pm

Twayn W.,

Chet Atkins was influenced by Merle Travis, who used a thumbpick and specialized in finger rolls. Where in tarnation might you have read that Chet "regretted" using a thumbpick? Actually his great style was not possible by using just the thumb. I'll risk saying that, even though the answer will never be known. One thing I've noticed, is that`thumbpicks work fine after I've trimmed away the excess length and the wrap around part. Physiological differences allow classical guitarists to plunk their bass notes on nylon strings, with the bare thumb. Still, it's awkward, as they are picking on the left side of the thumb. Some of Chet's fastest licks were dependent on the thumbpick. His "Yankee Doodle Dixie", features Chet playing both melodies at the same time. The feat made much easier by the use of a thumbpick.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 30 Dec 2006 5:00 pm

Maybe it depends on how one learns. I know one thing for sure... I have to use picks to play fast stuff. A couple of times I tried using bare fingers to play fast instrumentals that I normally play using picks... and I made a fool of myself!

Flamenco guitarists and some classical players can really smoke the strings using bare fingers, so it can work for some people. Maybe it's whatever we are used to? I do like the Tone of finger picks better than bare fingers. Cleaner, brighter, punchier.

Twayn Williams · Post by **Twayn Williams** » 30 Dec 2006 6:04 pm

I also tend to prefer the sound of fingerpicks on steel strings, but I just can't play with 'em. If I really need that pick sound on steel, I'll use a flat pick. When it comes to speed, I'd have to give the edge to nails over picks, but it will really come down to what you're used to. I imagine the difference is fairly slight. I'm a pretty slow player regardless!

As for Chet Atkins and thumbpicks, I don't recall where I read that, but it would've been at least 15 years ago. Remember, Chet was playing almost all nylon string guitar in his later years, and lots of more classical style arrangements, which definitely lend themselves to better tone and control with a properly shaped thumbnail rather than a thumbpick. But yeah, you really can't do that tick-tac alternating bass thing with a thumbnail and need to use either a thumbpick or a flatpick.

BJ Jenkins · Post by **BJ Jenkins** » 30 Dec 2006 8:47 pm

Hi Bill... Im not making light of anything just having fun with the thread.I dont take myself too seriously.
With me, there IS no debate cause I have always used finger picks on the guitar,five string and pedal steel.I will continue to do so as long as I can see.
I know that there are many different views on this subject and I appreciate those viewpoints and respect the opinion holders.
The fact that Chester could do wonders with his fingernails is not lost by a longshot BUT all that and some of the other comments does NOT bother MY opinion on the matter.
As I said ,I am having fun and I am just not going to be overly concerned when I'm pickin whether my steel picks are GOOD or BAD ! !They suit ME .
Thanks and enjoy Steel-Pickin
bj

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