Origination of "ax"

Charlie Campney · Post by **Charlie Campney** » 9 Sep 2004 4:03 am

I can't figure out why a guitar is sometimes referred to as an ax. The relationship is somewhat imaginable.

But I did see Alice Cooper try to chop with one the other day on TV.

Anyone know where the word originated?

Is it a recent thing? Or did it start when the rockers started busting up their wood?

Bill Ford · Post by **Bill Ford** » 9 Sep 2004 4:30 am

Ax/axe, horn, as long as I can remember those are the terms used for guitar. Maybe came from jazz players,ie Chops played.

BF

George Keoki Lake · Post by **George Keoki Lake** » 9 Sep 2004 5:20 am

I've seen some guys carry their solid body (i.e. Stratocaster type) by the neck over the shoulder into a gig...like perhaps you might hold an axe ?

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 9 Sep 2004 5:36 am

...Axe was already in general use in the 1950's, and I have been told that "axe" came into use back in the 1940's when it was first used to identify instruments playing the new hit instrumental "Woodchoppers Ball".

If this theory is correct it probably originally referred to one of the horns, probably a sax, taking an improvisational solo, and eventually evolved through the years until both "horn" and "axe" were used as a slang term for any instrument in a band.
www.genejones.com [This message was edited by Gene Jones on 10 September 2004 at 08:17 AM.]

Robert Porri · Post by **Robert Porri** » 9 Sep 2004 8:41 am

Take your axe to the Woodshed.

Any relation there?

Bob P.

Ray Minich · Post by **Ray Minich** » 9 Sep 2004 9:46 am

Is the correct pronunciation "ax" or "axe"?

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 9 Sep 2004 10:10 am

Ray
I always pronounced it "acks," but that might just be my ax-sent.

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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association

John Beatty · Post by **John Beatty** » 9 Sep 2004 10:32 am

Dear Ray,

Either pronunciation or spelling is equally correct; Unlike for many other words, there is no preferred spelling. So, your spelling preference is equally correct.

Insofar as etymology, all I know from experience, as student at the University Chicago, 1968-1972, I was a frequent visitor to the black blues clubs on the South side of Chicago (sometimes with my own personal trepidation, invariably misplaced.) The bluesman invariably referred to their guitars as "Axes".

I hope this helps--I'm sure the nomenclature well precedes the late sixties, but the above reflects my own personal experience.

I hope this helps a little--oftentimes history sheds little light on the original use or exact origins of particular "slang", since musicians often usually have their own secret language.

Maranatha,

Johnny2crows

Ray Minich · Post by **Ray Minich** » 9 Sep 2004 11:34 am

There was an interesting article on the very subject of "ax" .vs. "axe" usage that I stumbled across on the net within the last 10 days but I'll be darned if I can find it again. That's why I asked the rhetorical question. Thanks for the info

Pat Carlson · Post by **Pat Carlson** » 9 Sep 2004 5:09 pm

Mr. Webster says an axe is a musical instument such as a guitar.

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The Lone Prairie Steeler Pat

Ken Lang · Post by **Ken Lang** » 9 Sep 2004 5:45 pm

I'd tend to agree with Gene. Also that chops and axe are related. I recall in the late 50's phrases like.

"Man, go get your axe and show me some chops."

"That cat has been woodsheddin' cause his chops are a lot better."

"That cat is really good, with some great chops, but I'm gonna get my axe and cut him down."

Burton Lee · Post by **Burton Lee** » 9 Sep 2004 6:31 pm

Wait, what's the difference in pronunciation between "Ax" and "Axe"?

Aren't they both "Acks"?

Burton

John Pelz · Post by **John Pelz** » 9 Sep 2004 6:46 pm

FWIW, this is from The Online Etymology Dictionary:

ax/axe - O.E. æces, later æx, from P.Gmc. *akusjo (cf. O.S. accus, O.N. ex, O.Fris. axe, Ger. Axt, Goth. aqizi), from PIE *agw(e)si- (cf. Gk. axine, L. ascia). Meaning "musical instrument" is 1955, originally jazz slang for the saxophone; rock slang for "guitar" dates to 1967. Figurative verbal sense of "discharge (someone) from office," especially as a cost-saving measure, is from 1922, probably from the notion of the headman's axe. To have an axe to grind is from an 1815 essay by U.S. newspaper editor Charles Miner, in which a man flatters a boy and gets him to do the chore of axe-grinding for him, then leaves without offering thanks or recompense.

It'd be interesting to see what their sources are for the 1955 sax and 1967 guitar "axe" meanings. The jazz-slang meaning of the word makes sense: sax > ax > any musical instrument, but still, this definition doesn't explain how guitars came to be referred as "axes". Hmmmm...[This message was edited by John Pelz on 09 September 2004 at 07:50 PM.][This message was edited by John Pelz on 09 September 2004 at 07:55 PM.]

Ray Minich · Post by **Ray Minich** » 9 Sep 2004 7:15 pm

rock slang for "guitar" dates to 1967

Well I'll be darned, they got a date on it... Neato

My question about "pronunciation" was supposed to be somewhat tongue in cheek, but the history lesson that resulted is fantastic. [This message was edited by Ray Minich on 09 September 2004 at 08:15 PM.]

Jim Palenscar · Post by **Jim Palenscar** » 10 Sep 2004 6:49 am

also used as an interogatory-ie.- "I'll Axe my wife 'bout playin' tonite"

Emmett Roch · Post by **Emmett Roch** » 10 Sep 2004 10:40 am

Chet Atkins recorded "Yackety Axe" in 1965.

Stu Schulman · Post by **Stu Schulman** » 10 Sep 2004 11:31 am

I call my guitar a Hatchet,When it grows up it'll be an Ax.

Roger Edgington · Post by **Roger Edgington** » 10 Sep 2004 1:09 pm

When I moved to San Antonio in the 60s,steel guitar was commonally called an "ax". It seems natural to me that we have "picks" to go with our "ax"

Jerry Clardy · Post by **Jerry Clardy** » 10 Sep 2004 5:00 pm

Don' axe me....It's been around longer than I can remember.

Bill Bassett · Post by **Bill Bassett** » 11 Sep 2004 4:40 am

Is't there a clause in most music contracts?...something about one of the only things that allows cancellation is "Axe of God"?

I just always figured that would be a gilded Super 400 or maybe a White Flacon.

I could be wrong.

BD
Rimrock AZ

Bob Stone · Post by **Bob Stone** » 11 Sep 2004 7:26 am

John Pelz,

Thanks for the link to the etymology dictionary.

We should have known--just look on the Web. Chances are whatever you are looking for is there.

That said, the Woodchopper's Ball idea seems to make sense. And where did that 1967 date come from? Hmmm...I know a few discophiles that might have something to say about this.[This message was edited by Bob Stone on 11 September 2004 at 08:30 AM.]

John Pelz · Post by **John Pelz** » 12 Sep 2004 8:59 am

Hi Bob,
I figured there must be some sort of etymology dictionary online, and that's the first one that I found. I agree with you: the "Woodchopper's Ball" origination of the "musical instrument" meaning of "ax" makes a lot of sense, and just 'cause we read it in a dictionary, that doesn't mean that their date of first use is necessarily correct. Sounds like they should have got their info from Gene!

Sometimes I worry the neighbors will get out their axes -- the chop-chop kind -- when they hear me practice!

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 12 Sep 2004 9:30 am

We should have known--just look on the Web. Chances are whatever you are looking for is there.

Also, chances are whatever you find there is wrong!

C. Brattain · Post by **C. Brattain** » 12 Sep 2004 10:52 am

I remember using the word ax in the 1940's to define any musical instrument you use as a tool in you profession.

Jim Florence · Post by **Jim Florence** » 13 Sep 2004 12:18 pm

In the early 50s, I had a band boss who refered to our instruments as "Weapons".
Jim