OK guys this should be a friendly post. (I Hope) What's your favorite raw speaker (with a cast frame, not a stamped frame) and Why?
Here's my thoughts:
JBL is too bright for steels or tele's, but great for PA's and Les Pauls.
EV's are great for Steels, Tele's but maybe too Dull for Les Pauls. Not bad for PA's with some eq.
Black Widows are great for steel or Tele's. They are not very bright sounding, which may be good for todays steels in music. (lets get away from the twangy guitar sounds). I don't particulary like singing through them.
These are really the three big hitters I can think of with cast frames.
I prefer a mix of THD speakers (made by Celestion) and JBLs (E-120s or E-130s). The Peavey black widow is roughly equivalent to the JBL, IMHO. I don't like to use just JBL/PV speakers, because I just don't like the way they sound with an overdriven amp (too harsh). For a clean country sound, the JBL/PV speakers usually predominates, for a blues or rock and roll sound, the THD/Celestions predominate, because they have a really sweet, smooth sound when driven. For jazz, I actually prefer just the Celestions, because I think that that PV/JBL 'edge' that sounds so good in country can get in the way of a fat round 'Wes Montgomery' type jazz sound.
I used to drag around multiple cabinets to get this, now I can also bring a single stereo cabinet with a 12" JBL and 2X10" THD/Celestions. It sounds really sweet!
It's hard to make a blanket statement about which brand sounds best, or how they compare to each other, because certain speakers are designed for a particular application, or will sound best in a specific type of enclosure.
Then, there's there's the different models of a particular brand, like the Black Widow 1501 vs. 1502, for example. The 1501 is a "full range" speaker, like the JBL 130 (D,K, E, take your pick), Whereas the 1502 with the ribbed cone was originally designed as more of a bass speaker, like the JBL (D, E, K)140. (Mike Brown, correct me if I'm off base here)
I've used both as steel guitar speakers, and I liked the solid, tight low end of the 1502, but preferred the cleaner highs of the 1501.
Then there's JBL's... In my 15" cabinets, I've had JBL K-130's, and E-130's, and they are quite different. The D and K series (not made anymore), have an alnico magnet, and a warmer sound with more bass. They are also a few pounds lighter than the current E series, which has a large ceramic magnet, more like a Black Widow. The E series is less bassy and more present in the upper mid-range, which makes it my preference for steel, whereas I like the warmer D and K series for standard guitar.
After I had my hip replacement, I couldn't carry the weight of the JBL's anymore, so I replaced them with EV Force 15's, which is the only musical instrument speaker currently manufactured by EV (available in 10" and 12" also). These are much lighter than EVM's, and about half the weight of the JBL's. I like the sound of these better than any of the JBL's or Black Widows I've had. They're a very smooth, musical sounding speaker. The power rating is only 150 watts, but they have taken everything I've thrown at them without complaint.
These are just my experiences, what does anybody else think?
In general I like the ElectroVoice EVM (12L or 15L)series speakers but every amp is different. For example, I have one Music Man that sounds best with a JBL K series speaker, and a 2nd Music Man which sounds better with an EV speaker. I also have an Evans/Tubeworks system in which the EV sounds best.
I hate BW speakers in everything I have tried them in. This is all opinion so no flames please!!
I've been using 2 12" speakers made by Eminence for VHT. I like how they sound alot. When I was into old JBL's I liked the 15" K 140's the best.
I spent last week playing through an old Bassman with 4 10" speakers that sounded real nice also.
I have a 15" speaker marked Fender by cerwin-vega in my old (mid 70's) LTD. I don't know if it's more "amp" or "speaker" but, my newer session 400 or the nashvilles I've played just don't sound as good.
MH
The best "Fender Twang" sound I've heard was from two OEM Eminence 12's from an early re-issue Twin Reverb, transplanted into a previously ratty sounding Silverfaced, '70's stock Pro reverb. (Plus a Tele)
My favorite JBL sound was two K110, 8 ohm 10 inchers in an open-back cab., wired in series, with those connected in parallel with a JBL-reconed (in 1977) 8 ohm D130 15 inch, in an open-back cab,(5.33 OHM overall load), all driven by a Dynaco MKIII 50 Watt tube power amp and a preamp I "cloned" and built off a Mesa-Boogie MKIIC schematic.
I foolishly have sold (and miss dearly) all the gear mentioned above. :>(
(Except...I kept the Tele) :>)
My favorite PSG sound is a friend's Sierra,
Profex-II, and two Nashville 400's with Black Widows, AND especially his most capable hands, heart, and ears. Awesome! :>)
I now use a "Brownface/Blonde Tolex" 50 watt Fender (1964) Bassman with two Kendrick "Black-Frame" 12's in a tweed open-back cab. It sounds like the "period" thing should. :>)
This rig needs a good "Fender Reverb" unit,
currently under constuction on the bench, another "clone". I hope it sounds OK when done.
One of the things that various folks have mentioned is what a difference the amp can make. I remember the reason I went to a Black Widow from a JBL was that when using the Session 400 in a loud band, the JBL D-130 would crap out and occasionally blow, whereas the Black Widow sounded fuller when pushed to the full 200 watts of the Session. The JBL speakers later went to a similar power handling capacity, due to the big ceramic magnets (versus the alnico magnets in the older JBLs).
I am currently using a much lower output power amp, a VHT amp with 50 watts a side (also a more powerful one with 90 watts a side for really loud country bands). I wonder what a speaker that was more like an early JBL would sound like in this sort of configuration. I might need to pick up one of those Weber re-issues.....
Well I know that I'm more vintage oriented but I always use Jensen and old JBL speaker. The best speaker I've ever heard was the 15"
JBL 130 in my 1960 Vibrasonic. Don't know if its the amp, the speaker or both but the sound is incredible with steel, Tele, jazz guitars even microphone. They used the same speakers in the Standels.
Okay these won't take the power of todays tranny amps but with tubes amps they are my first choice
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Fender Dual Professional
Sho~Bud D-10 Professional
Dan, getting the '64 Bassman was a fluke. I have a friend who ia a bass player, and also a Mickey Baker trained Jazz Guitarist. He also repairs hundreds of VCR's a year in his garage shop. But he uses transistorized amps when he plays out.
I had heard a rumor from a mutual friend that Bill might have a stash of old tube amps. If he does, (I'm 99% sure he does),I doubt he could get his hands on any quickly as his garage is about 90% packed wall to wall to ceiling with Vcr's, TV's, and parts.
Last year he needed a better (than a 286) computer. I said I'd swap my motherboard & 166 Pentium chip, RAM & a 1.2 Gb HDD for an old amp if he had a decent one. In his closet for 17 years was the Bassman, easy to dig out and traded on the spot. I had to clean the pots, but otherwise it was fully functional. All the tubes checked good on my '57 Hickok
800 tester, but I later replaced the ancient 5881's with a pair of new Groove Tube 6L6's
that were gathering dust. I never liked its sound with the Chinese tubes and again later re-tested the originals and put them back in.
The pots should all be replaced due to heavy usage over (18 years ago), and it will need a cap job sooner or later, but all things considered I made out well on it, and Bill is very pleased as well. I can re-cap it in a couple of relaxed hours for around $30 in materials.
I'm not all that used to it yet, but I know it's capable of doing the "job" well, once I get to know its "personality".
For sure, I AIN'T SELLIN' IT! Not this time.
>
Your comment on Amp/Speaker interaction is spot-on! Even individual units of the same model & manufacturing runs can and will have a characteristic sounde of their own, to varying degrees.
I've heard lots of good & bad sounding stuff.
As you said, it has to all be hooked up and experimented with.
For all you JBL D130 fans, JBL a few years ago came out with a M series 15 which uses the smaller alnico magnet and is supposed to replicate the sound of their older speakers. I got one a couple years ago and it sounds very close. Also the price was about half to 2/3 of what their latest big-guns speakers are going for.
JBL never manufactured a Peavey Black Widow speaker. Back in the mid '70's when the original Session 400 was first introduced, we did use a "Made for Peavey by JBL" or something to that nature. But, this particular speaker had a lightning bolt Peavey logo on it, along with the JBL name.
Our Black Widow series has changed over the years to accommodate the increasing demand of the high powered amplifiers. But, the present steel guitar speaker that we manufacture is the 1501-4 ohm shallow basket with closely matches the older JBL's that we used to use. It is the only BW speaker that still incorporates the one piece voice coil and has the paper cone with the "chrome dome" dust cap.
Thanks for your comments and support of our products. Check out the 1501-4 ohm SB Black Widow at your local dealer, or you can hear this speaker in Nashville 1000's and Session 2000's.
<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Mike Brown on 29 March 2000 at 08:12 AM.]</p></FONT>
