Live Music in Nashville ..Again....Questions...

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 31 Dec 2001 9:43 am

I have read in the other post from several forum members about the Live Music scene in Nashvill around lower Broadway. The pay scale is low , even lower.. I do have a few question relating to this and no one has yet to discuss the "State" of the clubs. My questions pertain to the clubs that pay minimal or less. Is there a cover charge? Are the clubs crowded ? What is the overall
"Type" of person coming into these clubs? Is the live music great, medium great or not so great ? ,Are the clubs making money or are they just getting by ? Concerning Karaoke, I would agree that I have no interest in this what-so-ever, but Karaoke sells liquor, liquor turns a profit. What would happen if a particular band played regular , and they were real good, maybe great , and they started a big draw, would they be able to request a decent pay ? Would a player who played several Instruments find himself or herself working more regular ?
Just a few thoughts I had while reading of the scene in Nashville.
TP

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 31 Dec 2001 4:24 pm

Tony, It's a question of supply and demand here in Nashville. The club owners here and that means all of them know that they can replace you in a New York minute if you don't like what you're making because the number of good players not working is staggering. The pay situation is bad enough but the club owner's belief that what we do is easy and the good times are their doing and the bad times are the bands fault is what gets to me. Mike

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 31 Dec 2001 5:47 pm

Any chance we can get some of the local Nashville pickers to tell us how much they made ($$$) playing music in 2001?
(wish I could find a more delicate way to ask

)

Dave Robbins · Post by **Dave Robbins** » 31 Dec 2001 8:51 pm

Pete,
"NO!"

Dave

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 1 Jan 2002 8:27 am

That's Cool.

Do Nashville steelers typically have other sources of income besides playing music?
Or is gigging enough to cover the cost of living?

FWIW...
I made about $3400 in gig money last year playing mostly weekend one-nighters at local Portland gigs and festivals.
I remember a good year playing 9-1:30 5-nighters in the mid 80's was around $17,000, and that was my only job... and I was having a blast![This message was edited by Pete Burak on 01 January 2002 at 08:44 AM.]

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 1 Jan 2002 10:43 am

Pete, Let's put it this way. If you are a musician in Nashville, working clubs alone isn't going to go very far. I'm very fortunate to be working one of the last house jobs in town but, I rely on recording sessions and c.d. sales to make up the slack.Alot of other guys and girls work other types of jobs to make ends meet or have a spouse that has a good job so they can pursue their music. Like I said I'm lucky I work fulltime in music and my wife works also. The pay scale for the clubs in Nashville doesn't keep up with the cost of living so we all do other things. Even if it did I would still want to do the other things I do in music and not just because the money. But Pete, It's none of your concern what other peoples income is no matter what they do for a living. Not trying to give you a hard time but you are getting yourself in a position to get alot of flack. I hope I have given you the information you want without offending you or anyone else. Alot of people think Nashville players make alot of money and some do but the majority does not. The ones that do are not working clubs. Mike

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 1 Jan 2002 12:49 pm

Music is a business and the law of supply and demand applies....the answer for a bricklayer or a steel guitar player who wants to work is to go where the demand is greater than the supply! www.genejones.com

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 1 Jan 2002 1:31 pm

Didn't mean to offend anyone.
Seems like alot of threads on the Nashville music scene this week.
Just trying to find out if anyone is actually making any money playing steel in Music City I guess.
[Insert "tact" here]

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 1 Jan 2002 1:45 pm

Pete, Don't worry everything is o.k. Yes some of us are making a living playing steel in Nashville but not solely in clubs. It can't be done. You have to have sessions and or other playing situations going on. Mike

Jim Phelps · Post by **Jim Phelps** » 1 Jan 2002 2:18 pm

Mike, say a steel picker shows up in Nashville one day, no one's ever heard of him before but he's got experience and he's an average player. What are his chances of getting any work in both clubs and studios? No, I ain't planning to move there but curious. Years ago they all talked about "the clique" in Nashville and said you had to be in the clique or you'd have a heck of a time getting anything until you somehow or other got accepted into "it".

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 1 Jan 2002 3:07 pm

Jim, you must be a lawyer...because lawyers never ask questions that they don't already know what the answer is!

www.genejones.com

Jason Odd · Post by **Jason Odd** » 1 Jan 2002 4:11 pm

In all fairness to Nashville cats past and present, they're looking for a certain something in the studio scene and the people who didn't really make it there include Bobby Black, Curly Chalker, Jimmy Bryant and multiple others. In some cases they were too surly (ahem.. Bryant), or just not pushy enough (Bobby Black probably), and there's a gazillion others who have a story about Nashville.
Steve Earle practically starved there for a decade, what can I say?
Yet plenty of fine people have built some incrediable careers there as well as a few duds.

Jim Phelps · Post by **Jim Phelps** » 1 Jan 2002 4:11 pm

NAHHH, I could never be a lawyer. I hate going to work everyday, like 2 hour lunches, getting paid $$$ for very little work......Hey, I'd have made a great lawyer!

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 1 Jan 2002 6:57 pm

Jim, I can't speak for every case but,when I came to town I knew a few people and just contacted them. Then I made the rounds to all the jam sessions in the clubs that were having them which were more plentifull then. I made more contacts and landed a job at one of those clubs when they decided to hire a steel player. During a 3 year stay at that club I made more contacts which still brings in sessions. The 7 years I've been at the palace I've made more contacts and hope to make more. I quit the first club to go on the road with Shawn Camp in '93 when he put his band together and I worked for him untill he lost his record deal but during that time I made more contacts on the road. I guess to answer your question you have to be in the right place at the right time. And Jason I will say that the studio scene does not want anyone around with an ego, so that was not Bobby Blacks problem. He has every trait that works in that environment. Who knows what the problem was. Maybe the good old boy politics of the south just considered someone from California an outsider. Whatever the reason it was and is our loss. Mike

Michael Holland · Post by **Michael Holland** » 1 Jan 2002 8:23 pm

[This message was edited by Michael Holland on 02 January 2002 at 06:42 PM.]

Franklin · Post by **Franklin** » 2 Jan 2002 12:55 pm

Sorry,
I mistakenly posted a response to a different Mike in this thread.

Ditto's to Sweeney who said it well.
[This message was edited by Franklin on 02 January 2002 at 02:57 PM.]

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 2 Jan 2002 3:10 pm

[This message was edited by Mike Sweeney on 02 January 2002 at 03:20 PM.]

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 2 Jan 2002 3:14 pm

O.K. Paul. Mike[This message was edited by Mike Sweeney on 02 January 2002 at 03:38 PM.]

John O Keeffe · Post by **John O Keeffe** » 5 Jan 2002 12:01 pm

I was in Nashville two years ago and I must saw We had a great time.
It was a great opportunity to see what things were like in the clubs and bars over there as compared to Ireland.
First of all I thought the majority of bands We heard in Lower Broadway were excellent.
You would not get Bands that size(4/5 pce) playing in similar venues in Ireland bascially because the would not get the money.
The Bars here mostly employ one two piece acts doing a mix of everything and they get paid much more than any of the Bands I saw in downtown Nashville.
However one would not survive here in the bar scene doing country music alone.
The Country Dance venues are sown up here with a handful of popular bands and its impossible for any new bands to break in.I know I've tried it various times with different people.
I think things are similar in the Country music scene all over. There has been a downturn here in Country music the past few years with an upsurge in Traditional Irish Music.
But again Trad Musicians play for a lot less money than anyone involved in other types of music.Mainly because theres an abundance of Trad players here now.

I don't know how any musician survives in Nashville with the poor pay but like somebody said there's always someone to step in to take peoples places.I guess its because there are so many musicians over there.
Just my 2C worth......JOHN

Bill Crook · Post by **Bill Crook** » 7 Jan 2002 6:49 am

Look at it this way.....

Guitar pickers (includeing Steel pickers)here in "Nashville" are a dime a dozen !!

There's one on every street corner.
and everyone of them can play better than..... (add your own word,words,players here)

So, givin this, it's no wonder that "Nashville" isn't the place to be if your just startin' out. The pay is whatever the club owner wants it to be as he knows that you can be replaced by a ...... wannabe singer,picker,or even a keroke machine.

The studios only want the "BEST" players due to time/cost factors. Them slots are already full !! So if your thinkin' of "Nashville" as a place to kick off your road to fame and fortune,Please have a day job and a spouce thats very understanding. It's a rought row to hoe down here. Especially if your new to the music field. This even includes song-writers.

[This message was edited by Bill Crook on 07 January 2002 at 10:24 AM.]

Geoff Brown · Post by **Geoff Brown** » 7 Jan 2002 1:52 pm

Just a quick thought..more of a question, really. Now I know Buck Owens wouldn't set foot here to open a club, but if he opened something like the Crystal Palace here, do you think it would float? Nice, upscale place..have some bands that are of good, opening act quality, with some recognition...have a big name every so often.
I'm inclined to think that it wouldn't work out, with tourism being what it is. I also think that fans of the not-so-contemporary country styles pretty much stay at home and spin their own tunes, while those who like the new stuff go to places like Denim and Diamonds in Madison, or a similar type of place.
But if you go to Printer's Alley on about any night, and go into Bourbon Street Blues and Boogie Bar, the place will be full. Great house band, great sound system, nice atmosphere. They have big-name acts all the time. Even opened a second venue. They are, by all appearances an exception to the rule downtown. People are willing to drop 5 bucks to get in the door. It seems that there are a lot of people here in town that like blues and r&b. I think the same applies to country, but I also wonder if the population of fans isn't older overall. They just don't go out like they used to.

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 7 Jan 2002 11:11 pm

Just remember guys, The Nashville Palace is a great place to "Club" in Nashville. 25 years old,Been using great musicians for it's entire life. Great music and food, friendly staff, and a great,safe, clean, place to take your entire family when in Nashville. There could not be a better place to enjoy good country music and see your favorite "star",Singer or player! Remember this successful club in this thread and in this town.Their payrole weekly to the musicians should be appreciated by all. Clubs arn't dead in Gnashville! Go to the palace!
Me,

John O Keeffe · Post by **John O Keeffe** » 8 Jan 2002 3:29 pm

Unfortunately "The Palace" was one of the places We didn't get to.....ran out of time I guess!

Maybe next time!

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 9 Jan 2002 12:10 pm

John, I sure hope you can come by the next time you are over here. Being of Irish descent I love meeting people from over there. Mike Sweeney

John O Keeffe · Post by **John O Keeffe** » 9 Jan 2002 2:16 pm

Would you beleive Mike I can recall clearly the night We were debating if We would go to the Nashville Palace or not.
We were with Smiley and I was chatting to my friend Kevin Owen outside "The Troubadour Theatre".
Kevin had to go somewhere after The Patsy Cline Show and if He had time to spare We would have went to The Palace.
I think We went back to downtown instead.
Will you be in Dallas??

...JOHN