Kemper or Tone X For Steel Amps

[Bob Snelgrove]

Anyone have both? Tone x is cheaper and newer but Kemper has been around. I see on the Forum that profiles are available for both units?

thx

bob

[Bob Snelgrove]

No one has both??

[Bill McCloskey]

for those interested, Tone Junkies is currently running a sale: $99 for ALL their kemper profiles; over 3000. I just got it and have been sampling the 65 Twin Reverb and Tweed Deluxe profiles all day. They sound absolutely amazing. I'll never need another kemper profile. https://tonejunkiestore.com/profile-pac ... thing-pack

[Doug Taylor]

I had both, I sold the KEMPER and kept the Tonex.

Both sound really good. Once I got Joe Rodgers Little Walter capture the Tonex became what I preferred!

Both are fantastic and you can’t go wrong either way.

[Bob Snelgrove]

Thanks, Doug

And you tried Tim's Kemper steel profiles?

bob

[Doug Taylor]

I never could get Tim’s profiles, he sent them but I never could get them to work. I did get Michael Britt’s steel profiles and they are excellent!

I was very happy with the Kemper but once I got in touch with Joe Rodgers, I just liked his captures the best.

[Bill McCloskey]

Your problem with Tim's profiles is that the ones he sent me were "performances" and you needed to add them under the "performance" folder of the rig manager, not the main rig folder. Once you load them as performances, they work fine.

[Bob Snelgrove]

Good to know.

Does Tim have to send them or can any member here share?

bob

[Bill McCloskey]

Technically anyone can share them once you have them. But I would reach out to Tim to get them.

[Bob Snelgrove]

Technically anyone can share them once you have them. But I would reach out to Tim to get them.

Still waiting (1 week) to hear back from Tim. (email and message)

bob

[Bill McCloskey]

I sent him an email.

[Bob Snelgrove]

I sent him an email.

Me too

[Bill McCloskey]

I just heard from Tim. He is currently in the hospital recovering from surgery and will send files as soon as he gets out and back home.

[Bob Snelgrove]

Besides Tim's profiles, are there any other steel amp specific profiles out there for free or purchase? Session 400, LTD, Quilter, Milkman, Webb, etc?

bob

[Bill McCloskey]

Tone Junkie has a sale of about 3,000 profiles for $99 https://tonejunkiestore.com/profile-pac ... thing-pack I bought it and the profiles are excellent.

If you are a subscriber to Paul Franklin's lesson, he has a link with a number of good profiles.

Mike Holder has some profiles available on the forum as well.

[Bob Snelgrove]

Tone Junkie has a sale of about 3,000 profiles for $99 https://tonejunkiestore.com/profile-pac ... thing-pack I bought it and the profiles are excellent.

If you are a subscriber to Paul Franklin's lesson, he has a link with a number of good profiles.

Mike Holder has some profiles available on the forum as well.

Cool, I'm a PFM member so I'll check it out

thx

[Tim Harr]

Hi Bob !
Sorry for the delay. I wasn’t ignoring. I had a robotic surgery to remove 10.5 cm of my sigmoid colon due to Diverticulitis. I’m healing well at home, tolerating light food, and all bodily functions are back to normal. I’m still sore.

I’ll send you what I have. Bill’s right. Load the performance files into the Rig Manager as a Performance. A “Performance” is a series of 5 “profiles” grouped together. Some call this a “bank.” I have a PSG Performance, Electric Guitar (Tele) Performance, and a Heavier Guitar Performance (Marshalls, etc.), for Acoustic instruments including (real Dobro).

** Important**: The Kemper isn’t like the Helix, Boss Katana, Fractal Axe FX, Profex, Line 6, etc. These units use electronic algorithms to model (or simulate)an amp’s sound. The Kemper and Tone X are true profilers. They take a sonic sample from the actual amplifier via a microphone to provide a clear reproduction of the profiled amp. When you hear a guitar played through a Kemper or Tone X, you’re essentially hearing a recording of that guitar/amp combination.

As a 30-year participant on the SGF, I understand how some react to challenges or bold statements. Here’s my challenge: listen to a pedal steel guitar played through a mic’d amp and then the same pedal steel guitar played through a quality Kemper profile of that amp. They’re identical, with slight tone changes due to running an amp direct vs. a high-quality microphone. The sounds are the same because they use the same amp/speaker combination. It would be very difficult to tell the difference. For those that say that can, no matter what.. then you are amazing. Congratulations.

In the past, I’ve used various steel amps, including Nashville 400, Webb, and Quilter. They were all fine, each with its personality. The Kemper was a game-changer.

To lighten the load, I made profiles of my LW 100w tube amp. I keep that amp at home and use it for recording sessions (3-4 a month, some at a studio, some at home via Logic Pro). I’ve used the Kemper on many recordings, but it’s fun to take the real LW to the studio sometimes. The Kemper spoils you, and one can get lazy.

I can easily use the Kemper Profiler for:
- Pedal Steel Guitar
- Electric Guitar
- Acoustic Guitar (Martin D28 - Fishman)
- Dobro(reso guitar)
- Electric Nylon String Guitar
- Baritone Guitar
- Nylon String Ukelele

Before, I had separate rigs for each instrument, which was expensive, crowded, and cumbersome. As a multi-instrumentalist playing various music and venues, I typically perform in Broadway-style musical pits, jazz guitar with a 3-4 piece combo playing the Real Book, and with a popular 8-piece 90’s Country Tribute Band called the “Stone Cold Cowboys”. Switching between instruments seamlessly is now possible. Before the Kemper, it was impossible to use multiple instruments on the same show with the same rig.
Here are some additional reasons why I like the Kemper Profiler Amp (powered):
- I can use an actual speaker, instead of a powered FRFR monitor cab.
- There are different sends for on-stage monitoring and front-of-house monitoring, with separate levels and EQ.
- Adjustments are easy and quick, with actual knobs for effect levels, volumes, treble and bass, etc...
- There is a graphic interface - a screen that you can use to make any adjustments you need to. Some pedals like the ToneEx do not offer many of these options, that I am aware of.
- All your performances (amp profiles) are backed up to one file. If you’re flying, you can leave your Kemper at home and carry your entire rig on a thumb drive. Plug it into the backline provided Kemper at the venue, and it’s “your” rig, set exactly as at home.
- Tremendous support and available resources via email, phone, and FaceTime. Power users are ready to help you learn to navigate the unit.
- You can profile any type of speaker and speaker microphone combination. For example, you can use the same Twin Reverb amp with 12” JBLs mic’d with a Neumann U67 Tube mic or 15” Eminence speaker mic’d up with a high-end Royer R-121 ribbon mic. The combinations are endless.

For Tele/B Bender, I like to use a Michael Britt profile for a 1964 blackface Fender Deluxe Reverb and 1966 Fender Princeton Reverb amp. I also have Dr Z, Vox AC 30, and Dumble amps that I dial up when needed. For Archtop or 335-type guitar, I use a great profile of a blackface 66 Fender Super Reverb or a Michael Britt profile of a Polytone Jazz Amp.

The PSG Performance I am sending you, are mostly direct profiles from my LW PF 89 (100w all tube) head through an Eminence PF-350 (12") cabinet using a SGBB and a Telonics Volume pedal.

Pedal Steel Guitar
<1> Reverb & Delay - LW 89
- Studio EQ
- Reverb
- Delay (tap tempo)
My main profile where I dial reverb and delay in and out as needed

<2> PF 90's - LW 89
- Studio EQ
- Reverb
- Delay
This profile is a go to for Paul's 80's/90's studio sound. Think Alan Jackson and a dryer 'room' reverb. A hint of quick delay only fattens it up a slight bit.

<3> Pedal Steel Modulations - NV 400 w/ BW 15"
- Studio EQ
- Rotary Speaker (B3)
- Vintage Stereo Chorus
- Legacy Delay
- Natural Reverb
This profile is a go to on occasion for a few Joe Diffie, Kenny Chesney, Shania Twain, songs where heavier effects were used on the recordings (Sonny Garrish, John Hughey, PF, etc)
Of course, not everything is used all on at once. The Rotary effect is dead on for a B3 sound using the right voicings.

<4> Dirty Lap Steel - 1956 Fender Pro Amp
- Compressor
- Studio EQ
- Natural Reverb
- Ibanez Tube Screamer
The amp breaks up really well and usually no additional OD is needed. I use this on "God Blessed Texas" and "TROUBLE" type stuff.

<5> Matchbro - A Kemper factory amp with EQ flat. A profile built using a Goodrich Matchbro
- Compressor
- Studio EQ
- Delay
- Reverb
I use this on any tune we do that has prominent recorded Dobro. "What Was I Thinking" by Dirks Bentley comes to mind.

Feel free to reach out to me with any questions, clarifications, etc.. I am 100% committed to helping anyone who needs help..or wants a sounding board to figure out how to get the most out of the Kemper. It in no way replaces an actual amp, it is not supposed to. It is simply a very high quality and versatile solution that solves a number of issues.

[Bob Snelgrove]

Thanks, Tim!

Speedy recovery to you! I have DV so I feel your pain(literally) Hopefully not at your level!

bob

[Tim Harr]

Please, send me your actual email address? The surgery cut out all of the DV affected colon. Once I heal up, I can live without the pain and random flares of DV.

Thanks !
TH

[Bob Snelgrove]

Please, send me your actual email address? The surgery cut out all of the DV affected colon. Once I heal up, I can live without the pain and random flares of DV.

Thanks !
TH

Done! What speaker/cab do you find most replicates the captured profiles? I'm still deciding on the powered or non-powered head, stage or player. I have stereo steel cabs with Eminence 15' speakers, not sure if that would be a good combo?

Thanks again and get well

bob

[Tim Harr]

I mainly use the same speaker live that I made when I created the profile. (Eminence PF-350 12"). The powered Kemper has a 600w power amp and pushes the real speaker very nicely. Tons of headroom. There is only one (real) speaker output on the powered Kemper. Your 15" Stereo Steel cabinet would be a great match for the powered Kemper.
I have used a 15" powered FRFR monitor as my "on stage speaker". Not a fan. I do not care for the FRFR powered monitor or the Kemper Kone speaker for pedal steel guitar. I do wish that I could connect two speaker cabinets to the powered Kemper. I am used to one cab now and it's totally fine. I have seen some 3rd party splitters that would allow two cabs. Not that big of a deal for me.

My advice would be the powered Kemper rack. The "toaster" design is awkward to use on stage sometimes. The Kemper Stage pedalboard design is also awkward, in my opinion. Takes up more space than I want to use. If you have used a rack at your side in the past, the Kemper rack will feel natural.

Here is a brief description of various Kemper Outputs:

[Bob Snelgrove]

Great stuff, Tim!

What cab do you have the PF-350 in? LW?

thx

bob

[Tim Harr]

custom built, open back cabs.

[Michael Hartz]

Hey Tim, for that Sonny Garrish, early Kenny Chesney sound, have you tried the double tracker on the Kemper? It allows you to get that “She’s Got It All” double tracked sound and when you loosen it up/detune it you can get that Doyle Grisham sound on Randy Travis’ “1982.”

[Corbin Pratt]

I've had Kempers, Tonex, and the Strymon Iridium for a while. They all sound great. I'll be honest, the Iridium w/ York Audio IRs sound best for steel in my opinion. I could never get the delays to sound that great on the Kemper. I prefer using my pedal board and I can just throw the iridium on my board. Super convenient and takes no work to make it sound good.