Please help my Rick B8 Bakelite

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 29 Mar 2023 1:41 pm

Folks- I’m begging for some serious help-
So I acquired this Rick B8, and pickup is a bit funny,
It seems output is somewhat balanced for top 7 strings but the last 8th drops
the volume down to 1/3… I know this particular Horst shoe pickup is somewhat
different from my A-22( which, years ago, Rick Aiello helped me out how to clean
the ground contact)
It’s hard to see, but there is a pole piece there but it’s not extruding the head from bobbin like others…

I’m sure it probably needs re-magnetizing somewhat, but nonetheless, in current condition, 8th string is unusable ( yet works)-

Any suggestions? If anyone expert about horse shoe PU, I’m happy to take off the whole unit and send it in-

Help! Help!

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 29 Mar 2023 1:44 pm

Noah Miller · Post by **Noah Miller** » 29 Mar 2023 2:06 pm

A lot of 8-string Rickenbacker pickups have poor balance on the outer strings because the strings are over the very edges of the coil. The 6- and 7-string versions never seem to have this issue because the spread isn't quite as wide. I've owned a few 8-string Ricks and from what I can tell, it's the luck of the draw. I don't have the experience to say it can't be fixed, but I have seen the issue raised multiple times without a solution.

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 29 Mar 2023 2:15 pm

Ah.. thanks for reply- that’s somewhat what I thought-
Top 1st is strong, it’s just the bottom 8th-
Anyone know if there’s someone out there make new bobbin with more proper pole piece design? I don’t know Jason Roller wants to get involved in something like this.. does anyone know?

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 29 Mar 2023 4:18 pm

I heard Lollar no longer offer personal rewind type of work- I can see that, at his level, it’s too much to deal with.
Does anyone out there know more about Bakelite PU? It is different construction design than typical frypan PU-

Acoustically, LOVE the tone of Bakelite.

Rick Aiello · Post by **Rick Aiello** » 29 Mar 2023 4:19 pm

Nick can take care of you ... http://fryerguitarpickups.com/ ... he does excellent work ... fabricating and winding bobbins

John Dahms · Post by **John Dahms** » 29 Mar 2023 4:26 pm

I don't want to seem patronizing but could it be the string itself? A fresh steel string may be able to produce a better signal and at least by some time until you decide on a pickup fix.
I expect the single pole could be remagged but it might get complicated to keep from affecting the pole(s) near it.
Rick Aiello might just suggest remagging the whole works. I think magnets take what they take and if all goes well they would all end up the same.
All things being what they are a 7-string Ric would be the dream of a lot of people.

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 29 Mar 2023 4:34 pm

True, point well taken. But I don’t think it’s string because it’s a fresh set of C6-
What’s peculiar here is, pole pieces have staggered height of heads sticking out of bobbin Ala Fender Stratocaster, 7th and 8th pole pieces are almost flat with bobbin, but 7th ring out ok but 8th dramatically lacks output volume-
Because I know enough to put myself in trouble, I was thinking about glueing a little piece of steel on top of that 8th pole piece…. Crazy idea, I know-

Rick, should I just talk to your guy and see what he says??

Joe A. Roberts · Post by **Joe A. Roberts** » 29 Mar 2023 7:01 pm

Let us know if you get it sorted out. That certainly is a beautiful instrument.
I have always wanted to get a Rickenbacker DW-16 but have been hesitant because of the bad reputation of the 8 string pickups!

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 30 Mar 2023 1:59 am

Sure will !!

Rick Aiello · Post by **Rick Aiello** » 30 Mar 2023 2:43 am

Hiro Keitora wrote: Rick, should I just talk to your guy and see what he says??

He's already done some 8 string Ricky bobbins ... same problem as yours ...

He's a forum member ..?"

PS I'll be glad to remag the horseshoes ... if you want to try this first

Let me know ...

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 30 Mar 2023 3:33 am

I just contacted Nick-
Let me see, you’re in VA, he’s in OH.
Let me see what how we can work this out, I’ll email you when I get home from work-

At the meantime, completely different subject, but anyone has any recommendations for “ drop-in” replacement tuners for B-8??
I should take care of that part while pickup is out of body traveling-
Many thanks, guys!

Noah Miller · Post by **Noah Miller** » 30 Mar 2023 3:52 am

Hiro Keitora wrote:At the meantime, completely different subject, but anyone has any recommendations for “ drop-in” replacement tuners for B-8??
I should take care of that part while pickup is out of body traveling-
Many thanks, guys!

Rickenbacker must have used half a dozen different tuners on the Bs. From the little I can see of your headstock they look like Kluson buttons, but a better pic will help. The 8-stringers used mandolin tuners, and you can get replica Kluson mando sets. However, if the issue is crumbling buttons (a common issue on Klusons), you can also replace the buttons.

Joe Burke · Post by **Joe Burke** » 30 Mar 2023 3:57 am

I had Nick Fryer rebuild an 8 string Rickenbacker horseshoe pick up. He did a great job.

Garry Vanderlinde · Post by **Garry Vanderlinde** » 30 Mar 2023 12:07 pm

Does your pickup look like this? Higher treble poles on the left. Have you tried adjusting the bass side closer to the strings or maybe a larger diameter string?

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 30 Mar 2023 2:39 pm

Yup, it looks just like that- what’s peculiar is 1 down to 7 are somewhat balanced, it’s just that 8th drops out.
I’m talking to Nick and I’ll send the PU unit to him as soon as I have time to take it apart-

Thank you so much, Rick!!
Oh, this is exciting—

Garry Vanderlinde · Post by **Garry Vanderlinde** » 30 Mar 2023 7:44 pm

Rick Aiello wrote:

PS I'll be glad to remag the horseshoes ... if you want to try this first

Let me know ...

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 30 Mar 2023 9:47 pm

With that coil, I can see why outer pole pieces have less turns of wire than rest of the 6… it’s a fundamental design issue of the bobbin-

Rick Aiello · Post by **Rick Aiello** » 31 Mar 2023 7:20 am

The magnet wire makes a continuous ellipse around all 8 poles ... so the number of turns around is constant ...

Here is an 8 stringers bobbin with some of the Bakelite chipped away at an end pole ...

The design flaw is that the 1 & 8 poles go too "deep" into the horseshoe's curvature ... where the number of lines of force decreases ... the greatest number of lines of force are at the "front edges" of the magnet (at the little gap between the two horseshoes) .

Magnetizing them to the max helps ... as does making a new bobbin with alnico poles supplementing the horseshoe magnets flux density in those weaker areas ...

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 31 Mar 2023 7:25 am

Makes so much sense now- I’m going for Alnico 5 ,
It’s almost like, stringmaster built- in between horse shoe-
How cool is that!!

Rick Aiello · Post by **Rick Aiello** » 31 Mar 2023 7:45 am

Another work around is to build a bobbin with adjustable steel pole pieces ... so you can tweak all 8 poles for even output ..,

Just don't try and push those steel slugs in the Bakelite bobbin ... some are in there loose enough to move ... some are hammered in tight ... and any attempt to move them will break the Bakelite

Garry Vanderlinde · Post by **Garry Vanderlinde** » 1 Apr 2023 12:34 am

Hiro Keitora wrote:Yup, it looks just like that-

Well, that's a perfectly good 8 string Rickenbacker pickup, very, very rare and valuable. Get a new bobbin wound if you must, but keep the original intact. Rick re-maged my horseshoes and it sings like a Byrd...
P.S. maybe that's why Jerry played a 7 string

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 1 Apr 2023 3:35 am

I thought about it- maybe time to finally adapt Bobby Ingano 7 string C6

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 14 Apr 2023 2:26 pm

Thank you guys !!
Nick is great, and it’s well “worth it” to say good-bye to that design flawed bobbin.
Thanks again , guys!
I’m gabby blast ‘

Hiro Keitora · Post by **Hiro Keitora** » 14 Apr 2023 11:59 pm