Will True Country Music Make A Comeback Without Deviations?

Dana Blodgett · Post by **Dana Blodgett** » 30 Jun 2014 2:03 pm

Storm,yes I can read English,in fact I am a voracious reader!I can also speak it and stay on topic if needed...I'm not lookin' for an argument,just tryin' to understand the topic,and why it keeps resurfacing?
About capos(drift)I personally haven't used one in about 50 years because I haven't found one that does not damage the back of the neck,although I like the idea of using one, it's not for me.
Why can't a pedal steel guitar be useful in other genres of music other than "True Country music?" Is not the Telecaster used in ALL genres of music? Or for that matter the acoustic guitar?
PS: like your name by the way...

Craig A Davidson · Post by **Craig A Davidson** » 30 Jun 2014 2:18 pm

Dana Blodgett wrote:...returning to the topic of original post...What is the definition of true Country music? Staying in the confines of a 1-4-5 chord progression? Any song with Pedal steel guitar in it or lap steel,fiddle?

Dana that is what I kept asking but never got an answer. All I got was a reply that it doesn't have any capo usage in it. Guess that rules out any bluegrass. Del McCurry and Ricky Skaggs must be another genre.

Dana Blodgett · Post by **Dana Blodgett** » 30 Jun 2014 2:35 pm

Craig,there is no correct answer, in my opinion the pedal steel guitar can be used in many different genres like Rock, country rock,jazz...you get the picture, why not? I personally hear the steel in many commercials even!I don't know what a capo has anything to do with the original topic?

Craig A Davidson · Post by **Craig A Davidson** » 30 Jun 2014 2:39 pm

Dana I agree with since I have used it in several genres myself. But Bill seems to have a problem telling us what true country music is. Grandpa Jones was a loooooooong time ago. Going by that, I guess he thinks Buck, Merle, and Johnny Cash were something else. Sorry I can't talk in circles like he does but I only have a 12th grade education. I don't have a Masters in BS.

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 30 Jun 2014 2:41 pm

As a steel guitarist, I interpret new country to be a source of DRONING. The trebling sounds that were once heard coming from the steel guitar, can only be heard with great effort somewhere buried in the back of all the thumping and droning. New country advocates are enjoying more than their share of field days. Tipping the scales in favor of rescheduling the familiar brighter tones of the steel guitar would be a worthwhile goal. A new twist may be all that is needed to whisk a new generation back to reality.

Craig A Davidson · Post by **Craig A Davidson** » 30 Jun 2014 2:43 pm

Finally Bill you write something I understand and I agree with you.

Dana Blodgett · Post by **Dana Blodgett** » 30 Jun 2014 2:50 pm

Craig,I've played the pedal steel for a long while now,am still not that proficient(big word)at it and have gone thru so many styles of music and hate to be "pidgeon holed" to "True Country Music" I would prefer to call it "Cosmic American Music" or "Classic Country" myself.

Chuck Thompson · Post by **Chuck Thompson** » 30 Jun 2014 2:53 pm

Dana Im sure Stormy was joking about Bill's narrow view and not intending the comment directly at you.

Craig , I don't believe he can give a definitive answer because the genre is too wide with so many changes through the years. I have personally come to believe that many (including myself at times) long for the delusion called "the good old days" when all the songs were good and liked by all. They never existed. Check any chart date in the past and we will find that although old songs we like may have been there, the majority of the chart was something we probably didn't like so much or wasn't so "country".

I forgot to mention open tunings. I wonder if Bill realizes that Chet Atkins was fond of altered and open tunings. He often dropped the 2 lowest strings a whole step producing a veritable open G with 6th added and even risked Bill's derision by playing in open G and open D!!! (check out "Black Mountain Rag" and "The Odd Folks of Ocracoke" It would be a giggle to hear Bill try to replicate them note for note with standard tuning. If he thinks he can then he hasn't developed his ear as much as he may have beguiled himself into believing.

One can narrow their view to the point that they must put on blinders and ear muffs to maintain a position that reality destroys. Has Bill looked into the possibilities of splitting the a and b pedals or using an e-f knee lever?

Dana Blodgett · Post by **Dana Blodgett** » 30 Jun 2014 2:55 pm

Ok anybody...what is the definition of true country music?

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 30 Jun 2014 2:57 pm

Craig,

I'm always in favor of tossing the hatchet overboard. Thanks again for your generous exchanges.

Dana Blodgett · Post by **Dana Blodgett** » 30 Jun 2014 3:02 pm

Chuck, I really didn't take Storms post as a neg,maybe it came out that way...I am also fond of altered or open tunings such as Taro patch and Wahine,used to play a lot of bottleneck slide on acoustic and electric in standard tuning and open E on my SG & Les Pauls.

Storm Rosson · Post by **Storm Rosson** » 30 Jun 2014 3:13 pm

Dana Blodgett wrote:Storm,yes I can read English,in fact I am a voracious reader!I can also speak it and stay on topic if needed...I'm not lookin' for an argument,just tryin' to understand the topic,and why it keeps resurfacing?
About capos(drift)I personally haven't used one in about 50 years because I haven't found one that does not damage the back of the neck,although I like the idea of using one, it's not for me.
Why can't a pedal steel guitar be useful in other genres of music other than "True Country music?" Is not the Telecaster used in ALL genres of music? Or for that matter the acoustic guitar?
PS: like your name by the way...

Dana ,I'm in near perfect agreement with YOU and your views about this seriously redundant and a general pita thread. My previous remark was indeed meant to be taken with an AMPLE amount of sarcasm with tongue firmly implanted in cheek, def not dissin u bro. Have a good 'un...Stormy

Chuck Thompson · Post by **Chuck Thompson** » 30 Jun 2014 3:16 pm

Dana - my opinion again - but for what it's worth. I don't think there can be a simple definition. For the purposes of people around this forum it might be as simple as the times (that ebbed and flowed) where the steel was prominent. In that case a lot of Jim Reeves early Waylon Alabama and Shenandoah aren't "country".

Some will say it has to have a Telecaster (many recordings didn't feature a fender guitar and you can check old Wilburn Bros shows where Jimmy Capps is playing a Gibson).

Some will say 3 chords. Night Life featuring Buddy Emmons just became disqualified.

Some will say the content and simplicity of the lyrics. If that is the case who can argue against the majority of "modern country"?

Dana finally (and way off topic) - Looking at your gear im quite envious! You have some nice guitars and amps! If youre 77 Les Special is sunburst Im then in a jealous rage! I had one and wished I still had it! P90's! I love em.

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 30 Jun 2014 3:38 pm

Chuck,

I want to say.. I know a trick worth two of that. It could be true.. than again it could be overstated. It appears that the Spanish guitar is your main instrument. (just guessing) It appears rather silly when your thoughts conjure up a mistaken notion about the E-F change on the pedal steel.

Dana Blodgett · Post by **Dana Blodgett** » 30 Jun 2014 3:40 pm

Chuck, I know I won't get a answer from Mr. Bill on my question because there is no answer! Thanks for the kudos about my equipment...and No the '77 lpdblcut jr. P90's is not a Sunburst-those are very rare! Mine is Heritage Cherry I believe(wine red)...it's a limited edition model of a '58 a reissue I assume,it's a screamer for sure ,I am the original owner too. I am very fortunate to have these guitars,My SG is currently being used by my son in his AC/DC Tribute band "High Voltage" and will be playing at the Ca. Mid State Fair in July.

Chuck Thompson · Post by **Chuck Thompson** » 30 Jun 2014 3:59 pm

Bill I find no way to make any sense of your post unless you are saying that there aren't possibilities in the e-f lever.

My analogy isn't as esoteric as it may appear. If issues like a capo or other than standard guitar tuning causes you heartburn then anything other than Bud Isaac's tuning could also cause you to stumble.

On the positive side.... let me encourage to explore some possibilities where your perhaps well meaning but misguided tunnel vision causes you to reign in a great deal of learning potential. Spend a year experimenting with a capo and altered and open tunings. There is a whole world outside!

P.S. If it be of any consolation, I will confess that that my view regarding the capo and open tunings was the same as yours is now nearly 40 years ago when I was 16 and very inexperienced.

Chuck Thompson · Post by **Chuck Thompson** » 30 Jun 2014 3:59 pm

Dana yup! beautiful! I had a sunburst limited edition. Great Guitar and good for your son! That must be a fun tribute band

Bud Angelotti · Post by **Bud Angelotti** » 30 Jun 2014 4:17 pm

Dana - I love that guitar! Back in the 70's, when telephones were attached to walls, a pal of mine had a '58 JR. We used to disturb the neighbors.
As far as "real" country music "coming back", who cares. One can listen to just about anything nowadays via the web, and there are folks carrying the torch and doing an outstanding job of it. Popular = $$$
Will it come back? I hope not. Don't get me wrong, I love the old country music. The word of the day is EVOLUTION. Evolve, adapt, or perish. Yes, I pine for the good old days also. Then I come to my senses(sometimes) and try to remember, These are the good old days.
Sleep tight, don't let the bedbugs bite.

Dana Blodgett · Post by **Dana Blodgett** » 30 Jun 2014 4:46 pm

http://player.vimeo.com/video/96974403 Thanks Bud & Chuck here's my son on the SG..

Bob Simons · Post by **Bob Simons** » 30 Jun 2014 7:41 pm

If my memory serves me, there was a time when Willy Nelson and Waylon Jennings were highly suspect, Austin pop singers who were departing from "true Nashville country music."

Where does this end?

By the way, Barry, thank you for the spell check. I should learn to hit that button more often. My grammar is typically good, my typing-terrible and there is this age thing that is creeping into everythingI do...half the time I can't remember which is the hot water tap and which is the cold! And don't ask me to recite my cope dent rapidly! My hands and legs know where everything is but my brain still doesn't.

Also, regards to Bill, he makes little sense to me, but he is a most sincere and determined exponent of pedal steel excellence, however you define it. I'm just more interested in songs than instrumental acrobatics.

Bud Angelotti · Post by **Bud Angelotti** » 30 Jun 2014 7:52 pm

Hows about it ends here .

Written in 1969.

Jerry Hedge · Post by **Jerry Hedge** » 2 Jul 2014 5:55 pm

Mr. Hankey, when I was younger I shared your disdain for capos and those who used them UNTIL I saw Segovia in concert using one. That proved their validity as a tool to me.

Lee Baucum · Post by **Lee Baucum** » 2 Jul 2014 6:56 pm

Lee Baucum wrote:
Lee Baucum wrote:Who gets to define "true country music"?
Who gets to define "true country music"?

Who gets to define "true country music"?

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 3 Jul 2014 6:19 am

Jerry Hedge,

Some time ago I became a experimentalist with a "bar" that could be placed beneath the strings of a steel guitar. The idea was to change the pitch of the steel guitar tunings. It would be possible to explore multiple tunings by figuration changes (notches) in the "bar". I was "toying" with the idea of simulating the 6th tuning while using the familiar 9th tuning on the instrument. I learned that bridge to bridge differences alter the preferred mellow resonance, much like the dreaded capo when used on the Spanish guitar.

Bill Hankey · Post by **Bill Hankey** » 3 Jul 2014 6:54 am

Lee Baucum,

Country music with a "Once Upon A Time" prologue would serve as a introductory opening for a book of 500 pages describing how bread and butter entertainment was deftly replaced by unproven middle of the road musicians, who are happy to hop on the band wagon.

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Will True Country Music Make A Comeback Without Deviations?

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