Behringer BP100

Chuck Morel · Post by **Chuck Morel** » 21 Feb 2014 5:42 am

Hello, wondering if anyone uses this preamp/booster with their rig and if so how do you like it. If you don't like it why? Thanks. Chuck M

Dave Grafe · Post by **Dave Grafe** » 21 Feb 2014 9:10 am

Personally I steer clear of Behringer karma at all times...

Jack Hargraves · Post by **Jack Hargraves** » 26 Feb 2014 9:14 pm

I steer clear of Behringer also.

Jimmy Gibson · Post by **Jimmy Gibson** » 27 Feb 2014 2:02 am

Ok we all don`t like the same things and have our opinions BUT, Why don`t you guys like Behringer products? I may have been lucky because I have used Behringer pedals amps and Mixers for many years and have not had any problems with any of them,and as a spare I have a Behringer DD600 Delay pedal, and it was only about a quarter of the price of the Boss DD3 but IMHO is just as good. There are many of us older members that can`t afford the top of the range gear so we have to make do with the less expensive gear and IMHO the Behringer range of products are not only a lot cheaper ok maybe not every ones cup of tea, but they still gets the job done and to me that's all that matters. So unless you have had a bad experience with Behringer gear why don`t you like them?
Just to add I use a Behringer Pre Amp Pedal on steel and guitar and it does a great job.

Jimmy.

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 27 Feb 2014 3:42 am

Behringer got the bad rap, at least in the US, because the initial products were merely reverse engineered, lower quality, copies. Behringer was considered "throwaway" devices - if it broke you couldn't get it fixed.

However, in recent times, they are starting to produce some "professional" quality devices. e.g. the Behringer X32 digital recording mixer is getting rave reviews.

There was a similar thread recently on the Cakewalk Sonar recording forum about Behringer. It garnered a lot of responses and just about every one was about positive experiences with their Behringer equipment.

The "made in China" label on Behringer is typical of music electronics. Look at a lot of Peavey and it is now made in China. Mackie, which is considered "top end" equipment is made in China.

I have a Roland Octa-Capture recording interface unit and an MAudio Fastrack Ultra8R recording interface and they are both made in China. I have a Korg control surface, it too is China. Previously I had a Focusrite Saffire Pro 40 recording interface unit, made in China and Focusrite is a British company.

Jimmy Gibson · Post by **Jimmy Gibson** » 27 Feb 2014 4:48 am

Jack I think you have hit the nail on the head, maybe it`s the made in China that gives the Behringer a bad name, I have had only good service from the Behringer products I have used and couldn't care less where they are made as long as they do the job.I think It's just the snobbish attitude that some people have against cheaper products I agree that some of the real cheap products are not that good but it don`t mean they are all rubbish because they don`t cost a fortune. Behringer are reasonably
priced but IMHO are still good value for the money.

Jimmy.

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 27 Feb 2014 5:59 am

Its not just the "China". Behringer as I noted when they first came on the US market, was mostly low end (cheaply made) copies of other equipment. Most of it did not work well (e.g. noisy audio) and did not last long before it broke and repair was mostly non existent. Thus it got the earned bad reputation.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 27 Feb 2014 6:09 am

The problem with behringer for me is that they take the hard work and personal investment of small builders and just copy it. Imagine coming up with a great new product and finally getting a little success then some big company with marketing power makes a crappy very cheap version. Not only destroying your ability to make a living or continue to innovate but degrading your original product. There basic business model is legal but not ethical. Maybe they are branching off into doing there own work instead of being a parasite on the work of others these days. But when I see behringer I see low bid labor , cheapest possible components and sleazy business practices.

Bill Duncan · Post by **Bill Duncan** » 27 Feb 2014 6:26 am

I think the line has become blurred with off shore manufacturing. Many if not most companies are doing the Chinese thing. Peavey is there now. If the truth be known almost all of our six string guitars are foreign built, though they say "Made in the USA", maybe, (most probably) not!

As for copying someone else's work/idea, that's as old as commerce.

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 27 Feb 2014 3:44 pm

Yes, Bill. But until the patents expire, it's illegal. But once it's in the public domain, that's how it's SUPPOSED to work: that's why patents have always been shorter than copyrights.
And wrong. I'd respect them more if they'd reverse-engineer out-of-production popular gear, like the RV-3.
The biggest problem with their earlier gear from a performance standpoint lay in their substitution of cheapest parts with little concern for the sound.
I'd still rather, from a moral point, buy the gear that Uri cloned rather than the clone.

Jimmy Gibson · Post by **Jimmy Gibson** » 28 Feb 2014 2:06 am

I think the problem is that someone has bought a product from Behringer ,and have been unlucky to get a faulty item, so they assume the products from that company are all crap.

As I said I have never had any problems with any Behringer product, and to add i have paid for top brand gear that didn`t last very long and broke i put that down to being unlucky,but it did not stop me buying the same brand because of one bad item.

A bit off topic but it is a fact some people have had bad Sho-Buds/Emmons/ect and because of a bad experience with a Bud/Emmons ect they steer clear of that brand. It's just the same with every thing and think about it thousands of items are made and dispatched all over the world so faulty goods can and do slip through the system.

So please don`t give up on a product because of one bad apple.

Jimmy.

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 28 Feb 2014 3:43 am

There are two issues, as previously mentioned that got Behringer a bad name, at least in the US. First the reverse engineering cheap knock offs. Second was reliability.

Not everyone, such as yourself, were unhappy with Behringer, but many were.

Funny thing, I tried a Behringer copy of the RV3, last year. Its sound and function is better than the RV3! It is housed in a plastic case instead of metal, and I don't know what components are inside but I know that the Behringer copy does not slightly change the tone like the "real"RV3's do (I tried 3 separate new RV3's and they all slightly changed the tone. A friend tried several and came up with the same conclusion).

Bill Duncan · Post by **Bill Duncan** » 28 Feb 2014 4:31 am

I've bought Behringer products and have found them to be very good. They supply products people want at a competitive price and I find no problem with that.

I don't see reverse engineering as an unpardonable sin. It is done by every successful manufacturing entity at some point. I've done it in my work with every company I've ever worked for. Any time we heard of a new product or process we went out and bought the competitors products and checked them out. If we saw something worthy we copied it. Even today I make it a point to question salesmen who come in to see me about our competitors products and processes.

If a company wants to survive it had better stay on top of what's being done by it's competitors.

Manufacturing and sales is not for the timid, and being aggressive is not a bad attribute, if you want to succeed!

A successful manufacturer is, or should be among their competitors most loyal customers. First in line for the new product.

Dave Grafe · Post by **Dave Grafe** » 28 Feb 2014 8:49 am

I don't see reverse engineering as an unpardonable sin. It is done by every successful manufacturing entity at some point. I've done it in my work with every company I've ever worked for. Any time we heard of a new product or process we went out and bought the competitors products and checked them out. If we saw something worthy we copied it. Even today I make it a point to question salesmen who come in to see me about our competitors products and processes.

But did your companies actually dis-assemble the competitors products, photo-copy the circuit boards, and send the stuff lists and purloined PCB images to China to be built with the cheapest possible parts? This is highly illegal, and Uri B. has paid millions in damages to date from doing so, but in the process he has made billions, thanks to folks who only care if the new toys are cheap enough for them to afford.

It has nothing to do with the country of origin or somebody getting a bad unit, many of us steer entirely clear of Behringer KARMA, i.e. the bad juju surrounding business entities whose MO involves not copying but stealing the work of others (including some very good friends of mine), reproducing it in the cheapest possible form, and then using the ill-gotten profits to buy legitimate competitors - often the same ones that they stole from to get the money in the first place - to consolidate market share and reduce competition.

Behringer has been successfully sued by several major manufacturers for their antics, including Mackie and dbx, and they simply paid the damages and continued their rip-off scheme with impunity, knowing that consumers will buy cheap no matter the ethics involved. At this point Uri Behringer has made so much money stealing the output of other engineering departments that he can afford to buy out premium companies such as Midas and at least have the appearance of a legitimate manufacturer, but a crook is still a crook, and those who choose to remain ignorant of the facts and purchase unethically produced gear because it is "affordable" are the largest part of the problem.

Bill Duncan · Post by **Bill Duncan** » 28 Feb 2014 10:39 am

In my work we do not manufacture to retail, but I do have customers that bring me items made by other companies, domestic and foreign, and want me to duplicate them.

I don't know anything about Behringer other than what is in the sales pitch of the company selling the item. Any more than I do about Roland, Mackie, or Alvarez-Yari, yet I have bought their products. As a consumer it would be very difficult to investigate every company I buy from to see how ethical their business models are. So I buy for value. Probably the same for most other folks.

It could get us in the weeds awfully deep to be so political about the products we purchase. I've heard disturbing stories about some of the steel guitar builders, but I bought my guitars on value and product appeal and so far it has worked out.

Jimmy Gibson · Post by **Jimmy Gibson** » 28 Feb 2014 10:57 am

Bill, I also buy what I can afford and Behringer to me are a great alternative to many top brands and I don`t give a hoot to how they are made or where they are made, as long as they do what they are intended to do and do it well for a cheaper price that`s ok with me.

So if any of you don`t like a product you DON`T HAVE TO BUY IT So why run it down because you don`t like it?

JG

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 28 Feb 2014 11:34 am

I was unaware that behringer was actually doing illegal activities as a part of there business model and then just buying there way out of trouble.

For you guys that only care about what price you pay there are great deals on music gear from people that steal musical equipment that has been left in tour van trailers. Theft is as old as commerce or maybe even older ! Might as well benefit from it when you can.

Jimmy Gibson · Post by **Jimmy Gibson** » 28 Feb 2014 12:26 pm

Bob,What's buying stolen gear got to do with this topic? I thought This is about like`s and dislikes of some brands of gear. I buy most of my gear from either Ebay or a music shop not down some alleyway or bar.

JG..

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 28 Feb 2014 12:40 pm

Chuck Morel wrote:Hello, wondering if anyone uses this preamp/booster with their rig and if so how do you like it. If you don't like it why? Thanks. Chuck M

I haven't tried it because I don't see the need for a preamp/booster in a steel guitar rig. Most steel guitars have much hotter pickups than standard guitars. Why would you need a preamp/booster?

I used a small Behringer mixer for a while, before I got a larger Mackie. No quality problem, good price. I have a Behringer Vintage Phaser and I like it better than any other phaser I've used.

The BP100 preamp/booster sells for about $25. If I thought I needed a signal booster for any reason, I'd try it. It's not a big investment.

Jimmy Gibson · Post by **Jimmy Gibson** » 28 Feb 2014 1:24 pm

The reason I use a Pre amp booster sometimes is I sometimes play keyboard and use a Behringer Keyboard amp with low impedance inputs, and by using the Pre amp pedal through the send and return on the amp it boosts and gives the steel and guitar a lot more gain without any breakup. I just turn it off when I play the keyboard. Works great, and the steel sounds really good through the keyboard amp with the Pre Amp.

JG..

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 28 Feb 2014 1:39 pm

Jimmy Gibson wrote:Bob,What's buying stolen gear got to do with this topic? I thought This is about like`s and dislikes of some brands of gear. I buy most of my gear from either Ebay or a music shop not down some alleyway or bar.

JG..

Jimmy, at the risk of flogging a dead horse, what the folks are saying is that Behringer gear was stolen (from a moral standpoint, although possibly not always from a legal one) before it was even made. No different than a pirated DVD.

Bill Duncan · Post by **Bill Duncan** » 28 Feb 2014 2:13 pm

The Japanese companies originally did a great deal of copying in the sixties and seventies. Now the Chinese have gone that route.

Leo Fender, so I have heard was not above sneaking a peek at Bob Crooks' creations. There are even some stories around as to whether the first Fender guitars were a creation of Leo Fender, or possibly the first prototypes a creation of Merle Travis/Paul Bigsby.

If someone feels a moral obligation to refrain from purchasing products manufactured by a particular company, by all means do so. However, I in no way feel bound to follow your lead.

A for profit company is not a benevolent organization. They are serious about profits.

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 28 Feb 2014 2:24 pm

Behringer is a German company. Copying is not an issue to some. However, copying and putting out an inferior product copy is an issue.

Not all Behringer falls into this category. I have a Behringer BCF2000 control surface, which is a knockoff of the Mackie and it works well. It even uses the Mackie mode/setup in my recording studio programs (Sonar X3 and ProTools MP9). But, I had a Behringer active D.I. box, that was a copy of another brand, that was noisy and it was trashed.

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 28 Feb 2014 2:31 pm

It's not about benevolence, it's about following the rules.
Takamine was forced by the courts to stop copying Martin, Ibanez was forced by the courts to stop copying Gibson, and Uri prefers to have the courts stop him one device at a time.
Theft and fraud remain illegal, but IP theft doesn't appear to carry threat of imprisonment, despite being more profitable than stealing the objects. To me, that's a hole in the system.

Jimmy Gibson · Post by **Jimmy Gibson** » 28 Feb 2014 2:32 pm

Sorry Lane I am not sure what you mean in a previous reply, are you saying that Behringer products are the same as pirated copies of a top brand product? If so how come some of the so called clones seem as good or even better than the original top brands.

That's my lot on this topic, because I don`t understand some of the replies, I like Behringer gear and that's it.

JG

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