C6th what would you do?

Steve Dodson · Post by **Steve Dodson** » 28 Sep 2012 1:06 pm

If you had a D-10 guitar with only two knee's on C6th
besides lowering the 3rd. What other strings would you raise or lower with the 2nd knee for the time being? I do have the 1st string tuned to D.
Thanks

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 28 Sep 2012 1:12 pm

A's to Bb

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 28 Sep 2012 1:16 pm

If I had a D on the first string I'd raise the 3rd to a C# for my 'second' lever.

Greg Cutshaw · Post by **Greg Cutshaw** » 28 Sep 2012 6:33 pm

A's to Bb without a doubt.

Greg

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 28 Sep 2012 6:52 pm

If I were doing it from ground up (rerodding everything), I'd put P5 on the other lever, move the remaining pedals over one, and As to Bb on P8.
If you don't wanna work that hard, and I wouldn't blame you, then As to Bb.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 28 Sep 2012 7:01 pm

I agree on the A-Bb, and I'd certainly keep the 3rd lower on a knee, too!

Oh yeah, and never think that just two levers is limiting you.

Dan Beller-McKenna · Post by **Dan Beller-McKenna** » 29 Sep 2012 2:32 am

I currently am learning C6th with two knees: 3rd string C- to B and third and seventh C to C#. I do not have pedal 4 (need it for E9 and my rack and barrel Sho Bud can't share pedals across necks easily.

I get a lot out of the changes I have, but I find myself constantly wanting to raise A to Bb (and raise E to F, for that matter).

Dan

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 29 Sep 2012 11:40 pm

I would rank the A-Bb and the C-C# levers almost equal, but my fondness for extended dominant chords in the mid-range means A-Bb gets my narrow-margin choice.

So much so that I can't handle being without either of them. All my guitars have at least 4 knees on C6 and a three have 5 knees there. The 4th lever is always s.4 A-Ab. The 5th vertical lever is experimented with. One one guitar I have a G-F change there, on another I have a modified boo-wah on the vertical.

Rick Schmidt · Post by **Rick Schmidt** » 29 Sep 2012 11:47 pm

A's to Bb!

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 30 Sep 2012 1:01 am

Rick Schmidt wrote:A's to Bb!

.. and onward to B !

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 30 Sep 2012 7:22 am

Earnest, that's what I do. I only raise string 4 and it has a half stop at Bb and then continues on to B. It's on my LKR.

Rick Schmidt · Post by **Rick Schmidt** » 30 Sep 2012 8:03 am

Earnest Bovine wrote:
Rick Schmidt wrote:A's to Bb!
.. and onward to B !

Earnest knows that's what I do too... I originally got that arcane wisdom from him. Thanks Earnest!

I just didn't want to get too wild explaining how important that change has become for me, since it's a miracle that I got it to work for both A's on the same RKR that does double duty on the E neck.

Fred Glave · Post by **Fred Glave** » 1 Oct 2012 8:18 am

Sounds unanamous: A to Bb. I like C's to C# too.

Brint Hannay · Post by **Brint Hannay** » 1 Oct 2012 8:36 am

Maybe not quite unanimous. I would note that Buddy Emmons wrote his "Basic C6th" course for a copedent with two levers: the 3rd string B lower, and 3rd and 7th string C# raise.

(He doesn't use, or specify, any pedal 4 in the course, only 5 through 8. The absence of a really established and generally used pedal 4 makes for kind of a "wild card" that lets players do all kinds of different things with C6th setups.)

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 1 Oct 2012 8:41 am

As to B is the standard P4, but I've not heard it commonly used by anyone but Tom Morrell. So many people abandon it, using the pedal for the E9th neck. Morrell used it to cool effect

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 1 Oct 2012 9:11 am

I use p.4 quite a bit, both for chord effects and melodically. I commented in a thread about it quite awhile back and posted sound clips.

Here's the link to the thread. http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... highlight=

Scroll down to the bottom of page 1 for examples of some of the ways I use p.4

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 1 Oct 2012 10:26 am

Herb Steiner wrote:I use p.4 quite a bit, both for chord effects and melodically. I commented in a thread about it quite awhile back and posted sound clips.

Here's the link to the thread. http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... highlight=

Scroll down to the bottom of page 1 for examples of some of the ways I use p.4

Do you (or anyone else) use the whole step raise on the low A string? It doesn't seem useful to me, and it's not in your examples either, except that you refer to using the effect of whole step bending in octaves on both A strings. That's why I put the whole step raise (RKR) on only the higher A string (4th or in my case 5th string), with a half stop of course.
I do have a pedal to pull both A strings up to B flat, which works better than the lever for the semitone inverted mordent.

John Alexander · Post by **John Alexander** » 3 Oct 2012 10:55 pm

Earnest Bovine wrote:Do you (or anyone else) use the whole step raise on the low A string?

I have only recently added traditional P4 to my Bb6 copedent, and in doing so I considered whether to drop the raise on the lower string. Ultimately I decided to keep it in order to be able to get certain voicings that contain a half-step at the low end. I suppose there is an opportunity cost associated with keeping that raise, but I haven't identified it so far.

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 4 Oct 2012 7:39 am

Earnest Bovine wrote:
Do you (or anyone else) use the whole step raise on the low A string? It doesn't seem useful to me, and it's not in your examples either, except that you refer to using the effect of whole step bending in octaves on both A strings. That's why I put the whole step raise (RKR) on only the higher A string (4th or in my case 5th string), with a half stop of course.
I do have a pedal to pull both A strings up to B flat, which works better than the lever for the semitone inverted mordent.

Yes, I raise s.8 a whole tone as well, to get a Chicago blues rhythm riff happening when used in combination with p.5 on s.10 and s.8

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 4 Oct 2012 7:57 am

John Alexander wrote:
Earnest Bovine wrote:Do you (or anyone else) use the whole step raise on the low A string?
... I suppose there is an opportunity cost associated with keeping that raise, but I haven't identified it so far.

If I raise the low A to B, I lose the A note under the Am9 chord.

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 4 Oct 2012 9:32 am

Earnest Bovine wrote: If I raise the low A to B, I lose the A note under the Am9 chord.

That's a situation in which I use either the C-B lever or p.7, once again there's a trade-off in steel guitar.

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 4 Oct 2012 9:42 am

i gotcher inverted mordent right here, buddy!

John Alexander · Post by **John Alexander** » 4 Oct 2012 10:01 am

Earnest Bovine wrote: If I raise the low A to B, I lose the A note under the Am9 chord.

Yes, nice to have a bass note to go with the Bill Evans-ish minor ninth chord. I have that combination elsewhere via the Bb6 configuration.

Clete Ritta · Post by **Clete Ritta** » 5 Oct 2012 12:37 am

I may be 30 years behind the curve, but I'm gonna learn this C6 neck eventually!
My CKL raises both A's to B, and I think it has some value, but I am a novice at this point, so any advice here will be to my advantage. I will try lowering them to Bb.
Gotta love this forum!

Clete

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 5 Oct 2012 6:16 am

Clete, I'd leave it at B, but add a half-stop at Bb. That way, you have both

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C6th what would you do?

C6th what would you do?

A to B changes on p.4

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Re: A to B changes on p.4

Re: A to B changes on p.4