MCI Welded vs not Welded

[Dwight Lewis]

What is the difference between the MCI welded and unwelded bodies? Thanks

Dwight

[Paddy Long]

Dwight the welded ones had a aluminium frame with the top, and front and back aprons consisting of maple inserts - rather than the body being a one-piece maple unit !

[Dwight Lewis]

Thank you

[Jerry Overstreet]

If we may continue the discussion, which one came first and which is the most desirable? Which model became the EMCI?

[Quentin Hickey]

Are EMCI's welded, because I've heard alot of talk about there tone and sustain being comparative to the Emmons?

[Paddy Long]

IN chronological order, there was the wood bodied MCI, then the first welded framed jobs were the MCI Rangexpander (which mine was) then the EMCI which was also welded frame, and they changed the pedals to a grooved top, and the shape of the knee levers was slightly different as well ! The welded frame versions are usually referred to as the Arlington models, I believe they moved to there in 85 or 86 ! My D10 Rangexpander I got new in april 86.

[James Holland]

Is this MCI an early pre-welded frame? Its not all wood. It appears to be a bolted design, mostly Aluminum, with a wood apron:

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... highlight=

[Paddy Long]

Hi James - no thats not a welded frame MCI .. in each of the four corners where the leg sockets are, you will see the welds -- this one doesn't have them !

[billy tam R.I.P.]

I recently aquired and '89 EMCI originally built for Ron Elliot. I've owned many many steels over the past 15 to 20 years and without having some of the others to do a side by side comparison to be positive I firmly believe this guitar has more sustain than any I've had.
Billy Tam

[James Holland]

Hi James - no thats not a welded frame MCI .. in each of the four corners where the leg sockets are, you will see the welds -- this one doesn't have them !

Thanks - but that's not what I'm asking. I'm asking if the guitar in the thread is typical of the early, Waco models? Its obviously not welded, but its not all wood either.

[Billy Carr]

I have a D-10 rosewood EMCI that Mark Van Allen had at one time(sticker). Guitar has E66's and has tone for days. I prefer 10-1's but will probably keep the E66's on it. I put my set up on it, tweaked it and it's playing smooth as butter. Almost plays itself. Hard to find these kind of guitars.

[Mark van Allen]

That one's a gem, isn't it, Billy? I'd still have that one if I hadn't given up on D-10s because of vertebral issues. I think they really knew what they were doing with the E66 in those guitars.

[Billy Carr]

Yes sir, I can assure you, somebody knew exactly what they were doing. I normally don't care for E66's but in this EMCI, they seem to bring out a real Emmons type of old tone, so many look for. Add a 112 & DD3 and there it is! Thanks.

[Henry Matthews]

MCI's are great guitars whether it be the Waco model or the welded frame model and E66 pups really make the guitars zing. The early Waco models had a small little flaw that didn't amount to much but gave a few tuning issues. The end plates were put on with a slot for the screws instead of a hole which made the end plates sorta sloppy if screws got even a little loose. Don't know why they were done that way, I guess for ease of construction. I think the welded frames sound better but again, both are great guitars.

[billy tam R.I.P.]

For my taste I found the E-66 just a little to brittle on the very high end. I put some Wallace tru-tones @ 18000 and 20000 E/C for me the top rounded out very nicely. Still cannot get over the sustain on this thing. Pulled out my push/pull the other day and although it sounded great the EMCI had more sustain.
Billy

[Paddy Long]

I agree Billy ... on mine I had the E66 on the C6th neck and a 10-1 on the E9th neck ...seemed to be the best combo ! Streets ahead of the original Barcus Berry pickups it came with

James I think that guitar was a transitional model, between the early Waco full wood body's and the welded frame job ... seems they were trying out different ideas as they went, before settling on the welded frame.

[Joe Rogers]

One big difference to me between the early Waco & later models is the spacing of the floor pedals. The earlier guitars had a much tighter spacing which always threw me off any time I played on one. The RangeExpanders had the wider spacing which was carried forward to the EMCI guitars.

Great tone & sustain on those guitars...!!

Joe Rogers

[Quentin Hickey]

Are welded frames the norm now on just about any make of guitar? I know that GFI ultra's are.

[Jim Cooley]

My Range Expander SD-10 has the wider spaced, grooved pedals. I have a GeorgeL's PF-1 pickup in it. The guy I take lesson from has several steels, including a 1969 Emmons push/pull and two like-new EMCIs that he has practically never played. He has played my MCI a few times, and commented on how smooth it plays and how well it sustains. I planned to sell it after I bought my Sho-Bud LDG. I've had the "wants" for a new steel for a while. The problem is that I have been playing the MCI while I was having the LDG's pickup rewound, and it really sounds sweet through my Session 400 and Fender Twin. Now I can't decide whether I want to sell it or keep it. I can't buy a new steel unless I sell it, but I'm afraid that if I let it go, I'll regret it.

[Bob Carlucci]

My MCI had an undercarriage that looked almost identical to my Carter, and had some kind of weird black plastic covering that was not mica.. It was a nice guitar, but that covering made it look cheap and "plasticky"..did not like..
I wonder if I would have liked the RangeXpander better?
I bought it very stupidly low on CL, and actually sold it at a modest profit... bob

[Mike Wheeler]

Jim, I'd advise you to think long and hard about selling your Rangexpander. It's one of the best guitars ever made, IMHO. I'm pretty sure you would seriously regret letting it go.

You have a great pair of classic guitars there. I think you should keep them and enjoy them. I know I would.

[Jim Cooley]

Mike - I hear you. I don't really have to sell it. I just don't need two right now. Wait a minute, what am I thinking...?

[Mike Wheeler]

WHAT!!! Everyone needs at least 2!!

You've got both the Bud sound, and that Emmonsy sound. You're practically in heaven!!

[Herb Steiner]

Back in the 80's, I was working at Danny's Guitars in Austin. Danny Hawk owned the store and we were the "steel shop" in A-town for awhile.

It might be a faulty memory, but around 1985 Red Rhodes came into the shop, told me he had relocated to Waco for awhile and was working with a new guitar, the MCI, that Bud Carter had designed. He brought in a guitar and it struck me as being somewhat of an entry-level instrument, kind of with a lot to be desired compared to Emmons, or MSA, or Zumsteel. I remember that the MCI logo was on the back apron as well as the front apron, like they ran out of black mica or something.

Later the operation must have moved up to the Metroplex area and redesigned the guitar, because the MCIs from that location had the welded frames and were tone monsters. Ray Austin from Ft. Worth plays one and it's a great horn. Then the EMCI grew out of that guitar, I guess. Somewhere in those years John Burkhead got involved with the company, but to what extent, I don't know.

There was an EMCI at a local shop here years ago that had the original Barcus-Berry pickups that I thought sounded terrific.

[chris ivey]

quentin..no, but i've noticed many are using channels of aluminum to support the undercarriage crossrods, etc.
i prefer to see steels with less aluminum subframe structure, but i guess that's the easy way to do it.

the bottom line would be, 'does it play well and sound great?'.