Any TALL players out there??

Bruce Hilton · Post by **Bruce Hilton** » 12 Apr 2011 7:46 am

I'm relatively tall (6' 3") and much of my height is in my legs. When sitting, the top of my knee is 25" from the floor. I have a hard time using my volume pedal without my knee hitting the underside of my steel.

I play a Fender 1000, and couldn't use my pedals and knee lever at the same time the way it was set up. I worked with raising it last night, and the rods coming up from the pedals are about maxed out. It's still not quite comfy, I'm going to work with it more tonight.

Anyone else have similar problems? Any clever solutions, like a mini riser or something? And while we're at it, what IS the proper ergonomically correct position for the steel & player?

Ivan Funk · Post by **Ivan Funk** » 12 Apr 2011 8:54 am

Hi Bruce,

I'm 6'3"
My solution was to put a 2" lift kit on my steel:
http://www.steelguitar.net/liftkit5.html

I heard that having all femur and ulna bones parallel to the floor is good ergonomics.

Tim Kowalski · Post by **Tim Kowalski** » 12 Apr 2011 8:59 am

I have similar issues. You can try extending the back legs and tip the guitar forward to get additional knee clearance. A low profile volume pedal is also helpful. If you are set up on a carpet, that will make things worse too. When I set up on carpeting, I use those little coaster thingies to keep the guitar from sinking.
I am not familiar with the Fenders, so maybe this won't work for you - maybe there's a better way.
If you can't make a riser, you could try digging a pit.

Larry Bell · Post by **Larry Bell** » 12 Apr 2011 9:47 am

Having a pedal steel that fits your body is critical.

The lift kits work fine but a more elegant and permanent fix can be done locally if you find someone who has experience working metal. Most any machinist can bend and thread pedal rods. Have some made to the proper height. The front legs can be lengthened by adding a metal sleeve between the lower section of the leg and the pedal bar (that is one component of the lift kit) OR (preferably) you can have legs cut to the proper length. They are just chromed mic stand tubing with a wood dowel in the bottom section to prevent it from moving -- take one of yours apart and you'll see what I mean. There is a threaded slug at the top of the leg that's tapped into the top of the tubing. OR you can buy legs and pedal rods from many of the vendors you'll find in the LINKS icon at the top of this page. Talk to Jerry Fessenden over in Montpelier -- he's originally from Maine -- you'll probably speak the same language (whatever THAT is).

I would advise against jacking up the back end of your guitar for more than a short time. It's hard enough to play when it fits you properly -- do yourself a favor and eliminate that hurdle. I'm 6'2 1/2" and have new guitars built to my specified height but I have used lift kits for older guitars I've acquired and they work fine. I'll say it again -- having your guitar fit your body is VERY important.

Bruce Hilton · Post by **Bruce Hilton** » 12 Apr 2011 11:21 am

Tim, I had the same thought initially about staggering my legs. Right now my close legs are a bit higher, which tips the body forward a bit. I have to agree with Larry, it's just not comfortable.

I was leaning toward having new pedal rods made, but I didn't know about the lift kits. I looked on Bobby's site, and the lift kit page doesn't list Fenders (no surprise), I'll have to check the size.

Or, have my machinist buddy make me 8 new rods... probably cheaper than $50...

Alain-Yves Pigeon · Post by **Alain-Yves Pigeon** » 12 Apr 2011 1:02 pm

Bruce, welcome to the club! I'm 6 foot 7 and you can guess the hard times I've had adapting this body to the instument. I did what Larry mentionned, that is I've got 2" pedal extenders and 2" sleeves to put above the pedal board on the front legs to keep them from collapsing when you depress the pedals. Got these extenders on ebay a couple of years ago and it's the seller that suggested me to include the sleeves because they're not offered as such. For a time, I was considering adding one more 1" pedal extender (which I got from the same seller) to the 2" already in place. To this, I might add that I have to wear heelless slippers and use a low profile volume pedal, otherwise I'm caught in the undercarriage (and I've not yet decided on a vertical knee lever!!). Do I have to add that as I wear size 15 shoes, that also gets in the way when I have to make pedal changes... Anyway, I'm sort of getting around without too much trouble on my Sho-Bud Pro II Custom and funnily, I have no problem whatsoever with a S-10 BMI, I have all the space I need. The problem is with the C6th neck.

I am quite familiar with these peculiar aspects as I knock my head in almost every doorways, have trouble getting in most cars and it goes on. I had the same problems when I played 'cello but fortunately, someone invented an angled endpin that could lift the cello high enough for me and mark an end to back and knees aches. Life can be good after all.

Best to all,
ayp

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 12 Apr 2011 1:44 pm

Bruce,
I'm a 1/2" shorter than you. Before spending money, try tilting your guitar. I tilt my Kline very slightly, maybe 5 degrees, and it is soooo comfortable! I'm able to sit up straight, and the slight downward set of my forearms just feels very good, and really is less tiring than when I play my '74 Shobud with the lift kit. This may not work for you, then again, it just might!
The tilt on my Kline;

Tim Kowalski · Post by **Tim Kowalski** » 12 Apr 2011 5:41 pm

Alain - I also have a Sho-Bud that is lifted 1-1/2" to get me under it. My Rains fits me perfectly as it is.

As Larry says, it is important to be comfortable.

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 12 Apr 2011 5:57 pm

6'4" here, gradually shrinking as I get older - 35 years ago I was a bit taller. Like you, a lot is in my legs. One of the big issues is height from the bottom of the foot to the knee - that section is long on me. So I do raise my steels quite a bit - anywhere from 2-4" lift, depending on the steel. I need to raise up more on a single-body, less on a double-body, but my Franklin D-10 is at least an inch below standard height so it gets more.

I tried tilting at first - not even close. When I started playing, I had to decide whether I wanted to work the pedals or levers, no way could I position my legs to do both. Ergonomics is critical, and anyway - why would you want to force it by cramming your legs in there? I'm no masochist. It's absurd to think that I should be able to play a pedal steel designed for someone who's 6-10" shorter than I am, without modification.

A lift kit works fine, 2" is tolerable for me, but sometimes I need a bit more. If you do a lot of guitars, you can get the 1" or 2" M/F standoffs at McMaster-Carr pretty cheaply. I get the tubing to hold the front legs up at Home Depot, just cut it with a $10 pipe cutter. There are lots of threads on lift kits here - try the forum search or google

site:steelguitarforum.com "lift kit"

Here's a thread from a few years ago with some particulars - http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=1175173

Christopher Woitach · Post by **Christopher Woitach** » 12 Apr 2011 5:59 pm

I'm a mere 6'2'', but I needed my instrument an inch higher. Lynn Stafford simply put dowels in the legs - problem fixed!

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 12 Apr 2011 7:17 pm

Christopher - didn't you need to lengthen the pedal rods also? Dowels definitely raise the legs, but if the pedals were the right height off the floor before, they'll now be too high. Am I missing something here?

Christopher Woitach · Post by **Christopher Woitach** » 12 Apr 2011 7:33 pm

To be honest, I hadn't thought of that - I'll have to ask Lynn what he did, since the pedals are definitely the right height, as is the guitar.... Nice catch!

Bobby D. Jones · Post by **Bobby D. Jones** » 12 Apr 2011 9:06 pm

I would start by unhooking the pedal rods and raise the legs till the guitar is high enough to set comfortable with your legs under it and enough room to be comfortable to set at the guitar. With the guitar level. Once this is accomplished you can put dowel rods in the legs so they will not collapse. If the Pedal Bar is thru bolted to the front legs drill a hole through the dowel rod after installed. Then take a measurment of the pedal rods and see how much you would need with about 1/4 to 3/8 extra. Go to Ace hardware or other hardware and find some nuts about an inch long that is used put all-thread bolt together to make picture frame clamps. put the nuts on the rod, if you are lucky the pedal rod will have a size you can buy a piece all-thread of proper size.
If not just buy some long thread bolts the proper size and cut the heads off till you have pieces of all thread long enough. I would suggest just get 3 or 4 sets of these and set the E-9 neck up first and give it a try. If it works and is comfortable. Then either finish the C-6 neck or look at the pedal rods as what you want to set up the whole guitar up and look to suit you. This would be a way to find out what it will take and only cost about 10 dollars to get you comfortable. The first thing a person has to remember when taking on playing a steel guitar is you don't just sit down at it. YOU PUT IT ON LIKE A PAIR OF PANTS OR SHIRT. Good Luck and Happy Steelin.

Bruce Hilton · Post by **Bruce Hilton** » 13 Apr 2011 7:59 am

"The first thing a person has to remember when taking on playing a steel guitar is you don't just sit down at it. YOU PUT IT ON LIKE A PAIR OF PANTS OR SHIRT"

Ha!! I love it, Bobby! Great quote!

I just wasn't diggin' the slanted body, so I straightened it out last night. Using the excellent ergonomic advise in this thread, I lowered my seat (I use a drum throne) so my lap was perpendicular to the floor. Everything fits now, but I'm worried that there's very little thread engagement on the rods. Think I'll make a trip to Home Cheapo tonight to see what I can find for extensions.

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 13 Apr 2011 1:54 pm

Duane Brown and Billy Wilson are both over 6'6" if I'm not mistaken. Unfortunately Duane is indisposed at the moment due to illness. But at 5'5", I'm always curious about what goes on up there.

Bruce Hilton · Post by **Bruce Hilton** » 19 Aug 2011 4:04 am

Well, I bought the 2" lift kit, and it was just too long. Should have gone with the 1". I've since removed my knee lever, so I don't need the extra height anymore. If anyone wants the lift kit (10-32 thread) I'll be happy to sell it to you.

Ronnie Boettcher · Post by **Ronnie Boettcher** » 19 Aug 2011 4:35 am

Bobby Jones is right on, for extending your rods. Just find out what the thread size is on your rods. Then go to a hardware store, and by some long machine screws, and rod couplings (thats what they are called). One for each rod. Your rod problem is over. Or just buy a long threaded rod, that is about 3 feet long, and cut your pieces the length you need. Thread a nut onto the rod, or screw, before you cut it, that way you chase the cut end when you remove the nut, so the thread is clean, and can be screwed in. Your cost for extending your rods will be around $10, if you need to extend 8 rods. Good luck, it is easy. Ronnie

john buffington · Post by **john buffington** » 19 Aug 2011 6:42 am

I'm 6'3" and have to have extended legs and pedal rods for any guitar I purchase/play. Usually never have the opportunity to sit behind one and try out at steel shows due to the fact builders rarely have legs or rods to accommodate tall guys like myself.

JB

Joe Miraglia · Post by **Joe Miraglia** » 19 Aug 2011 10:59 am

You tall ones have it so tough

,try reaching the far pedals if you where 5'6" like me.Looks like all the great players are over 6'

Joe

Joe Miraglia · Post by **Joe Miraglia** » 19 Aug 2011 11:11 am

Herb Steiner wrote:Duane Brown and Billy Wilson are both over 6'6" if I'm not mistaken. Unfortunately Duane is indisposed at the moment due to illness. But at 5'5", I'm always curious about what goes on up there.

Wow Herb-- someone shorter than me

,and you are a great player.There maybe hope me

I've got to say this ''And your from Texas and not 6'

" Joe

Lynn Kasdorf · Post by **Lynn Kasdorf** » 19 Aug 2011 8:03 pm

I'm 6'2". I have 1" lift kits on my emmonses, and I use a low profile volume pedal.

Around 1976, when I was getting started, I had an MSA (without a lift kit) and a very tall volume pedal -a Morley with the big chrome cabinet and a photo resitor inside- it was designed for standing up- not for steel.

I build a platform out of 2x4s and plywood that the steel and my seat would sit on. The platform had a recess for the volume pedal to sit in. This worked pretty well- I could work the pedal without my right knee hitting the underside.

I went to a Jeff Newman seminar around that time with this rig, and it got his attention. He'd never seen anything like it. I felt like an idiot, but it got the job done. I wish I had a picture of that setup...

John Gilman · Post by **John Gilman** » 19 Aug 2011 10:06 pm

Just in case anyone is laboring over extending pedal rods, MSC has a large selection of 10-32 standoffs that do the job just fine. Dowel the front legs, adjust the back legs, add standoffs to the pedal rods and voila...

http://www1.mscdirect.com/eCommerce/Nav ... ndizedOk=N

Daniel Ibanez · Post by **Daniel Ibanez** » 4 Sep 2011 12:34 pm

Hi,
in addition to the comments and good advices provided, I think I should say something.
Some usually don't realize the importance of the steel legs length until we suffer the problem. I personally learnt it the hard way., and had to make me legs and pedal rod extensions.
Most of the manufacturers give the choice of selecting the required length, at the time of ordering the steel guitar.
Please find below a couple of references for GFI and Williams.
Regards
Daniel
http://www.gfimusicalproducts.com/Pages ... atures.htm
Our legs are also an extrusion of 3/16" thick aluminum wall. When assembled, the steel stands at a standard height of 26 1/4" from floor to the bottom of the back rail. Custom heights of 1 or 2 inches taller or lower are available at no extra cost if specified at the time of order. Front legs are fixed in length while back legs can be adjusted plus or minus about 1/2 inch for leveling. This leg assembly provides greater stability at about 2/3 the weight of conventional steel legs.

http://www.williamsguitarcompany.com/te ... _info.html
Stainless steel legs available in 25", 26" (standard), and 27" lengths

Dan Beller-McKenna · Post by **Dan Beller-McKenna** » 5 Sep 2011 6:43 am

Bruce, you should get together with Bil Holbrook over near Derry. New England must just specialize in tall steelers!

Dan

Bruce Hilton · Post by **Bruce Hilton** » 5 Sep 2011 6:53 am

Dan, I think I've met Bill. Doesn't he play with Jaydee Porter?

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