Do you play in a rock band or jam band?

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 8 Apr 2010 8:18 pm

chas smith wrote:Over at the bar, Kobe sinks a 3, the Lakers win one and the crowd cheers.

And the singer says "thank you".

BTW I can't understand all the lyrics. Can you post them here?

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 8 Apr 2010 9:08 pm

Dave,

The reverb jones isn't nearly as bad as the chorus addiction. I had to go cold turkey on the stereo chorus thing (with a stereo power amp and two speakers) and it was hard. I just couldn't see going to those meetings and saying "I'm Dan, I'm a chorusaholic".

Although I was....

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 8 Apr 2010 10:31 pm

Although some people seem to think about some of the bands I play with as rock or jam bands, I tend to think of them as Americana, and I don't really do much of anything differently than if I was playing stone-cold country music, except perhaps bring something like a Duncan Twin Tube Classic and a wah. But those generally get used sparingly, and as much on guitar as steel. I did a recording with Marah in January, and they wanted my standard clean pedal steel sound.

One band I play with, Kris Kehr and the Stone Poets, does do the jam band thing sometimes - Kris was in The Recipe for a couple of years while we took a hiatus about 6-8 years ago, and Tim Carbone and other jam-band guys have sat in with us at times. Phil Ferlino was here in State College for a pretty long time, but left many years ago. I played with the Rustlanders for a couple of years, who mostly tour with Ryan Bingham these days, but are out in LA now to record. This time I decided not to give up my university teaching gig to play full-time - I admit I occasionally get the itch, but scratching it is too expensive.

Right now, I'm mostly interested in mixing swing-country with soul and jazz-blues, and I'm not changing anything with the rig. Zumsteel into a Tubefex into some big clean amp, and maybe a Pod into the same steel amp for guitar - or maybe grease it up a bit with my funky old Harmony 430 amp with the crazy tremelo run stereo with something small. I'd like to use the Magnatone 260, but I'm mostly afraid to take it out, I just don't know where I'd find another if it got stolen.

To me, reverb is for clean sounds, where there isn't much natural amp sustain. Crank it up, and for me the reverb needs to go down inversely to the grit level. I don't really use chorus, but the funky tremelo amps, Lonnie-Mack style vibratos, or Leslie cab sounds can be very cool in the right situation.

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 9 Apr 2010 5:52 am

whatever works I guess.
Chas and Dan seem to have almost opposite tonal approaches and I love both of em.
RR rocks the distortion, that aint just amp overdrive. He's godly.

Dan , addicted to chorus?

wow. on steel? chorus? was this during the 80's per chance?

Dave maybe you need some reverb methadone to ween you off ...a delay pedal. I'll be your sponsor, call me when you think you may feel like using reverb and I'll talk you down. Maybe we can make our own reality tv show out of it "Reverb Intervention".

MOAR please. tell me more. more clips too.

chas smith R.I.P. · Post by **chas smith R.I.P.** » 9 Apr 2010 11:19 am

Gentlemen, thank you, more clips? Here's one from Deke's Guitar Geek Festival. I did a short solo on my titanium guitar and here, the camera came in about 1/3rd of the way through. Thank you to whoever shot this and the future of the steel guitar is a little presumptuous.

http://www.proteuspages.com/GDP&Gretsch ... Future.mp4

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 9 Apr 2010 12:08 pm

awesome, why have i never seen this, or anything even remotely like it, before?
love the shot of the other steelers

Daniel Morris · Post by **Daniel Morris** » 9 Apr 2010 3:20 pm

Fantastic, Chas!
It's gotta be quite the shocker to tell folks that you're playing (basically) a steel guitar. How do listeners, the other steelers, etc. react to such outside-the-box music?

My primary band these days is INTRA ( http://www.myspace.com/intra ), and I have a post about our new CD elsewhere ( http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=179448 ).

I still play rawkin' country with California Speedbag ( http://www.myspace.com/californiaspeedbag ) and sit in with the Not So Good Ol' Boys ( http://www.myspace.com/thenotsogoodolboys ), but playing this kind of progressive/art rock allows me SO much more freedom (well, all original music of any stripe can do that). Of course, this stuff is also responsible for breaking the bank on FX.

Nicholai Steindler · Post by **Nicholai Steindler** » 11 Apr 2010 12:18 am

Glad to see all of you here. I knew I had some musically like minded people on here somewhere (not that just about every other form of music is valid too).

Dave Grafe · Post by **Dave Grafe** » 11 Apr 2010 10:41 am

Here's an audio clip from the wayback machine, a gnarly, hard-core rock song recorded in my living room for Les Sarnoff's KINK radio show over thirty years ago by Sky River, the pedal steel solo (a 3-pedal no-lever ShoBud Maverick ca 1972) is played by yours truly with no effects other than maybe an early "Phaser" of unknown manufacture and my little Epiphone amp cranked up silly-ass loud...

http://www.pdxaudio.com/fire%20in%20yer%20eyes.mp3

A cautionary note: This is seriously nasty sounding, both in content and quality, PLEASE don't go there if you have tender ears or are offended by such noise.

Stu Schulman · Post by **Stu Schulman** » 11 Apr 2010 2:08 pm

Chas,That's Killer Man!

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 24 Apr 2010 7:53 pm

Here's some bone fide jam band pedal steel, with overly long solos included:

Dan Jam Banding in Olympia

Les Anderson · Post by **Les Anderson** » 24 Apr 2010 8:44 pm

Over the past five years I have played in an old time dance band (steel behind Saxes and horns)an easy listening band, a church band and now a old time country band.

The only problem with playing with this latest band, we play country classics until about 10:00P then after that it's volume up and pedal to the metal with screeching guitars, big bass and booming drums. I really don't get into it because I doubt if anyone can hear the steel licks.

Dave Harmonson · Post by **Dave Harmonson** » 24 Apr 2010 9:24 pm

Here's some jam band stuff from a week ago. "Gone Away" and "Heartbreaker" are standard blues and "How Much More Gravy" is a pretty wild jam. Might need inebriates for that one. There posted at www.myspace.com/gravyandthebiscuitrollers

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 25 Apr 2010 12:34 pm

I did at one time, but the band broke up when the gig ended. We're all still friends and if another gig came up we'd probably get back together and do it.

Here is the video (which I've posted before.) And clearly, what I'm playing has absolutely nothing in common with any kind of country or Nashville style of playing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkSnoeTWR4I

Note that the drummer is Steve Duncan, from the Desert Rose band. Steve no longer lives in California so if we ever did get back together, we'd have to find another drummer. It would be hard to find one of Steve's caliber though.

Barry Hyman · Post by **Barry Hyman** » 27 Apr 2010 7:35 pm

I wouldn't call anything I do a "rock band." But seven of the free downloads currently up on my website (www.barryhyman.com, click on the flash player at the top of the homepage) are definitely alternative pedal steel. There's a blues, a mournful folk tune, a sentimental r&b anthem, some radical poetry over roots reggae, a raga that blends distorted guitar, pedal steel, and synthesizer, some minor key jazzy improv, and a kind of funky Afropop groove. (These last two with my student ensemble turned jam band ZUELA.)

Still getting around to putting some of that traditional country up online...

Leslie Ehrlich · Post by **Leslie Ehrlich** » 27 Apr 2010 11:56 pm

I've never played in a country band.

Nathan Golub · Post by **Nathan Golub** » 28 Apr 2010 5:37 am

Chas, that is really really cool.

Barry Hyman · Post by **Barry Hyman** » 28 Apr 2010 9:05 am

Just listened to Chas' You Tube songs. Boy I'm glad I don't play rock and roll. It sounds painfully loud even at low volume! There might have been some cool pedal steel howls in there but it sure was hard to tell. Hope you were wearing industrial-style earplugs, brother!

Barry Hyman · Post by **Barry Hyman** » 28 Apr 2010 10:51 am

Chas -- don't mean to be disrespectful or unfriendly -- the steel playing could have been fabulous, and I love experimental or unusual stuff -- just couldn't isolate the steel sound very well in the crowded mix. What put the edge in the tone of my voice (in my previous post) is volume -- I damaged my hearing in the sixties and seventies, and have had to live for forty years as a professional musician with a 35% high frequency hearing loss in both ears!

So I get shocked and horrified and edgy when I see musicians playing (what appears to be) too loud. Screw what the audiences want -- they don't really know what they want anyway. And pour cold water on the youngsters who still think that louder is better. Loud is not cool. Loud is dumb! Your ears are the only thing you've got as a musician! Please protect them, my friends!

Somebody else in this thread was talking about having his amp on ten and still needing monitors to hear himself. Why not get the guys in the band to turn down?

By the way, I am not old and out of touch. I get paid to perfom every week; I know what audiences like. They don't like too loud anymore than I do...

chas smith R.I.P. · Post by **chas smith R.I.P.** » 28 Apr 2010 11:30 am

Barry, you're not being disrespectful or unfriendly. If you could have heard the steel sound over the mix then the mix is wrong. It's not about the steel, it's about the ensemble. And we're loud. I'm wearing earplugs just for the stage mix, but it's much louder out in front of the stage. And this is a band that doesn't like a loud stage stage sound.

I've been playing in bands since 1964, and in the 60's, I did the feedback solos with no earplugs. Add to that, I've been in the factories and welding shops for most of my life and now my hearing has a 60db drop-off at 1500hz. When I worked in the welding shops, I almost always wore aircraft ear muffs, and at first I would get a ration of sh%t about it, but I usually had the biggest tattoo and I had a torch. Things could catch on fire....

I disagree with you that loud is not cool and is dumb. I think loud is important when the music is about about power and force. Even a classical orchestra can get up around 100db with a quadrupel forte section. And it's then that you feel the sound as well as hear it.

BTW, the loudest ensemble I've ever heard was SUNN O))). I have pro earplugs, I was off to the side and they still got overpowered. They had 2 bass players and one of them had a speaker cab with 8 15-inch speakers.

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 28 Apr 2010 12:10 pm

I did a gig with Sunn 0)))) a few years back.

Sunn0))) is basically an "Earth" tribute band, tho they did up the volume some.
O'Malley and i use to use the same rehearsal studio in BKYLN when he was in Khanate, now he lives in france or something.
The Dan in this thread did some real nice steel work on Earth's album "Hex". I love it.

Dan Tyack · Post by **Dan Tyack** » 28 Apr 2010 1:32 pm

I love it (an Earth tribute band)

That was a fun album. It was like Led Zep playing italian spagetti western soundtrack music on half speed.

http://www.southernlord.com/mp3/1%20Rai ... 0Wind).mp3

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 28 Apr 2010 2:53 pm

Dans mp3 link appears to be busted.
Heres a cut from the Earth album Hex he plays on.
sound quality is kinda poor on this clip.
the albums Hex and Bees mark a departure for Earth from their previous work which was mainly guitar driven serious drone and which is what Sunn))) based their tribute band upon. as dan said this stuff goes off into spaghetti western territory. Bees is a fantastic album too, but no steel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zD-J8O2fLf4

and for those curious, this is what a recent Sunn0))) show is like. too many hipsters for me now

This is the new aesthetic tho in heavy drone and "stoner rock". LOUD 120 watters, Model T's, Oranges, Matamps in small clubs. endless feedback. Volume as a physical presence in the room, flapping at your pant legs. ouch. let the "that aint music" coments commence in earnest!!

this clip sounds EXACTLY like Earths second album..."Earth 2"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7a0Z2yndlOs

chas smith R.I.P. · Post by **chas smith R.I.P.** » 28 Apr 2010 6:38 pm

I saw them, SUNN 0))), at the el Rey, a few years ago and Earth was the opener. They had the full ensemble with "extended vocals", played for close to 2 hours and there were extended moments when the air was just plain delicious.

Barry Hyman · Post by **Barry Hyman** » 29 Apr 2010 5:09 am

It is music, it is just too loud.

Brother Ben -- if you want to hear some "serious drone" listen to "First Morning in Damascus" on my website. No pedal steel but... Those were some fabulous stage photos, by the way...

It is not necessary to use either excessive volume or effects to go "out." And Chas, I can perform with "power and force" using a five watt amp! Hearing damage is not fun. Everytime an attractive woman comes up and starts talking to me at a gig or a party and I can't make out a word she's saying, I curse loud music all over again. Loud is dumb. Self-inflicted hearing damage is dumb. Damaging the ears of the people in the audience is criminal. It is possible to get every pleasure associated with music without hurting anybody. No argument. Loud is dumb.

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Do you play in a rock band or jam band?

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