tear down on stage or off?

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 8 Feb 2010 1:53 pm

maybe this should have been a poll but...

assuming you are playing in a crowded divey place with a small stage, small or no staging area and no real backstage and 3-4 bands on the bill(because thats what the venues Im playing in are like)...

when your set is done and there is a band following you on the same stage, do you carry your assembled steel off the stage and disassemble it somewhere off stage? or do you haul your case on stage and disassemble it on stage while the other band waits for you to get off the stage (or more often, starts trying to set up their gear right on top of you)?

thanks

Ray Minich · Post by **Ray Minich** » 8 Feb 2010 2:16 pm

What I've seen on Broadway is they get the he__ out of there and disassemble offstage.

Steve Wood · Post by **Steve Wood** » 8 Feb 2010 2:34 pm

Im a small venue guy...I usually have a secure place ahead of time with all my stuff (gear, coat, keys, etc.) and get a hand bringing the steel and amp, etc. off the stage. I breakdown somewhere else. Nothing worse than a bar rolling away and losing picks while someone breathes down your neck.
just my take.

Jonathan Shacklock · Post by **Jonathan Shacklock** » 8 Feb 2010 3:01 pm

If you're unplugging your gear on stage just remember to hitch your jeans up first. Last week my fellow band members cheerfully informed me I was treating some of the ladies in the audience to a little more of a show than they paid for...

Pit Lenz · Post by **Pit Lenz** » 8 Feb 2010 3:10 pm

Clearing the stage fast BUT ORGANIZED helps to prevent getting your stuff damaged and keeps the evening rolling.

My small suff (picks, bar, harmonicas, stompboxes, readily hooked-up vol pedal , lives in a compartment of my rack that I can close quickly, so I won´t have to collect my stuff from all over the place.
Usually I´m the first to have cleared the stage completely.
The following band will be thankful for getting an empty stage to enter as soon as possible, just as I was when I was setting up myself....

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 8 Feb 2010 3:21 pm

in my opinion there is no greater hell than playing stupid little tight stage venues that have 4 bands a night. with i would assume a maximum $20 payday, if not free (that's why clubs do it...no expense for band pay) you suffer crowded difficult set-up/teardown plus you can't even play long enough to cop a groove. but at least the audience's attention span is not taxed. if your band has enough material to play a full night's gig, get some parties or something. people will pay for bands, just not those vampire clubs. if you're not actually getting a fair chunk of change, i say teardown wherever it's easiest for you and screw everyone else.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 8 Feb 2010 3:40 pm

OFF stage, clear the stage whether it be for the next artist or for your band mates. I move everything onto the floor in front of the stage, organized but not on the stage.

First the Steel, then the Electrics, then the wires, then the amp(s)

having a setup process and a breakdown process that we do the same way each time I feel is very valuable and effective.

t

Cal Sharp · Post by **Cal Sharp** » 8 Feb 2010 3:49 pm

What I've seen on Broadway is they get the he__ out of there and disassemble offstage.

Some of those joints just don't have enough room to do it off-stage if there's a crowd. The guys in the next band understand that. So, you just do it fast. Tootsie's is the worst, I've set up my steel guitar outside on the sidewalk when I was working the downstairs stage.

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 8 Feb 2010 4:17 pm

how much do you make in an evening at tootsie's?

just curious..

Clyde Mattocks · Post by **Clyde Mattocks** » 8 Feb 2010 4:20 pm

What is worse in these hurry up situations is to have a bunch of self appointed roadies "HELP" you get your stuff off. They grab things while your back is turned and set it somewhere in the club you have no idea where. Then you have to try and find your various pieces in a crowded venue and always have to give up on a cord or two or worse.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 8 Feb 2010 4:27 pm

Whats even worse is a drummers self appointed roadies helping the drummer right after the gig ends with no respect for the stage or the the other band members.

We had a drummer do this ONCE a month or so back, he's not with us anymore...neither are his roadies...

Scott Appleton · Post by **Scott Appleton** » 8 Feb 2010 5:11 pm

Only pull your steel assembled off the stage if you have enough room to place it
safely .. otherwise put her up on the stage .. in fact if its just a 45 minute to hour spot leave your case behind you so you can turn around and put it away first thing. .. stuff all the rest in the pacaseat or whatever you've got and lug off right after the steel .. protect your instrument from others who may not be so careful
setting up .. In the back wings you can put away your steel calmly and carefully
otherwise don't even let them bastards set up till your steel is away .. I have had
near collisions coming off stage with the steel assembled .. not a good thing ..
You could bend a leg or catch a pedal and go flying ..

Jonathan Lam · Post by **Jonathan Lam** » 8 Feb 2010 5:26 pm

Almost always break down on stage. So much has to get moved around anyway it doesnt make any difference.

Shane Glover · Post by **Shane Glover** » 8 Feb 2010 5:57 pm

I guess I am pretty lucky ! Most of the gigs we play we are the only act for the night. If not for 2 nights. When we do open for somone we take our back line down as fast as possible on stage. The headliner is set up & sound checked anyway. Never had any problems yet.

Shane

Barry Hyman · Post by **Barry Hyman** » 8 Feb 2010 6:13 pm

I'm with Chris Ivey -- I never do a performance if there is more than one band, unless it is a real laid-back no-hurry situation. If I am putting my steel in the case and somebody is trying to set up some other band in my face I become the scariest-looking 5'8" vegetarian pacifist you ever did see!

And if somebody tries to touch the steel, or tries to carry my stuff away before I have finished packing up, I use the Voice of Command and they go off with their tails between their legs to find somebody else to "help." I have been in this business too long, and I value my equipment and my peace of mind too much, to let anybody crowd me when I am doing my routine. I move fast, but I will not be hurried above and beyond that. And since the line I draw is so clear cut, everybody respects it...

Cal Sharp · Post by **Cal Sharp** » 8 Feb 2010 6:15 pm

how much do you make in an evening at tootsie's?

It's mostly tips, so you never know. Depends on the crowd, the weather, the front man... Some singers are really good at generating doe nations. Also helps if you have a babe pass the tip jar around. $40-$100.

Scott Appleton · Post by **Scott Appleton** » 8 Feb 2010 6:28 pm

In the Bay Area we have some shows which you have to hustle to get off . If you are the middle of 3 or 4 its the rush .. Most musicians in the Country or alt Americana scene are polite and helpful. U only get a few bad ones. On the $ tip
thang it seems its the same wherever you go but i have seen some little clubs here
where you can barely pull down 20$ for a 3 set night ..most of those have a % of bar receipts to offset the evening. Its common like Tootsies to make between 40 and 100 per man .. universal hard times .. In the 60's we used to get at least
50$ guaranteed per man and as much as 120 $ per man a night .. times have gotten worse .. U can hardly make a living playing honky tonk's anylonger ..
too bad .. I sure like playing for folks .. I think thats why the Elks and such organizations with special Western nights do much better in terms of pay.
How is it for you all out there?

Steve Norman · Post by **Steve Norman** » 8 Feb 2010 6:35 pm

I always pack up my seat and everything else, then move it all off and dissemble the steel. Usually beat the drummer off that way. Hate those type of shows.

Tucker Jackson · Post by **Tucker Jackson** » 8 Feb 2010 6:45 pm

If the next band is itching to get onstage, and there's only a short gap between groups, I drag the steel off stage ASAP as a courtesy. Otherwise, I'm the last bandmember still up there messing with equipment -- and the next band is already setting up around me. That's annoying for everyone involved.

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 8 Feb 2010 8:03 pm

I've been tearing down onstage and obviously been having an issue. Since Ive had issues with more than one other band setting up on top of me, I asssume the fault is mine and not necessarily with the other bands. I need to get my stuff together better somehow.

Shane Glover · Post by **Shane Glover** » 8 Feb 2010 9:52 pm

Barry

With all due respect. That may be the way they do it in N.Y.
But where I come from they fight at the drop of a hat. If someone goes around using THE VOICE OF COMMAND. Bout half the drunks in the bar will drop the hat just to get it started.

I had a fella threaten to whip my a$$ one night cause I would not let his drunk buddy get up & sing some Elvis. Last gig I played a fight started cause the bouncer told a guy to quit spittin on the floor. I guess it just depends on what part of the country you are from.

Shane

Steve Norman · Post by **Steve Norman** » 9 Feb 2010 12:08 am

Shane Glover wrote:Barry

With all due respect. That may be the way they do it in N.Y.
But where I come from they fight at the drop of a hat. If someone goes around using THE VOICE OF COMMAND. Bout half the drunks in the bar will drop the hat just to get it started.

I had a fella threaten to whip my a$$ one night cause I would not let his drunk buddy get up & sing some Elvis. Last gig I played a fight started cause the bouncer told a guy to quit spittin on the floor. I guess it just depends on what part of the country you are from.

Shane

When I lived in Louisiana I had a few nights like that. Up here they just talk over you or go outside.

Ben You could make sure your bandmates know about your back and help you move stuff. I personally hate it when I dont have time to tune up and get ready because the band before me screwed around getting off stage and cost us set time. I also really think the 4 band bill is just a bad idea in Seattle unless its a daytime fair type thing. Attention spans are to short and bars are to cheap on the payout. All that trouble for 30 minutes untuned, your offstage just as you get warmed up, and you end up spending money after your 2 free drinks are gone. (Unless Country Dave is there with his flask of death...Good Lord..@_@...)

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 9 Feb 2010 2:56 am

When I need to get moving off a busy stage fast I unplug everything, move the amp off then pile everything on my set up pac seat and take that off stage. I sort stuff for final packing off stage. I then break down my steel on stage unless there is an easy spot off stage. I can get my stuff out of the way in about 2 minutes that way.

Now that I am playing an old style console steel I need extra set up time to get it in tune and let it settle into the stage temperature. I have had problems because of guys that don't know how to get there gear off stage.

Barry Hyman · Post by **Barry Hyman** » 9 Feb 2010 5:22 am

Shane, it is true that this is a very peaceful, laid-back part of the country. And it is also true that the band I play steel in is beloved, so nobody would be usually inclined to mess with us. And it is also true that if things really got ugly, I would be the first to run.

But that being said, I guess what really annoys me is the fact that bands have to go through this. It's hard to blame the musicians in the next band, and it is hard to blame the bar owners because in these financial times the alternative in some places would be no live music at all. But nonetheless it is a crystal-clear example of the oppression of musicians. That's why I usually turn down these type of gigs. As I said -- I'm too old, I need my peace of mind. And, luckily, I get quite a few gigs anyway...

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 9 Feb 2010 6:51 am

As Cal said - to me, the issue is whether or not the show organizers and club have thought out the logistics and have some type of reasonable staging area and process, or if it's completely random and madcap. If they've thought out the logistics, it's easy to go with the flow and get stuff off in 2-3 minutes. If they haven't, then I'm not sacrificing my equipment just to get it off fast - where's it supposed to go, outside on the sidewalk?

As long as there's a staging area for the big stuff, the longest process is the small stuff like bars, picks, capos, cables and so on. I most always double on guitar and steel, and sometimes play other instruments. So I usually have a bunch of little stuff and connections that have to get cleared out before I can touch the big stuff. I have a routine to gather that up fast, and then the big stuff goes off immediately, as long as there's somewhere to move it to. I prefer to tear the big stuff down offstage.

Most bands we've played with are understanding - they have the same problems we do, and as long as nobody's dawdling or schmoozing, and we're all focused on humpin' our gear and getting the job done, we work cooperatively. The occasional band with an arrogant rock-star attitude finds it just doesn't work. I'm not a 5'8" vegetarian pacifist, and do not shove around easily.

Sometimes on crowded, multi-act club shows with a tight schedule, there's a drum and bass rig set up for everybody. Drummer just changes snare, bass player plugs in. If it's balls to the walls to get off, they sometimes help move big stuff as I clear my cables and small stuff - they know the drill.

The Steel Guitar Forum

tear down on stage or off?

tear down on stage or off?

tear-down...

small venues

yep