Is this a legitimate sale on a Promat?

Duncan Hodge · Post by **Duncan Hodge** » 8 Nov 2009 8:56 pm

Don't meant to cause a ruckus if the deal is legit, but I saw this for sale on eBay? It seems like an incredibly low price for a quality instrument like a Promat. Also, I believe that I have seen several of the pictures of these Promats before on the Forum.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Planked-Maple-Mahog ... 518e1c3bb7

If this is a true deal then I apologize in advance to the seller and will seriously consider trying to buy it at the incredibly low price.
Duncan

George Rozak · Post by **George Rozak** » 8 Nov 2009 9:11 pm

That's only a starting bid & it doesn't appear to be a "no reserve" auction. I suspect the reserve price will be more in line with the actual value. The seller certainly appears to have a pretty decent feedback rating.

If I were thinking of bidding on it, I might first email the seller to see if he'd send me a phone number. I'd feel a lot more comfortable bidding on it after having established voice contact first to ask any questions I might have about the sale.

George

Chuck Snider R.I.P. · Post by **Chuck Snider R.I.P.** » 8 Nov 2009 9:15 pm

The price they have set for the buy it now is a steal for one of those guitars from what I have seen on here. However, even if it is legit, something sure looks odd with the gyrations they put you through before you can even place a bid. Which makes no sense if it is a "buy it now" only, which means you can't bid they only want a single "buy it now" buyer, but only after you contact the seller and only using their personal email id and not using the contact seller????? The ad doesn't appear to be set up as a "Buy it now", which adds more doubt in my mind. Why all the hoops to jump thru for a buy it now???? Sure looks fishy to me. Awful tempting price though if it is legit.

Ken Pippus · Post by **Ken Pippus** » 8 Nov 2009 10:24 pm

For what it's worth, he won't let me pick it up in Evergreen. Odd.

KP

Bryan Daste · Post by **Bryan Daste** » 8 Nov 2009 11:08 pm

Here's something else fishy. The seller has several other items for sale, all with the same "Buy it Now" directions in the text of the ad (not available as a "Buy it Now" button at the top, like most ads). And here's the weird part - these items ALL have one bid at $88.88 and a "Buy it Now" price of $1,500.

http://cgi.ebay.com/VINTAGE-SCANDALLI-A ... 518e1c22dc

http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Studer-169- ... 518e1c2290

http://cgi.ebay.com/vintage-BBC-icon-MA ... 5ad4ba09a4

And in the body of each ad, the seller instructs buyers to email him/her directly, and that he/she will not sell through bidding, but only accept the Buy it Now price of $1,500. Very strange! Are there any experienced eBay users out there who have see this kind of "auction" before? Is it legit?

Bryan Daste · Post by **Bryan Daste** » 8 Nov 2009 11:15 pm

Even weirder...I looked at where the image for the ad's directions came from:
http://www.turbolister2010.biz/1.jpg

If you look at
http://www.turbolister2010.biz/

It's just 2 lines of text in a language unknown to me.

?????????

Bryan Daste · Post by **Bryan Daste** » 8 Nov 2009 11:18 pm

Whoa!!!! I did a Google Translate on the site's text (from Romanian to English), and I got this:

"This is MY trick PLEASE Stay away
CA's fire"

Also notice that the pictures all have the Steel Guitar Forum imprint - meaning they were downloaded from this forum.

Bryan Daste · Post by **Bryan Daste** » 9 Nov 2009 12:09 am

OK, it's a scam. I noticed that the person listed as "seller" had a different contact email address than the one listed in the ad text, so I emailed her asking if this was really her item.

This was her reply:

Hi Bryan..I've been hacked..Ebay doesn't seem to be able to get rid of the listings...All those high dollar actions are scams....

You were smart to email.
Carol

So that's that. If it looks too good to be true, it probably is.

Andrew Roblin · Post by **Andrew Roblin** » 9 Nov 2009 3:47 am

Good investigation, Bryan, Ken, Chuck, George & Duncan.

David Higginbotham · Post by **David Higginbotham** » 9 Nov 2009 5:45 am

Good job Bryan! I knew it was a scam when I first read the ad since it isn't in compliance with ebay protocol. Someone hacked into my account several years back and placed about 50 listings under my account. I was competely locked out of the account and had to call ebay. Fortunately ebay was able to end the listings and no harm was done.

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 9 Nov 2009 7:03 am

when selling on Ebay seller MUST use either PayPal or other electronic pay, there is no more checks or MO I guess, I listed few days ago couple banjos and I had to use PayPal even tho I tried not to (seems too complicated) ... there is not that many Promat guitars in US right now (and I have 3 myself) so, as far as I know all of the Promat owners are members on this forum...

Db

Ken Pippus · Post by **Ken Pippus** » 9 Nov 2009 8:08 am

The listing seems to have disappeared this morning!!!

KP

Duncan Hodge · Post by **Duncan Hodge** » 9 Nov 2009 12:10 pm

These days we must remain "ever vigilant".

David Kellogg · Post by **David Kellogg** » 9 Nov 2009 3:39 pm

I have been a Ebay member since Feb 97 and was one of the first 2000 to sign up. I can't tell you how many scams I have seen on Ebay. I was so disappointed trying to buy cars out of state I started a nationwide inspection company called Carchex.com. Sold that company to a fellow named Jason Goldsmith from the east coast in 04 and he has buit it into a mega company. Had my life threatened by a overseas organization that had a really sofisticated scam going on Ebay with the recruiting being done on Monster, Yahoo career builders and other sites. It was the largest they had ever come across. When I pointed that one out to Ebay they said they didn't see a problem, shows you how much they care. Monster jumped right on it and contacted Ebay, boy did they want info then. Anyway, I saw the deal on the Promat a month ago after it was sold on Ebay by a forum member. Then it came up under a user with tons of feedback but wanted you to do a buy it now out side of Ebay for $1399. I the seller but I couldn't trace him. Anyway I could write a book on this stuff. You know what they say, if it's too good to be true. I have noticed one thing about the pedal steel community even on craigslist, they are real genuine and honest. that's my 2 cents worth.

Rick Winfield · Post by **Rick Winfield** » 9 Nov 2009 4:12 pm

You gentlemen have something to be proud of.
A sharp eye for informing, and protecting we forum brothers.
In the past I was caught-up in 2 scams, on eBay, while trying to purchase a steel. Fortunately I followed my instincts and was able to "rescind", and otherwise wranle my way out ! Many others have not been so lucky !
thanks to all in the "brotherhood" for everything
Rick

Duncan Hodge · Post by **Duncan Hodge** » 9 Nov 2009 5:11 pm

Thanks for all the great input on this post gentlemen. That was some pretty spiffy detective work, Bryan. Keep your eye out folks. If the history of Damir's old purple Fessenden teaches us anything (do y'all remember that one), this Promat will appear several more times on eBay in the future and eBay will be more than glad to accept the listing.
Duncan

Ray Riley · Post by **Ray Riley** » 10 Nov 2009 9:53 am

Another one bites the DUST!!!!!!!!

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 10 Nov 2009 4:04 pm

there is very limited number of Promats in US, most guys who own them are on this forum. If you ever have any doubts about a Promat guitar that pops up for sale, you can email Mr.Papic or me. Mr.Papic try to keep tight records on where his guitars are located and who has them. Usually people email me when they want to sell their Promat, and at this moment I know of only one black D-10 that is for sale by an older gentleman other than the Carls maple/mahagony D-10 that is listed on this forum.

Db

Dale Ware · Post by **Dale Ware** » 10 Nov 2009 10:04 pm

This picture was listed on the Forum a while back when both guitars were for sale. The plank maple went to Ebay and I bought it there. I think a gentleman in San Antonio, Tx. still has the otherone.

CrowBear Schmitt · Post by **CrowBear Schmitt** » 11 Nov 2009 2:33 am

What about this one ?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Pedal-Steel-Guitar_ ... 33575a6d55

Bryan Daste · Post by **Bryan Daste** » 11 Nov 2009 2:42 am

Looks like a steeler named Bobby Dardeman - http://www.onlinesteelers.com/nameslist ... e=Dardeman

And the price is much more realistic! Although I never thought I'd see the words "rape around pp" in an eBay ad.

Tim Walker · Post by **Tim Walker** » 12 Nov 2009 6:42 am

I thought that name sounded familiar.........

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... t=dardeman

Bryan Daste · Post by **Bryan Daste** » 12 Nov 2009 8:53 am

Ooooh, I remember that whole thing...careful.

Duncan Hodge · Post by **Duncan Hodge** » 12 Nov 2009 12:40 pm

I believe that we've kinda settled the issue of the original fradulent Promat listed on eBay. As to the second Promat listed on eBay, who knows??? Anyway, I suppose that we can close this thread Mr. Moderator.
Duncan

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 12 Nov 2009 9:34 pm

this is the other (black) Promat I was talking about.It was offered to me and I refused the offer since I already have 2 black Promats.Always use PayPal to pay for your purchase, that way if you don`t get your guitar as soon as you contact PayPal they will pull back the cash out of the sellers bank and send him in red.Trust me, I don`t know how, but they can do it. When I bought a banjo on Ebay seller tried to pull some scam on me but PayPal acted fast and furious..LOL .. and even tho he already had the money and pulled it out of his bank account, PayPal got their money back and he ended up being $1600 in red...he was pissed and mad but I finaly did get my banjo, and even tho I didn`t like PayPal, from then on that is the only way I would pay for my Ebay purchases.Be careful.

Db

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Is this a legitimate sale on a Promat?

Is this a legitimate sale on a Promat?

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Promat for sale