Comfort vs. Tone

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 3 Jun 2009 8:22 pm

When selecting a steel guitar, which is more important to you: comfort (ergonomic fit) or the quality of the tone it produces?

I realize that there are other factors, but for this poll let's just focus on these two.

Roual Ranes · Post by **Roual Ranes** » 4 Jun 2009 3:25 am

Comfort.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 4 Jun 2009 3:49 am

Gotta have both.

Billy Carr · Post by **Billy Carr** » 4 Jun 2009 4:31 am

I prefer a guitar to be easy to sit behind and I like for KL/Pedals to all feel easy and be in perfect tune. Tone & sustain, I try to match pick ups with the particular guitar regardless of brand until I zero in on my tone. Sometimes it takes a while to nail it though.

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 4 Jun 2009 4:33 am

No versus about it for me, they're both critical. If I ultimately resolve that a guitar can't be made to both sound good and fit me comfortably, out the door it goes. But after mistakenly trading a great guitar which needed to be sized to fit me properly, I will go to some effort to try to make a naturally great-sounding guitar fit me. As long as the basic size fit is there, one can raise or lower a guitar, move levers, and so on. But I have gotten rid of a couple of thin-bodied S-10s because I'm too tall to deal with them.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 4 Jun 2009 7:33 am

I think a lot of players (wrongly?) consider a "quality tone" as the one they like. In reality, tone is so subjective it's hard to classify. Unlike most players, I like many tones, and I can easily change the tone if I have to (though a lot of players can't). That said, the ergonomics are a lot more challenging to alter, so I'd say "comfort" is at least as important as "tone".

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 4 Jun 2009 7:58 am

I come down on the side of comfort. That's why I play a Williams crossover. To me, the playing position for either neck of a standard D-10 is uncomfortable.

I can get a tone that I like out of almost any steel guitar. Feeling relaxed enough behind them to play well is another matter. When a guitar forces me into an uncomfortable sitting position, I can't play my best.

Barry Blackwood · Post by **Barry Blackwood** » 4 Jun 2009 9:10 am

Basically, you are seated behind a plank of varying width. Except for adjusting the height and playing angle to suit you, how can one plank be more/less comfortable than another?

(I'm sure someone will tell me now....)

richard burton · Post by **richard burton** » 4 Jun 2009 11:00 am

It's nonsense to come down on the side of comfort.

What's the point of having a comfortable steel that sounds like crap ??

Tone is the first priority in my book.
If it sounds good, I'll make that steel fit me

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 4 Jun 2009 11:31 am

richard burton wrote:What's the point of having a comfortable steel that sounds like crap ??

Seeing that look of total shock, disbelief, awe, and bewilderment on your face - when I show you how good it can really sound!

You can't buy the sound, you have to learn how to make it!

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 4 Jun 2009 11:44 am

Barry Blackwood wrote:Basically, you are seated behind a plank of varying width. Except for adjusting the height and playing angle to suit you, how can one plank be more/less comfortable than another? (I'm sure someone will tell me now....)

Pedal positions, pedal spacing, knee lever positions, relative heights of the two necks, pedal action and string spacing are examples of ergonomic "comfort" factors.

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 4 Jun 2009 11:46 am

richard burton wrote:It's nonsense to come down on the side of comfort.

What's the point of having a comfortable steel that sounds like crap ??

Tone is the first priority in my book.
If it sounds good, I'll make that steel fit me

Try as I might, I can't make a Fender 1000 fit me. I can get the tone I want from it, but it will always be too big for me.

richard burton · Post by **richard burton** » 4 Jun 2009 11:51 am

Donny,
I, also, can usually get a good tone from most steels, but I have played a few, not many, that just didn't have it.

If I'd known you then, I could have shipped the offending steel over for you to astound me with your 'midas touch'

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 4 Jun 2009 12:17 pm

i've never really dealt with an uncomfortable steel, or at least one that couldn't be adjusted to fit.
however , tone potential is either there or it's not!

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 4 Jun 2009 1:07 pm

ahh , the "tone" thing comes up again.

All I can say is that "tone" is subjective, comfort is not.

I guess many times we have never been with someone who said, "Man I love that guys tone" while you were gagging.

Donny said it above and I fully agree. What I may think as being the holy grail may not even be close to what others feel is quality and vice versa.

The good news is that for the most part, modern Steels all sound pretty good but they may not be comfortable to all players, this one size fits all thing doesn't work for everyone.

I doubt that anyone is buying a Steel that "they" do not think sounds good.

and that's all I've got to say on the subject.

t

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 4 Jun 2009 1:10 pm

Donny Hinson wrote:
You can't buy the sound, you have to learn how to make it!

Yeah, but it's a lot easier if you have something to start with.

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 4 Jun 2009 2:17 pm

Most pedal steels sound a lot better than they feel, in my opinion. A steel that "sounds like crap" (Richard's words) is a rarity. I've only encountered two in my life, and they were both lap steels.

On the other hand, about half of the pedal steels I've sat behind were wrong for me ergonomically, many in ways that can't be easily changed. That's why I choose comfort over tone.

Roual Ranes · Post by **Roual Ranes** » 4 Jun 2009 5:36 pm

Tone thing again. I have heard guys that think they have a good tone and it sounds like crap to me............subjective............you bet. To each his own.

Dennis Manuel · Post by **Dennis Manuel** » 4 Jun 2009 6:04 pm

To me it's tone! I have sat behind some great playing guitars but the sound was not there, no matter what I seemed to do.

May I also add, I have seen major players switch brands and to my ears they never accomplish the same tone either.

Barry Blackwood · Post by **Barry Blackwood** » 4 Jun 2009 6:15 pm

Pedal positions, pedal spacing, knee lever positions, relative heights of the two necks, pedal action and string spacing are examples of ergonomic "comfort" factors.

If the instrument in question is physically uncomfortable, it would be understandable if you were comparing it to one you had become accustomed to after playing it for years.It's been my experience that these ergonomic factors don't vary enough from one (modern) steel to another, that most can't be adjusted to accommodate the individual. Tone-wise, if it sucks (to you,) it will probably always suck. Just my 2 cents.

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 4 Jun 2009 6:34 pm

I voted "both," but in retrospect...

I like many tones. I like Buddy's tone with his Bigsby on ET records, his Sho~Bud tone on "Rose City Chimes," and his Emmons tone on "Way To Survive." Hell, I even liked his "blister a beagle's ear" tone on the Roger Miller Trip In The Country album.

I liked Chalker's tone on Big Hits On Big Steel, while I also like the exact opposite, Mooney's tone on the Buck Owens and Wynn Stewart recordings.

"Good" tone is elusive to me,... there are many... as I'm sure you can deduce from the paragraphs above. What I do like is notes... I want to hear the melodies that move my emotions, the notes against the chords that make me go to the guitar with the sheet music on the stand and work up an arrangement, and have my wife walk past the music room door and say, "hey, that sounds nice."

To do that without fighting the guitar, the guitar has to fit me so that I don't spend energy doing things physically that aren't natural or unfamiliar to my body. So I'm fixing to change my vote:

I vote "ergonomics."

I have and play Emmons, Sho~Bud, Fessenden, and Bigsby guitars. They all sound good to me.

FWIW, my guitars sit (bottom of endplates to floor) at 24.5 inches, 1.5 inches shorter than the 26" standard. I'm a short li'l sumb!tch.

John DeBoalt · Post by **John DeBoalt** » 4 Jun 2009 6:40 pm

For me comfort over tone every time. Playing a guitar that doesn't feel good is like walking a rough road in ill fitting boots. Tone only involves the ears, and can be improved with the amp settings. Comfort behind the instrument effects everything else including concentration. John

Bill Holt · Post by **Bill Holt** » 4 Jun 2009 6:52 pm

But we still love you, Herb.

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 4 Jun 2009 7:01 pm

Thanks, Bill. Hey, long time no talk... you still packing heat in the cause of law 'n order?

Bill Holt · Post by **Bill Holt** » 4 Jun 2009 7:13 pm

Yes, sir. You know how rednecks and their guns are. LOL! Not too much longer to get my 20 years in this racket. I'm the assistant jail administrator down here. Sounds lovely, but I just do whatever needs doing. Not doing much DARE and NO patrol work, and my schedule is very flexible - it allows me to play with Billy Mata every week. Can't beat that with a stick.

You still working some with Cornell? How's Kathy?

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Comfort vs. Tone

Which is more important, comfort or tone?

Comfort vs. Tone

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