How do you hold the bar?

Glen Derksen · Post by **Glen Derksen** » 9 Jan 2009 8:21 pm

My previous instructor told me I should hold the bar like this, but with all due respect to him, it feels unnatural and uncomfortable:

This way is more comfortable and I can play better. Any opinions? Thanks.

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Charles Davidson · Post by **Charles Davidson** » 9 Jan 2009 8:32 pm

If the second way makes you play better,then I would think that's the RIGHT way. DYKBC.

Joe Drivdahl · Post by **Joe Drivdahl** » 9 Jan 2009 9:14 pm

Charles,
I hold my bar sort of like pic #1. I've been teased for holding my thumb so far back. Its something that just happened. I can't control it. My thumb just goes there, but it is kind of cool to find that I'm not the only guy who holds the bar in such a way.

Joe

Whip Lashaway · Post by **Whip Lashaway** » 9 Jan 2009 10:12 pm

Charles, I hold mine between my middle finger and thumb with my index finger pushing down. My index finger is out alost to the end of the bar. I use my thumb for muting as well as holding the bar. I'm afraid I couldn't control the bar while holding it any of the ways shown in the pictures. I guess it's preference and technique. You should be HOLDING the bar though not just pushing it around. You control it not it controlling you. God Bless, Whip.

Glen Derksen · Post by **Glen Derksen** » 9 Jan 2009 11:05 pm

Whip Lashaway wrote:Charles, I hold mine between my middle finger and thumb with my index finger pushing down. My index finger is out alost to the end of the bar. I use my thumb for muting as well as holding the bar. I'm afraid I couldn't control the bar while holding it any of the ways shown in the pictures. I guess it's preference and technique. You should be HOLDING the bar though not just pushing it around. You control it not it controlling you. God Bless, Whip.

I think you're right about holding the bar as opposed to pushing it around. I need to perfect a technique so that I can lift the bar in order to play single note stuff.

Brett Day · Post by **Brett Day** » 10 Jan 2009 12:55 am

I hold the bar by extending my left index finger out with my other fingers on my left hand curled on the strings kinda. My left index finger stays on the top groove of the bar. Sometimes, even with my left hand on the bar, I've gotta adjust it to get a better grip on it. So my left hand is kinda curled on top of the bar a little bit. The reason for my bar technique is because of cerebral palsy.

Brett

Jim Walker · Post by **Jim Walker** » 10 Jan 2009 1:22 am

Steve Broatch · Post by **Steve Broatch** » 10 Jan 2009 2:17 am

Same as you Glen. I tried the way in your first photo because I'd seen a few advanced players doing it and they seemed to have great control over their vibrato. But when I try it, it feels unnatural and awkward. I've ended up going back to laying my finger flat on top of the bar. It works for me.

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 10 Jan 2009 3:00 am

I never think about it. I just do what comes naturally.

Whip Lashaway · Post by **Whip Lashaway** » 10 Jan 2009 8:21 am

Keep in mind that there is NOTHING natural about playing steel. EVERYTHING is a learned skill. Some are easier than others but you learn it all. Nobody was born with a tone bar in there hand. You have to learn to hold it in a way that allows you to have control. And as with just about every other thing with steel there are several ways to accomplish the task. As you continue to grow and gain skills you will more than likely modify your initial approach. Sometimes imitating a pro will be helpful and sometimes it won't. Just ask yourself why you do it this way or that and is there a better way. And if there is a better way, it most assuredly won't be easier the first time you try! Just keep plugging along and good luck. God Bless, Whip

Ron Whitfield · Post by **Ron Whitfield** » 10 Jan 2009 9:45 am

Glen, if you asked Jerry Byrd, he'd tell you to get used to holding the bar the way you show in the first frame, the 'uncomfortable' way, and with more arch at the first knuckle. It's merely a control and pivot point. The thumb and middle finger do the rest of the 'holding'. That's how I learned it and would find it nye on impossible to do so otherwise. It's hardly uncomfortable, you just got to get used to it.
If you wish to get the most out of the fretboard and your playing, do it how many would describe it, 'the right way'.

Brian Kurlychek · Post by **Brian Kurlychek** » 10 Jan 2009 11:05 am

I think that which ever way allows you to obtain the best tone is the correct way.

The only reason I can think of for the bent index is for increased downward pressure on the bar.

Keep in mind that you might want the thumb a little further up- as in the second picture so you can use it to block.

I also tried the bent finger method but don't like it, so I use flat finger method. But hey, I also work the pedals in bare feet or socks, so I'm probrobly not going to turn out to be the best player, but at least I will have a unique tone!

Ron Whitfield · Post by **Ron Whitfield** » 10 Jan 2009 11:21 am

If the player chooses to play minus slants then who would care how it's held. But if you want to be able to pull off the extremes in slanting, and who wouldn't?, then the curve is where you stand your best chance, by far.

Dave Magram · Post by **Dave Magram** » 10 Jan 2009 11:31 am

Hi Glenn,

You said that:

“I think you're right about holding the bar as opposed to pushing it around. I need to perfect a technique so that I can lift the bar in order to play single note stuff.”

There’s a wonderful close-up shot on Youtube of the late, great Hal Rugg playing one of his fabulous solos-- as only he could do it.

George Jones and Tammy Wynette - Milwaukee Here I Come
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=0pQObXNIQvo

The video shows how this master player held the bar, and lifted it (at 2:06). Hal is definitely in full control!
Pure Rugg all the way!

- Dave

Ulric Utsi-Åhlin · Post by **Ulric Utsi-Åhlin** » 10 Jan 2009 11:52 am

I sorta cup my hand over the bar,covering it so well
You don´t see much of it,it´s part of my muting
technique and the only way I know ; and I frequently
play single lines with the tip,holding the bar at an
angle,as one would in a forward slant ; force of
habit but works for me...McUtsi

Charles Davidson · Post by **Charles Davidson** » 10 Jan 2009 11:54 am

In my opinion it's still what works best for EACH player is the right way,just look at how Bobby Koeffer held his bar,sure did'nt hurt his playing. DYKBC.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 10 Jan 2009 12:04 pm

Think of how a violin player holds a bow. If they grip it in a way that is natural at first they will never have the relaxed control needed to play well.

Many steel players starting off make the mistake of thinking of the bar like a movable capo. Its not. I look at the bar as an extension of my index finger and point at each note I want to play with the tip of my finger. In the Hal Rugg clip you can see that he is playing his high notes with the rounded edge of the bar. The bar is slightly angled so it only touches the strings that are being picked. That is one of the reasons it sounds so clear and precise.

Glen, in both your pictures it looks as if you are putting focus into the back and overall length of the bar rather than the tip. This can make it very difficult to play in tune or get a good tone.

My advice is to find Buddy Charleton or take a skype lesson from Joe Wright and spend the entire lesson on holding/controlling the bar.

Brian Kurlychek · Post by **Brian Kurlychek** » 10 Jan 2009 12:22 pm

Joe wright says in his instructional you can hold it either way if I recall correctly.

Ron ! · Post by **Ron !** » 10 Jan 2009 12:30 pm

I also work the pedals in bare feet or socks

As does Ralph Mooney.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 10 Jan 2009 5:16 pm

Glen, your "more comfortable" way is better, except it's not necessary to bend your thumb like that. Try keeping your thumb fairly straight, so the thumb-tip is somewhere's near the center of the bar. You might find that way easier. Your bar grip should be very relaxed and easy, not tight and stiff.

Glen Derksen · Post by **Glen Derksen** » 10 Jan 2009 5:42 pm

Thanks, everyone for all the suggestions. I'll try them all and see which works the best. I would like to get a better bar, the one I'm using is a JD. I've been reading good things about the Emmons and BJS bars. I might order one of the two, or maybe one of each.

Dave Magram · Post by **Dave Magram** » 18 Jan 2009 11:14 am

Glenn,

There is a lot more to left hand technique than first appears. I’ve learned a lot from trying to emulate what I’ve seen the best players do. The comments from Whip and Bob H. above sound pretty similar to what I've seen.

When I started playing, I got some excellent advice from a couple of fine steel players on holding the bar. The basic principle is use as light a touch as possible. The primary function of your middle finger and thumb is simply to create a little space between them to allow the bar the freedom to roll for a vibrato effect. This means not gripping the bar tightly, as many beginners do. Rather you just loosely “corral” it between your relaxed thumb and middle finger.

Of course, the little “bar-space” between your thumb and middle finger must remain perpendicular to the strings for good intonation. I have found that it helps to have your middle-finger and thumb relaxed and resting lightly on the strings, rather than gripping the bar tightly.

To lift the back of the bar, as Hal does at the end of his solo on “Milwaukee Here I Come”, you simply squeeze your thumb towards your middle finger, which causes the back of the bar to lift up, creating a blocking effect on the un-barred strings, and allowing open strings to be picked.

As can be seen in the Youtube videos of Hal Rugg and others, the best players do not keep the bar covering all the strings (as many of us did when we started), but instead “follow” the right hand as it moves from the lower strings to the higher strings and back.
Check out the Youtube clip of Buddy Emmons on “Jeannie Seely-Mr. Record Man” http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Rr8cynrrJH0

One of the advantages of the bar-following technique is that it allows the left hand to assist with blocking. I've noticed that many top-notch players extend their middle finger a tiny bit beyond the nose of the bar to help block the higher strings when the bar is shifted to the lower strings. They also usually extend their thumb as far as possible alongside the bar to allow the thumb to block lower notes as the bar follows the right hand to the higher strings. This can be seen on various Youtube videos with closeup shots, including Rugg, Emmons, Paul Franklin, Tom Brumley, Mickey Adams, and many more.

Another advantage of “bar-following” is that you do not need as much pressure from the index finger on top of the bar.

The result of all this is a very relaxed left hand that just loosely corrals the bar, and light pressure on top of it. This means no more hand cramps. It also adds several more blocking techniques, greatly aids your control of the bar, and helps with your tone and intonation.

Regarding bar-shopping-- I have an old Emmons bar and a newer BJS bar, both of which are excellent-- which means that the tone is up to me. The magic is not in the bar, but in the bar technique.

- Dave

Jim Paschall · Post by **Jim Paschall** » 18 Jan 2009 1:30 pm

This may be straying from topic but my problem has always been holding on to the bar rather than how to hold it. I've tried keeping my super slick BJS bar as clean as possible. Sometimes washing the bar and hands with soap and water before playing helps for a while...and then, oops.
Any thoughts?

Jim

Charles Davidson · Post by **Charles Davidson** » 18 Jan 2009 2:18 pm

Jim,I always had trouble holding a regular round bullet bar,untill I finally found [after a lot of searching] a Carter bar with the grooves on the sides,a forum member in Canada had one for sale,that solved my problem. DYKBC.

Brett Day · Post by **Brett Day** » 18 Jan 2009 4:09 pm

Charles Davidson wrote:Jim,I always had trouble holding a regular round bullet bar,untill I finally found [after a lot of searching] a Carter bar with the grooves on the sides,a forum member in Canada had one for sale,that solved my problem. DYKBC.

Charles, I've got a bar with grooves on it and it's the best bar I've got. I started with a Dunlop tone bar and it slid around in my hand too much, but the grooved bar is my best bar.

Brett

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How do you hold the bar?

How do you hold the bar?

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Great Hal Rugg solo on Youtube

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