Why are strings on a steel guitar not parallel?

Ron Randall · Post by **Ron Randall** » 5 Jun 2008 6:22 pm

Ok here goes

Why are the strings on steel guitars not parallel?
We use a straight line (the bar)to be perpendicular to the strings, but it seems to me, that only one string at a time can be perfectly perpendicular to the bar.

Yes, this is nitpicking. But after reading about microtonal tuning, I know that a tiny bit of change in lenghth makes a difference.

Would a guitar with parallel strings play more in tune?

Ron

Stuart Legg · Post by **Stuart Legg** » 5 Jun 2008 11:18 pm

Hi Ron
Without getting technical.
The principle behind this is to have the strings closer together where you place the bar over the fret marks and wider apart where you place your picking fingers.
As for effecting the tuning. It is a very, very small almost immeasurable over all percentage increase in length of the string to even be a consideration. No guitar string is perfect and the string itself will vary from point to point, so who knows maybe the extra minute fraction of an inch will be an improvement.

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 6 Jun 2008 12:03 am

As I understand it, the affinely parameterized geodesic of the string is congealed in an N-dimensional pseudo-Riemannian manifold [where N = number of knee levers], rendering the bioflexenoid resonation of the string in a contra-parallel phase space against the covariant derivative of the metric tensor of the neghboring string, at least on the E9 neck. I am not sure about the C6 neck. Perhaps Bill Hankey could explain it better.

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 6 Jun 2008 1:54 am

Yes, this is nitpicking. There are other factors - especially bar control - that cause much more pitch error than this.

For example - consider the case at the 12th fret. Measuring my Fessenden, the width across all 10 strings is 2-9/16" at the nut and 2-13/16" at the 12th fret, for a difference of 1/4". The strings fan out evenly. In the worst case, for the first and tenth strings, the length of the angled string will be the hypotenuse of half the scale length (12" = .5*24") and half the difference (.125") = sqrt(0.125^2 + 12^2) = 12.00065102" instead of 12" for a purely straight string. The differences are smaller than that for the inner strings. That's a difference of about 1/1500 of an inch or smaller.

The fret-to-fret distance there is about 3/4", so if the bar is perfectly straight, the pitch error is - at worst - about .00065102/0.75 = 0.000868 of a semitone, or about 0.087 cents. This is way below the threshold of human pitch discrimination. Double it or triple it, and it's still insignificant - 2 or 3 tenths of a cent. I think the pitch error is a complete non-issue.

I guess I can see an argument pro and con for fanning the strings like this. To me, the real issue is whether or not it's better to have narrower spacing over the frets than at the picking position. Seems to me that some people like wider string spacing there to make slants easier, but others prefer them closer together. Then again, there are probably arguments pro and con for having more or less narrow spacing at the picking position. Some seem to like wider string separation to make it easier to pick adjacent strings, but others like it narrower to facilitate wide grips. Everything's a tradeoff, eh?

Stephen Gambrell · Post by **Stephen Gambrell** » 6 Jun 2008 2:15 am

Y'all smell something? There goes the acadamecians again, trying to hide behind a blamed SCIENCE book and blame Ptolemy and them cause they don't know the REAL answer, which, in a nutshell, is:
The strings are futher apart at the changer, so when your pick comes off, you can reach down and pick it back up.
Dam eggheads.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 6 Jun 2008 3:44 am

Why are the strings on steel guitars not parallel?

There have been pedal steels built with parallel strings, but they were no better or worse than any other steel. As Dave said, the differences are quite insignificant.

IMHO, reading about microtonal scales and tuning will do the same thing for your musicianship that reading about the ingredients of a hot-dog will do for your appetite.

There is such a thing as too much information.

Bent Romnes · Post by **Bent Romnes** » 6 Jun 2008 3:48 am

When I built my steel I didn't know any better and made the strings go in a straight line. After discovering my "mistake" I thought about it and could not find a valid reason for steels being built with the strings fanning out...other than maybe making a wee bit more clearance for the changer fingers. Mine works fine with the strings in a straight line.

John P. Phillips · Post by **John P. Phillips** » 6 Jun 2008 4:10 am

Huh ??? Darn, Where did I put that dictionary ?

Tamara James · Post by **Tamara James** » 6 Jun 2008 4:45 am

Stephen Gambrell wrote:
The strings are futher apart at the changer, so when your pick comes off, you can reach down and pick it back up.
Dam eggheads.

I think I'm in love...

Don Discher · Post by **Don Discher** » 6 Jun 2008 5:09 am

I agree with Earnest B. whatever he said.

ed packard · Post by **ed packard** » 6 Jun 2008 5:22 am

How about...just a left over from when the standard guitar was laid flat, retuned, and the strings raised?

There have been a few made with par'l strings, including my BEAST. You won't hear any pitch issues either way.

To carry it to the extreme, when you place the bar on the strings they don't all change pitch equally from the pressure (even if it is the same across the strings, and whether or not the string tops are in plane)...and then there is the pitch change just from the hand temp and the bar friction = endless errors.

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 6 Jun 2008 5:23 am

It's because parallel strings are UGLY!

Jim Sliff · Post by **Jim Sliff** » 6 Jun 2008 5:44 am

Doug and Dave wrote those posts just for me. How thoughful.

(knocking Steve out of the way...)

Michael Douchette · Post by **Michael Douchette** » 6 Jun 2008 5:58 am

Earnest Bovine wrote:As I understand it, the affinely parameterized geodesic of the string is congealed in an N-dimensional pseudo-Riemannian manifold [where N = number of knee levers], rendering the bioflexenoid resonation of the string in a contra-parallel phase space against the covariant derivative of the metric tensor of the neghboring string, at least on the E9 neck. I am not sure about the C6 neck. Perhaps Bill Hankey could explain it better.

Man! Now THAT is some seriously ernest bovine scatology!!

(Good one, EB!)

Jim Pitman · Post by **Jim Pitman** » 6 Jun 2008 5:58 am

Concerning bar slants - A guitar with parallel strings and wide string spacing is much easier to be consistent with bar angle. I find I am much more in tune. Narrow string spacing is one thing, then to change width adds yet another source of detune when doing three string bar slants.
On the other hand why do we pedallers need to be doing three string bar slants?

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 6 Jun 2008 6:13 am

As far as slants are concerned, the fact that the frets get narrower as you go up the neck has more to do with slant error than the slight fanning of the strings.

Finis Spier · Post by **Finis Spier** » 6 Jun 2008 6:27 am

WHAT?

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 6 Jun 2008 7:17 am

What, What?

Ron Whitfield · Post by **Ron Whitfield** » 6 Jun 2008 8:18 am

Some steels do have the strings completely paralell, and Jerry Byrd said this is ultimately the proper way to have them, providing the string spacing is such that multi string slants are aligned as perfect as possible, much as Jim P. has said.
I have a Dynalap set up like this and it is no problem at the nut end for slants, or anything else. I prefer it that way, if only to know that my slants can be as correct as I can get them.

Bo Legg · Post by **Bo Legg** » 6 Jun 2008 8:53 am

Junior Knight · Post by **Junior Knight** » 6 Jun 2008 9:20 am

Here goes...{flame}...
Just play the steel guitar...??? $:\$

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 6 Jun 2008 9:58 am

Donny:

IMHO, reading about microtonal scales and tuning will do the same thing for your musicianship that reading about the ingredients of a hot-dog will do for your appetite.

If you are a musician it can help your musicality to understand the ingredients that you use to create your sound just as a chef can a better cook if he understands his ingredients.

With that I think that parallel (or not) strings has basicly nothing to do with being able to play in tune.

Bent Romnes · Post by **Bent Romnes** » 6 Jun 2008 10:05 am

Junior Knight wrote: Just play the steel guitar... $:\$

...and that should be the final word on THAT subject.

Bob Farlow · Post by **Bob Farlow** » 6 Jun 2008 10:17 am

Yes, the "carpenter" has spoken

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 6 Jun 2008 10:18 am

geometry of divinity...GOD

perfect imperfection

The Steel Guitar Forum

Why are strings on a steel guitar not parallel?

Why are strings on a steel guitar not parallel?

angles, pressure, temperature, friction, planarity, et al.

strings