1950s Fender WHITE Steel Guitar

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 15 May 2008 4:24 pm

I just picked up this 1950s Fender White steel guitar. It's basically a Fender Champ with legs, made for a couple of years only, for music stores that were not Fender dealers. It has a real clean tone, and I'm wondering if anyone here plays one of these?

Richard Shatz · Post by **Richard Shatz** » 15 May 2008 4:56 pm

Doug,
Thin is exactly the adjective I would use to describe the sound of the White lap steel I used to have. It looks like a Champ and that's where it ends. I couldn't believe how tinney, for lack of a better description, it sounded.
I also had the matching White amp, which is supposed to be a Princeton clone (very sought after by Fender amp collectors). It sounded terrible as well.
They were sold as a student set in the mid 50s, as you know.
I sold my steel/amp set a few years ago for more than I payed and a lot more than they were worth.
All that said. Sometimes you can do some things to improve the sound of any electric guitar. After all, it's still a real vintage Fender.
Good luck on your road trip. You're going to need an amp with some real cahones to open the middle and bottom end.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 15 May 2008 5:00 pm

Thanks Richard, ...I edited my post just before you posted. Yes, you are right, the tone is "thin" and I'm doubtful that I can get the sound I'm looking for. I plan to road test this guitar with my band this weekend, so we'll see how it goes!

Bill Creller · Post by **Bill Creller** » 15 May 2008 5:09 pm

Maybe the pickup is not like it's Fender cousin?? I would think that with that body, it could be made to sound better. It's a nice looking guitar.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 15 May 2008 6:10 pm

The pickup and the other electronics appear to be regular Fender stuff, good quality stuff, unlike today. The nut and the bridge are the same as a Champ, scale length is 22 1/2", and the tuners are Kluson Deluxe. All of the ingredients are there... maybe it's the type of wood they used? There isn't as much sustain as other Fenders IMHO, and the tone is very thin. PU resistance measures 5.60K OHMS, which is pretty healthy. I know that Fender wound their pickups to produce a fairly thin tone, but this model is a little too bright for my taste.

Blake Hawkins · Post by **Blake Hawkins** » 16 May 2008 6:15 am

Doug,
I think you could improve the tone of this guitar by a small change in the wiring of the volume control.
Fender wired volume controls in a strange way in the early '50's not using all the terminals.

The improvement would be to connect the white wire from the pickup to the "top" of the volume control.
Ground the cold end and take the signal from the
center terminal.
In most Fender guitars this only requires that one wire be moved.

From your picture it looks like at least one terminal is unused.
If that is the cold terminal, then ground that.
Looks like the white is already on top.
I think it is an optical illusion, but it looks as if
the terminal on which the white wire is connected may be touching the case of the pot.
Blake

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 16 May 2008 8:38 am

Thanks Blake, I'll check out the wiring when I get a chance. I'm a little hesitant to resolder anything however because I'm not very good with that kind of work.

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 16 May 2008 2:46 pm

I don't know squat about the wiring, but,,, usually when a terminal is bent back to touch the pot's casing, it's soldered. The one on this guitar doesn't appear to be.

Bill Creller · Post by **Bill Creller** » 16 May 2008 6:09 pm

I think what they mean about the pot, is having the pot across or in parallel with the output. Having the pot across the the wiring will likely kill-off some of the high frequencies, or treble response. It's sure worth a try, and it's not complicated.

David Fields · Post by **David Fields** » 16 May 2008 8:22 pm

I am looking for one similar Doug. I want the six string with the legs.
The one that I heard was played through a Fender Steel King and it sounded good. Not a lot of low end, but good mid. Didn't sound teeny at all.

Dave

Blake Hawkins · Post by **Blake Hawkins** » 16 May 2008 8:47 pm

Fenders I've seen from that era have the volume control wired in series with the hot lead of the pickup. The control is connected as a rheostat and the third terminal on the pot is not used.
It does control the volume, but does not seem to work as well as the more conventional way of putting the resistance element of the pot directly across
the pickup. Using all three terminals gives you a
voltage divider.

Fenders that I've changed seem to give better tone and improved action on both the volume and tone controls.

Of course, "better tone" is not a scientific term.
You may hear it differently.

Blake

Dan Sawyer · Post by **Dan Sawyer** » 17 May 2008 12:43 am

Hey Doug, i have two of these things! One has legs and the other doesn't. There is no reason it shouldn't sound as good (or bad) as a regular champ, since they are identical except for the decal. Besides checking the wiring, make sure the metal bridge is making full contact with the bridge plate. Sometimes the screws that hold the bridge get bent and the bridge ends up "floating" above without really making solid contact. While you're at it, check the bridge placement with a tuner.

I always wanted to try a modern pickup in mine. A strat pickup would probably fit.

Joshua Grange · Post by **Joshua Grange** » 18 May 2008 11:09 pm

Doug,
I'm currently using one on the road with kd lang for any lap steel tunes.
It's a lot more trebly than my Sho Bud, and as long as the tone knob is down a ways it sounds great.
A quick question: on your input jack, is it connected to ground? I didnt see any black wires attached to it.... Anyone else notice that?

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 18 May 2008 11:26 pm

Thanks Joshua, I put the guitar back together so I can't get to the wiring now.

My weekend gig confirmed my first impressions... the tone is way too bright for my ears and I've decided that I can't use this guitar. I'm playing some 10-string lap steel on gigs now anyway. So I posted the White for sale on eBay Sunday night. Thanks to everyone for the excellent responses. Brad, please close this post.

Mark Durante · Post by **Mark Durante** » 19 May 2008 3:17 am

The metal plate the pots and jack are mounted on create the ground connection so ground wires are not needed.

Blake Hawkins · Post by **Blake Hawkins** » 19 May 2008 7:40 am

Joshua,
Mark is correct. The ground is made up as he described.

However, if the jack gets loose you will get static or hum.
Fender also grounds the volume controls that way.

Both my Fender P Bass and my Nashville tele had controls or the jack get loose within the first 6 months that I had them. (Both purchased new.)

To prevent it from happening again, I ran a ground wire from the jack to each of the pots, tying all the grounds together.
This way, if anything gets loose, I still have my
grounds and no noise.

Blake

The Steel Guitar Forum

1950s Fender WHITE Steel Guitar

1950s Fender WHITE Steel Guitar

I want one!