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Topic: OK. Here's what a year has gotten me. |
Scott Mercer
From:
Evansville, Indiana, USA
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Posted 2 Jun 2022 8:00 am |
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I have played around a little in recent weeks on C6. Any suggestions are welcomed. Since I don't really have a good idea of how to improvise, I thought I'd just look/listen for the stuff I heard Dad play for 55 years, and try a chord/melody approach like I would on guitar.
https://youtu.be/A0aYJlQxko0
https://youtu.be/u0DbsBgIRAs
Thanks for taking a look!
-Scott |
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Joe Krumel
From:
Hermitage, Tn.
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Posted 2 Jun 2022 8:27 am 1 year
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| Hey Scott,I think you are on the right trail! For just 1 year in you should be proud. Like the sound of that little Fender amp. |
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Steve Cattermole
From:
California, USA
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Posted 3 Jun 2022 10:30 am
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| For C6, the Emmons Basic C6 course with Tab and CD would help you get started.You can order it from Steel Guitars of North County. When you're ready you can learn all the chords from Herb Steiners website. He shows what chords the pedals and knee levers gives you. Good Luck |
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Dale Rottacker
From:
Walla Walla Washington, USA
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Posted 3 Jun 2022 3:18 pm
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Scott, I commend you... Like you've I've started fooling with C6th after about 50 years of just resting my arms there. Early on I just never connected with it. I started MAKING myself just sit there and tackle it without a clue this last Oct. while also trying to make a move to the other side of the State. I'm not a fan of Tab, and really poor with the Theory, but would just sit there hunting and pecking until I'd find a Grip that sounded right and then pressing on pedals or levers till something would sound right, and things are starting to sound familiar and I'm finding the positions easier and more naturally. Keep at it, you'll get it.
_________________
Dale Rottacker, Steelinatune™
*2021 MSA Legend, "Jolly Rancher" D10 10x9
*2021 Rittenberry, "The Concord" D10 9x9
*1977 Blue Sho-Bud Pro 3 Custom 8x6
https://msapedalsteels.com
http://rittenberrysteelguitars.com
https://www.telonics.com/index.php
https://www.p2pamps.com
https://www.quilterlabs.com |
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Paul King
From:
Gainesville, Texas, USA
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Posted 3 Jun 2022 4:30 pm
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| Scott, You are doing well and stay with it. Steel is difficult for anyone to learn. One year from now you will look back at this video and see even more improvement in your playing. |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 4 Jun 2022 5:57 am
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Excellent, Scott! You're making fine progress.
Is Junior your dad??? He took over my old gig up in ND and he's been helpful to me in the maintenance department!
Apologies if I've got the wrong 'Mercer', but it seems too much of a coincidence. 
_________________
Roger Rettig - Emmons D10s, Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and old Martins.
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J D Sauser
From:
Wellington, Florida
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Posted 4 Jun 2022 8:31 am Re: OK. Here's what a year has gotten me.
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| Scott Mercer wrote: |
I have played around a little in recent weeks on C6. Any suggestions are welcomed. Since I don't really have a good idea of how to improvise, I thought I'd just look/listen for the stuff I heard Dad play for 55 years, and try a chord/melody approach like I would on guitar.
https://youtu.be/A0aYJlQxko0
https://youtu.be/u0DbsBgIRAs
Thanks for taking a look!
-Scott |
IF you KNOW and UNDERSTAND what you are doing, what the pedal-lever to frets relationships are, then good for you, you are well on your way.
IF not or unsure, then I always urge anyone to get their hands on ALL of Jeff Newman's C6th video courses which have later been commercialized as DVD conversions:
- C6th Workshops 1&2
- C6th & Swinging-Section 1 (Part 1 & 2)
- C6th & Swinging-Section 2 (Part 1 & 2)
It MAY seem dated "music" to some nowadays, since it's mostly Western-&-Country-"Swing" based, but he teaches all the RELATIONSHIPS that are important for any musical direction later on on that neck.
It only lacks delving into ii-m, V7, IMaj modulations, but else it's a SOLID FOUNDATION to playing "freely" and taking it to where ever you want.
After that, you will most likely "hear" where most of the "classic" C6th Swing is being played. It's a very "hearable" tuning.
The next evident step then would be Paul Franklin's complete C6th online course to take it into Jazz and Bebop.
After that you're "home free" and only limited by muscle and brain memory/technique.
Also, listen to Jazz Guitarists, Pianists, Sax players, even Trombone Players, instead of "just" steel guitarists!
There is a previously unimaginable amount of tutorials and examples now available on youtube for free, and if you can "follow" a piano in the Key of C even only basically, there is a world of applied theory and concepts that is otherwise very difficult to "show" on a pedal steel being floated around quite effectively.
Keep in mind, C6th is STEEL Guitar first... it starts without pedals and a BAR one MOVES.
Many greats played their single-note solos without or with very little pedal and lever work, BE being a prime proponent of this approach (other players like Hal Rugg made extensive use of his changes during single note improv.).
Following the single-note-non-pedal-approach at least at first will help you get tonal "map" of the fretboard much faster.
In that C6th is very different than E9th which is PEDAL Steel Guitar... besides Jerry Byrd, almost no one has successfully played it without pedals. So, move that bar around and that neck will open up to you like you can't imagine.
As a generic comment, not directed to you Scott in particular, lay OFF that pedal-7.
Many E9th players going to C6th tend to dance around on it, but It's NOT an "A-pedal-replacement-lick-generator" and becomes very quickly annoying to the audience. The 7th pedal has several fundamental uses which open up and "repeat the neck" and help fill "gaps in the non-pedal tuning".
Make CHARTS (not TAB) of your riffs and lines! So yo don't go by fret-numbers but by fret DISTANCES. These relationships move around with every key-center!
Just "paint" your licks and riffs on charts. Make it a practice to hum along when you "paint" them... you will be amazed to how much faster you become "natural" at playing without "thinking".
At one point, I started making charts I glue on "drums"... with 3 drums on an axle, so I could "paint" all my minor chords up the frets and all my Dominant and all my Major7th or 6th chords... and just line up the the diagrams to make ii-m, V, I's or II-Dom, V, I's or ii-m, V, i-m in in all playing positions on "endless" revolving charts.
Even Jeff Newman uses CHARTS to line out his Blues Scale fragments (OBAIL-Blues, as he preferred to call it).
On C6th "everything" repeats an average of every 3 frets, because it's a tuning set up in MOSTLY 3rds. Every 3 frets, you have 4 different diminished chords within a one-fret movement. Altering any diminished ever so slightly give us Dom, minor, half-dim, Major chords... 4 of each at every fret plus some.
In other words, you can play (with the right pedals and levers) a ii-m, V7, IM with the SAME target key center (IM) an average of every 3 frets with no more than a 2 fret movement.
At some point, just like piano players practice it, you ought to be cycling ii-m, V, I's thru the circle of 4ths thru all 12 key centers or down a 2nd pretty much statically within 3 frets starting anywhere on the neck.
Jim Cohen's videos on the subject on youtube are a great resource to start exploring new minor, dominant and Major positions up and down the neck for the same chord.
... J-D.
_________________
__________________________________________________________
Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"
A Little Mental Health Warning:
Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.
I say it humorously, but I mean it. |
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Scott Mercer
From:
Evansville, Indiana, USA
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Posted 5 Jun 2022 2:58 am
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| Roger Rettig wrote: |
Excellent, Scott! You're making fine progress.
Is Junior your dad??? He took over my old gig up in ND and he's been helpful to me in the maintenance department!
Apologies if I've got the wrong 'Mercer', but it seems too much of a coincidence. |
You probably wouldn't have known my dad - Leon Mercer. He played mostly in central Indiana, and Illinois. I think he attended (and played a little) at a couple of different steel shows, over the last 10 years. He passed away just about a year ago. I can't believe I spent all my life trying to avoid playing this thing. Now that I've gotten into it, I have so many things I'd love to ask him. I'm torn because I have so much of the classic country and western swing I heard him play flying around in my head, I really want to do that stuff. I'd be happy playing an occasional Country gig if I though I could handle it. As a guitarist, I have spent my adult life studying jazz, and love that music, too. I want to do both. |
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Roger Rettig
From:
Naples, FL
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Posted 5 Jun 2022 3:04 am
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Ah, okay - my mistake.
You're on the right track and your jazz leanings will give you a broader perspective as you work at pedal steel.
Good luck.
_________________
Roger Rettig - Emmons D10s, Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and old Martins.
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Scott Mercer
From:
Evansville, Indiana, USA
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Posted 6 Jun 2022 3:04 pm
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Thanks, all, for the comments and suggestions. I don't suppose I'll ever stop pursuing this. I do love it. I'll look for some of those instructional materials. I have some, but the Newman stuff I have never seen. I'll definitely do some searching.
I appreciate all your help. |
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J D Sauser
From:
Wellington, Florida
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Posted 6 Jun 2022 3:20 pm
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| Scott Mercer wrote: |
Thanks, all, for the comments and suggestions. I don't suppose I'll ever stop pursuing this. I do love it. I'll look for some of those instructional materials. I have some, but the Newman stuff I have never seen. I'll definitely do some searching.
I appreciate all your help. |
We lost Jeff over 18 years ago.
His wife continued selling his courses, and as far we got to understand, the business wound up in one of his nieces' hands.
I successfully bought some DVD conversions about 2 years ago from her, while others already posted complaints here about orders not or incompletely filled and concerns about slow response times.
About a year ago, replies seemed to have faded completely and today I see the website is now an abandoned domain.
I've got ALL C6th courses converted to mp4, but I am unsure about copyright laws to make them available.
... J-D.
_________________
__________________________________________________________
Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"
A Little Mental Health Warning:
Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.
I say it humorously, but I mean it. |
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