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Topic: Speaker cabinet cable |
Larry Hopkins
From:
Lubbock Texas USA
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Posted 6 May 2022 2:45 am |
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Maybe someone could shed some light on this,I was watching a clip on you tube,and it said using a regular guitar cable from amp head to speaker cabinet can damage equipment,that a regular speaker cable should be used,I did not know there was a difference.I guess the speaker cables are not shielded,just 2 wire cable.I would like to know more about this.comments are appreciated
Larry
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,peavey renown 115,Vegas 400, Peavey envoy, peavy bandit 65 head,baby bloomer
2 -Nashville 400, Emmons SD-10 legrande lll ,Emmons Black Rock ,sho-bud pac a seat,,Jackson Madison 63; |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 6 May 2022 4:25 am
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To be brief, low-level (instrument and microphone) cables need shielding to limit noise from electrical fields, but the center conductor can be very small. Whereas, speakers are not affected by noise from electrical fields, but they require far more power to drive them. While a short (3 feet or less) instrument cable might be used for a speaker in an emergency, using a longer cable could risk melting the center conductor of the cable, which could cause catastrophic damage to an amplifier.
More info here:
https://carvinaudio.com/blogs/guitar-bass-education/speaker-vs-instrument-cables-a-simple-guide |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 6 May 2022 4:28 am
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The problem is the small size of the conductors in a regular guitar cable. Potentially the power (wattage) output can overheat the small wire and cause shorts or opens and even damage the power amp electronics.
"Speaker" cables are usually 16-gauge wire and larger depending on power wattage and length of speaker cable.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit |
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Larry Hopkins
From:
Lubbock Texas USA
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Posted 6 May 2022 4:58 am Speaker cables
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Hey thanks guys 
Larry
_________________
,peavey renown 115,Vegas 400, Peavey envoy, peavy bandit 65 head,baby bloomer
2 -Nashville 400, Emmons SD-10 legrande lll ,Emmons Black Rock ,sho-bud pac a seat,,Jackson Madison 63; |
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Dave Grafe
From:
Hudson River Valley NY
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Posted 7 May 2022 4:11 am
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| The small size of the conductor is only half the issue of using shielded guitar cables as speaker leads, the other hazard is the capacitance created by the shield, causing flyback voltages that can mess up the amp's output components. |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 7 May 2022 9:54 am
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Saw this on Facebook. Fits this thread.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit |
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Larry Hopkins
From:
Lubbock Texas USA
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Posted 7 May 2022 10:24 am Speaker cables
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You know itβs kind of embarrassing,that I did not realize,the difference in these cables  ,lucky I havenβt messed something up,I have speaker cables on the way 14 G,thanks again for the help
Larry
_________________
,peavey renown 115,Vegas 400, Peavey envoy, peavy bandit 65 head,baby bloomer
2 -Nashville 400, Emmons SD-10 legrande lll ,Emmons Black Rock ,sho-bud pac a seat,,Jackson Madison 63; |
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Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
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Posted 7 May 2022 11:20 am
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You're not the only one Larry. When I first stared using stereo rigs with satellite speakers, I figured the George L's standard guitar cables would be the thing.
I used them for quite a while before I found out they were not suitable for equal stranded, twisted pairs cables designed to carry speaker current.
Quite honestly, I don't know if there was much difference sonic wise between the proper ones and the GL's that I had been using.
We're talking only short lengths of about 10' here. If they had been longer runs, the outcome would probably have been problematic, perhaps even disastrous. |
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Nic Sanford
From:
Oklahoma
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Posted 7 May 2022 7:07 pm
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| Uh-oh. Which cable is right from a preamp to a powered speaker? |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 7 May 2022 7:36 pm
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| Nic Sanford wrote: |
| Uh-oh. Which cable is right from a preamp to a powered speaker? |
Shielded instrument cable is correct from a preamp to a powered speaker. This is a low-level voltage signal that is going INTO the power amp of the powered speaker and doesn't carry much current and thus needs the shielding. But coming OUT of a power amp into the speaker itself, you need speaker cable.
I totally agree with Dave G. that both the low current capacity and higher electrical capacitance are major issues with using instrument cable to handle power signals into a speaker.
There are a bunch of threads on picking speaker cable. The higher the power and longer the run, the heavier gauge cable required. Lower gauge number corresponds to heavier gauge. E.g., 10 gauge is heavier than 16 gauge. |
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Nic Sanford
From:
Oklahoma
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Posted 8 May 2022 5:11 am
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| Thanks Dave |
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Brooks Montgomery
From:
Idaho, USA
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Posted 8 May 2022 9:29 am
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So, a speaker 6 to 10 feet from the amp: what gauge speaker cable do you recommend?
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A banjo, like a pet monkey, seems like a good idea at first. |
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Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
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Posted 8 May 2022 9:59 am
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| I use 12 or 14 but 16 is quite adequate for that distance. |
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Brooks Montgomery
From:
Idaho, USA
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Posted 8 May 2022 11:39 am
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Thnx Jerry!
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A banjo, like a pet monkey, seems like a good idea at first. |
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Jerry Overstreet
From:
Louisville Ky
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Posted 8 May 2022 12:51 pm
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https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/choosing-right-wire-gauge/
There are a few discussions concerning this here and there.
Here's one and take from it what you will.
I don't know if your ear can tell, but it seems 16 is the most common ga. for relatively short lengths used by the players I know in our common head/cabinet and stereo rigs.
14 is a good compromise, I believe. When you go to 12 ga. and possibly some 14s if building your own, keep in mind that the cable jacket dia. determines the size of the phone plug used.
Most of those sizes require what is referred to as Jumbo Barrel Phone Plugs or FatBoys which are obviously larger and more expensive as is the cable. Pre made cables get to be progressively expensive the larger dia. they go.
Going larger will not hurt anything but it may not be beneficial either. I reckon it depends on the application. |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 8 May 2022 1:42 pm
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I've used lamp cord for speaker cables. Very inexpensive and works well if you have good soldering skills.
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-πππ- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
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Bill A. Moore
From:
Silver City, New Mexico, USA
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Posted 8 May 2022 3:16 pm
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| I used it for years bob, mostly for stereos, it is even marked for polarity! |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 8 May 2022 6:10 pm
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I posted this chart some years back; seems like a good time to post it again.
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 8 May 2022 8:16 pm
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This may be an ignorant question, Donny.
I expected that the wattage of the amp would be a factor in calculating the wire gauge. Is it really all dependent on the speaker impedance? Assuming an 8 ohm speaker, would a 20 watt amp require the same gauge as a 400 watt amp?
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-πππ- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
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Earnest Bovine
From:
Los Angeles CA USA
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Posted 9 May 2022 8:47 am
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| Resistive heating in a shielded cable between amp and speaker is wasted energy. For example, if your shielded cable's DC resistance is 1 ohm (total for both sides, not impossible for a thin wire) in series with a 4 ohm speaker, then 20% of your amp's power is producing heat, not sound. |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 9 May 2022 10:12 am
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| b0b wrote: |
| This may be an ignorant question, Donny. I expected that the wattage of the amp would be a factor in calculating the wire gauge. Is it really all dependent on the speaker impedance? Assuming an 8 ohm speaker, would a 20 watt amp require the same gauge as a 400 watt amp? |
Not an ignorant question at all, b0b. And though it may seem counterintuitive, the quick answer is that the significant factors for determining the proper speaker wire gauge are the wire length and speaker impedance. While the amount of power does matter, the amount that it actually matters is low enough so as to be considered almost insignificant. For example, if you were to increase the power level from 20 watts to 400 watts, you'd have to increase the wire size only to the next largest gauge! (By the way, that chart I posted is old, and very generous in it's safety factor.)
Also to be considered is the amount of power actually used. While many pedal steelers have multi-hundred watt amps, the truth is that they almost never actually use that much power, or anything even close to it. Typical playing, even in loud environments, utilizes only about 30w-50w. All that "extra power" the amp is capable of is used for tone sculpting and to sustain notes and chords for long periods. Keep in mind that the maximum power rating for amps is usually measured with all the knobs turned all the way up, and the signal source (guitar) plugged straight into the amp, with no volume pedal used. But nobody plays that way.  |
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Bobby D. Jones
From:
West Virginia, USA
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Posted 10 May 2022 9:44 pm
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This post got me curious about Speaker Wires, Since I have an Evans AH-200 and a QUILTER Tone Block 202 that must have speakers plugged into them.
I have 2 12' speaker cables, They have writing on 1 conductor and Very heavy unique insulation. The cables have heavy machined 1/4" male plugs soldered on the cable ends.
Patent No. 4,734,544 is printed on the wire. Which traces back to Noel Lee and Monster Cable Company in California for a very special designed Speaker Wire. |
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Dennis Detweiler
From:
Solon, Iowa, US
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Posted 11 May 2022 5:46 am
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Many years ago, the lead player next to me was using a shielded guitar cable for speaker cable. I smelled something burning and got off my seat to check the amps and saw his cable burst into flames.
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1976 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics 427 pickup, 1975 Birdseye U-12 MSA with Telonics X-12 pickup, Boss 59 Fender pedal for preamp, NDR-5 Atlantic Delay & Reverb, two Quilter 201 amps, 2- 12" Eminence EPS-12C speakers, ShoBud Pedal, 1949 Epiphone D-8. Revelation preamp into a Crown XLS 1002 power amp. |
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Jack Hanson
From:
San Luis Valley, USA
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Posted 11 May 2022 7:56 am
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Since the mid-sixties I've used what we always referred to as "zip cord" (same as lamp cord) soldered to Switchcraft 228 right angle plugs to connect the heads and cabs of my Fender piggybacks. Never started a fire or blew anything up in over 50 years of use.
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George Biner
From:
Los Angeles, CA
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Posted 11 May 2022 9:55 pm
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Zip cord will work but it doesn't look very cool and it doesn't "lay" well.
_________________
Guacamole Mafia - acoustic harmony duo
Electrical engineer / amp tech in West Los Angeles -- I fix Peaveys
"Now there is a snappy sounding instrument. That f****r really sings.Β" - Jerry Garcia |
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