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Author Topic:  Eminence Neo Speakers (Who Owns One)
Tom Bradshaw

 

From:
Walnut Creek, California, USA
Post  Posted 5 May 2021 11:09 am    
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When I built the short run (22) of Webb amplifiers years ago, I wanted to put neo speakers in them. Because JBL had stopped building amplifier speakers, I had Eminence send me the only neo speaker they were producing. It was then called the 3115. It now has a different part number, but still available. Back then I did an A/B comparison of it and a JBL E-130. I would NOT have been able to tell the difference (in tone, volume, etc.) if I had listened to the speakers apart from that A/B test.

Buyer response to that Eminence speaker and the Webb amps that I put them in was so positive that I ended up buying an extra 100 of the 3115s. I sold them all as replacement speakers, but naturally separate from the amps I had built. Because they sold like hotcakes (and no one returned one), I'm biased toward Eminence neo speakers.

I'm considering stocking and selling neo speakers again. But now, Eminence has three speakers that they recommend for steel guitarists: The EPS-15C (nearly identical to the 3115s I originally purchased from them), the TT-15 (Travis Troy signature speaker, and the PF-400 (the Paul Franklin signature speaker, although not a neo speaker).

I'd like to hear from owners of these speakers. I would prefer to only offer one model (sizes 12 and 15 inch). Please share your recommendation of one or the other of the three models mentioned here, or drop me an email at tommybradshaw@gmail.com.


Last edited by Tom Bradshaw on 28 Jun 2021 5:00 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Joe Alterio


From:
Irvington, Indiana
Post  Posted 5 May 2021 11:49 am    
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Hi, Tom - I have a Telonics TS-NEO15 (which I believe is identical, or almost identical to the EPS-15C) for my Steel King and found it to be a near-identical tone to that of the stock Eminence (JBL D130 clone) it replaced. A phenomenal speaker at a much reduced weight.

Also, note that the PF-400 is an 8 ohm speaker, not a 4 ohm - I believe all the various Peaveys (N400, S400, LTD, etc.) as well as the Steel King require 4 ohms.
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Ken Pippus


From:
Lake Oswego, OR
Post  Posted 5 May 2021 12:19 pm    
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The PF speakers are not neodymium, and weigh a ton.
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Jack Stanton

 

From:
Somewhere in the swamps of Jersey
Post  Posted 5 May 2021 12:19 pm    
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Tom,
I have both the TT-12 & 15. I prefer the 15 because to my ear it's more open with better highs and lows, but the 12 records really well.
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Mike Holder


From:
Nashville, Tennessee, USA
Post  Posted 5 May 2021 12:45 pm     Webb/ Eminence
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I purchased a used Webb 6-14E that had a Peavey BW 15" speaker in it which sounded alright but I installed an Eminence PF-400 in it and love it! However this speaker has some weight to it so if that's an issue this isn't for you.
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Jack Hanson


From:
San Luis Valley, USA
Post  Posted 5 May 2021 1:21 pm    
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I have a cab with a TT-12 that I usually hook up to an old Session 400 head. It's okay for 10-string E9.
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Mark Perrodin

 

From:
Arizona, USA
Post  Posted 5 May 2021 2:59 pm     eminence
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i have had an eps, telonics and a travis toy 15”. the tt-15 replaced the telonics 15” in a milkman half and half combo. i really, really like the travis toy over the eps and the telonics. i play guitars made in the ‘60’s and my main (favorite) amp is a 1962 brownface fender pro with an electro-voice coffee can sro. just the best sounding amp i’ve ever owned. and that travis toy milkman sounds just great as well. the milkman is very fender like to my ear but it got much better when i put in the tt-15. the tt is warm and inviting. really glad i made the swap.
mark
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Jack Stoner


From:
New Port Richey Florida
Post  Posted 6 May 2021 2:22 am    
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I've had several.
I was one of the field testers for Eminence on the EPS-15C. My initial thought on the EPS-15C was "this sounds like the JBL K-130 I had in a Twin Reverb".

I've since had a Telonics 12" (Eminence custom) and now have a Quilter Travis Toy 12 combo amp which includes a custom Eminence Travis Toy model 12" speaker.

The Quilter "Steelaire" combo amps use a custom Eminence Neo 15" speaker (tried this and found it better suited for lead guitar than steel). Pat Quilter told me it was designed to have more high frequency response, compared to the EPS-15C.
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Marty Holmes

 

From:
Magnolia ,TX USA
Post  Posted 6 May 2021 9:15 am     Mike Holder
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Mike when you put the PF 400 in the Webb amplifier did it change the power of it was there less power or did the power stay the same I'm just curious?
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Mike Holder


From:
Nashville, Tennessee, USA
Post  Posted 6 May 2021 1:06 pm     Webb/Eminence
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Marty; to the best of my knowledge the power remained the same but the speaker was more pleasing to my ears.
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b0b


From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
Post  Posted 6 May 2021 1:29 pm    
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I think that the Telonics-labeled 15" speaker in my Milkman Half-and-Half is actually made by Eminence. It's a fine sounding pedal steel speaker - the best I've ever had, actually. Very loud, clean, and balanced, it handles large outdoor venues well.
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Keith Hilton

 

From:
248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721
Post  Posted 6 May 2021 7:55 pm    
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Tom, I have a EPS-15C in one of my amps. Very pleased with the sound.
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Ken Byng


From:
Southampton, England
Post  Posted 7 May 2021 12:38 pm    
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Tom
I have a TT-15 in my Telonics TCA500 amp, and an EPS-15C in my Webb. Both wonderful speakers, the TT speaker seems to have slightly more pronounced mids than the EPS, and fractionally (but noticeably) less highs.

The EPS sounds great in my Webb - very JBL-like.
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Mike Schwartzman

 

From:
Maryland, USA
Post  Posted 7 May 2021 6:53 pm    
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Yes Tom...I have the EPS 15C in a Session 400 for 2-3 years now, and I really like it.

Also the Eminence TT 12" is in my Evans JE 150 and it is much better than the stock speaker. I had Weber's Neomag 12 (the one Ted designed as a neomagnet version of a JBL) in the same amp before the TT 12, and although that speaker was an improvement, the TT 12 took the cake in that amp.

I also have a TT 12 in a 22 watt SF Deluxe Reverb. It must be very efficient because I was surprised that a speaker with that high of a wattage rating would sound so good in a 22 watt tube amp. Of course I was after a very clean tone when I installed it, and it does that clean tone well.
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Foster Haney


From:
Oregon, USA
Post  Posted 10 May 2021 5:28 pm    
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I bought a EPS- 15 and put it in my Vegas 400. It was a great upgrade and provided what I thought the BW was missing. I’ve since put that same speaker in to a Princeton Clone with a larger output transformer and at 4ohms. I’m pretty impressed by it in this set up at well. I keep wondering what my next mod will be to better the tone of my amp... but I can’t think of what I would change.
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Mike Spaeth

 

From:
Springdale
Post  Posted 14 May 2021 5:10 pm     re
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Tom I use one of the EPS- 15 speakers in a Nashville 400
that I use.
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Helmut Gragger


From:
Austria
Post  Posted 15 May 2021 1:31 am    
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My two cents on the subject.

I have a Jansen Steel 100 amp of New Zealand origin. This consists of a 100W Mosfet amp head with a vented 15" cabinet.
It was loaded with a Richard Allan Atlas 15 driver, that has a metal cone. When it arrived shy of 30 years ago, it was packed so lousy by the company that the magnet had shaken loose. Luckily, it was bolted, so I kind of managed to center it again, but it always sounded to my dislike. I particularly felt the aluminium cone introduced something unnatural.

With the advent of Neodymium magnets, I finally decided (years after the advent Winking ) to replace it. And thank god I did. The RA is an ungodly heavy brute.

I looked what you guys recommend, but all the specialized Eminence and look-a-likes are either unavailable in Europe, or discontinued (due to lack of demand I presume), or outrageously priced (for the same reason).

It turns out, that the father of all is the Eminence Kappalite 3015 (mark: not the -LF bass version), which went into the 2gen Webbs. EPS-15, Telonics and Double-T are all custom made derivatives (which they don´t tell you of course). (One look and you know.)

You have to know, that a speaker manufacturer has several parameters to play with, such as top end, low end, overall efficiency, to name a few. Always ONE, but not all. In other words, to the cost of the other parameters. Nothing is free in this world (yet).

Secondly, the driver is only half of the equation. The cabinet does a lot. Never compare different cabinets.

Thirdly, the setup. It is all too common that musicians don´t compare "scientific", meaning two absolutely identical setups, with just ONE parameter changed at the time. Even if you swap the driver in the very same enclosure, a quarter hour will have passed until you make a new listening session. The ear will have changed meanwhile.

Many hesitations have been uttered about the 8 Ohm impedance.
#1 your power into the speaker does not half, but it is lower. HOWEVER, it is dependent on the efficiency of the speaker how loud it projects, not on the power pumped into it. Keep in mind that a factor of two will just barely be perceived as loudness increase due to the logarithmic nature of the ear.
#2 the impedance given is NOMINAL, meaning that it only exists at a frequency of ZERO Hz or DC. Look at any curve, the impedance is all over the place, goes up soon but also dangerously below the nominal impedance for prolonged parts of the spectrum.
#3 While your amp may be capable of running a 4 Ohm speaker, its current capability is dramatically pushed to the limit. Amps don´t like to deliver huge currents, and might JUST get away with it. Don´t forget that the speaker impedance drops way below the nominal value for substantial parts of the frequency range, and this is where your amp goes sweating.
#4 a common misconception is that an amp labeled "4 Ohm " must have a suitable 4 Ohm speaker. The argument of "power matching" is eternally perpetuated. There is no such a thing as "power matching" or "impedance matching " of amps. They are all in the milli-Ohm region (solid state at least). In music industry we have "voltage matching". It is thus absolutely sane to use a 8 Ohm speaker on an amp labelled "4 Ohm".

This all said, I bought a stock Kappalite 3015 for 2/3 of the price of its fancy overpriced brothers (letting alone the unobtainium factor...), plugged it into the cabinet, rejoiced about the unbelievably reduced weight, and delight in the great tone.

100% satisfaction.
Use your tone controls. Thats what they are made for.

I hope this makes your decision easier.

-Helmut
(edited for clarification)
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Last edited by Helmut Gragger on 17 May 2021 4:43 am; edited 3 times in total
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Helmut Gragger


From:
Austria
Post  Posted 16 May 2021 4:09 am    
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One more thing I have to remark for completion.

When you are comparing sonic things, you have to make sure both have equal loudness, because according to the axiom: "louder is better" anything louder will be perceived as better sounding.

Now this gets close to impossible with a speaker, because: which part of the spectrum do you want to loudness match? Match the low end, and your treble will be out, wind up treble, the low end may be out, wind up the mid range, both will be out...

A decades old driver will just not compare to a current driver.

There is no real comparison. The only question remains: "can I equalize the system?" And BTW, thats what equalization is originally made for.

This effect is the cause of monumental self-betrayal.
As a standard rock guitar player I know that you always want a fat tone, with great bottom (pun intended). However, the soundman at the gig will dial your low end out if he can, so as to not interfere with the bass player or the drums.

So a 12" driver may well do what you need. What DOES speak for a driver that is objectively oversized is the fact that it runs very well within its limits. Rock guitar speakers are pushed for mid range and a fair amount of speaker distortion. This is unwanted for the steel.

Talk beaming. Beaming is strongly frequency related.
The one sitting in front of the speaker will perceive tone different than the one off-axis a certain distance away.

So, WHO HEARS THE DIFFERENCE in the audience?

We musicians are easily fooled, which is of course mercilessly exploited by some. Keep that in mind.
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A J Head

 

From:
Compton Ca
Post  Posted 16 May 2021 12:37 pm    
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The only Kappalite I can see listed is a 3015LF model, which is a bass/mid speaker, is the -15 you talk about different, I cant see any info on that model, only the 3015
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Helmut Gragger


From:
Austria
Post  Posted 16 May 2021 11:06 pm    
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No. I have edited the information above. Its the regular 3015.
The LF will have the bottom end pushed and bigger Xmax, which is linear excursion.
As I said, on the cost of some other parameter. Avoid it.

From the Eminence Web Site:

Speaker * freq * sensitivity * xmax
3015 * 40-4k * 100.8dB * 5.9mm
3015LF * 40-1.5k * 98.4db * 9.6mm

The LF (apparently for Low Frequency) has an overall slightly smaller sensitivity, almost double the XMAX and a dramatically reduced high end. Clearly a subwoofer candidate.
Those sensitivity values are incredibly good for a driver, 20 years ago you would talk about 92dBs or so.
Note that efficiency is NOT equal to sensitivity.
All voice coil drivers have an abysmally low efficiency of 1-2%. They are perfect heaters.
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Marty Holmes

 

From:
Magnolia ,TX USA
Post  Posted 17 May 2021 9:35 am     Webb
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Eps+Webb= magic
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A J Head

 

From:
Compton Ca
Post  Posted 17 May 2021 1:06 pm    
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Thanks for clearing that up Helmut
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Andy DePaule


From:
Saigon, Viet Nam & Springfield, Oregon
Post  Posted 12 Jun 2021 9:11 pm     I have the Travis Troy speaker
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Hi Tom,
Good to hear you are still at it.
I have the Travis Troy speaker that I got two years ago and put in my older Webb.
Sounds great in all kinds of situations both for my pedal steels and lap steels.
Better than the JBL it had when I got it.
Took about 7 pounds off the amp too....
Best wishes,
Andy Very Happy
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