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Topic: Overdubs on Sweetheart |
Nicholas Cox
From:
California, USA
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Posted 25 Oct 2020 8:51 am |
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Deleted
Last edited by Nicholas Cox on 26 Oct 2020 6:33 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Marc Jenkins
From:
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
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Posted 25 Oct 2020 12:29 pm
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| They were the versions on the official release. In the late 90s (I believe) the Gram versions were finally released, and I believe all current releases, including streaming platforms, include the Gram versions as outtakes/alternate versions. |
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Joachim Kettner
From:
Germany
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Posted 25 Oct 2020 2:27 pm
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As far as I know Lee Hazelwood was respomsible for this. I'm going back to the John Rogan book, to give further details soon.
_________________
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Nicholas Cox
From:
California, USA
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Posted 25 Oct 2020 2:47 pm
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The only versions I can find online are the Gram versions and the vinyl copy I have also has the gram versions.
And yes Lee Hazelwood was responsible for the legal trouble, claiming to own the rights to all vocal performances by Gram. |
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Pete Finney
From:
Nashville Tn.
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Posted 25 Oct 2020 3:41 pm
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Here's my take on this (FWIW I studied this in some detail years back for a Country Music Hall of Fame exhibit I curated, including talking to JayDee and Lloyd quite a bit).
The original album as released had Gram's lead vocals on his own tune "Hickory Wind" and the covers of Merle Haggard's "Life in Prison" and George Jones' "You're Still on my Mind." That never changed. On the original release McGuinn has the lead vocal on the two Dylan songs, Woody Guthrie's "Pretty Boy Floyd," William Bell's "You Don't Miss Your Water," and the Louvin Brothers' "The Christian Life." (Chris Hillman sang lead on a couple of songs too). The originally released version of Parson's tune "One Hundred Years from Now" sounds to me like a unison vocal with Mcguinn/Parsons, with a Hillman harmony.
The original sessions featured a Parsons lead vocal on "You Don't Miss Your Water," "The Christian Life" and a solo lead on "One Hundred Years from Now." These are the songs Mcguinn later overdubbed his vocals on; wiping the Parsons vocals from the first two for the release, and most likely adding a unison vocal on top of Parsons on the third.
The contractual dispute about Parsons has been repeated a lot over the years, but to me kind of begs the question about why they didn't need to replace ALL of his vocals if that were really the issue. This much less well known comment from producer Gary Usher is probably much close to the truth, IMHO:
“During the actual sessions Gram sang lead on several songs. When we came back to L.A. we took a number of Gram’s leads off: not because of any contractual reasons but because McGuinn was reluctant to have Gram sing an entire Byrds album when he was the newest member of the group… You don’t just take a hit group and inject a new singer for no reason. The album had just the exact amount of Gram on it that McGuinn, Hillman and myself wanted."
So, as far as I can tell, there are only three songs with completely different McGuinn vocals on the released version vs the (often reissued) original Parsons versions. If there are McGuinn versions of "Hickory Wind" or the Haggard and Jones covers I'd be really surprised. |
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Craig Stock
From:
Westfield, NJ USA
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Posted 25 Oct 2020 3:52 pm
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Thanks Pete, That makes a lot of sense, good to hear that side of the story, I like both versions and am a fan of Roger and Gram
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I cried because I had no shoes, then I met a man who had no feet.
Today is tomorrow's Good ol' days |
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Nicholas Cox
From:
California, USA
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Posted 25 Oct 2020 5:10 pm
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| Thanks Pete. Yes I know it was only a few songs. Apparently Roger was about to overdub Hickory Wind too but someone came in and stopped him at the last minute. All the info you gave matches with an interview with Gram where he talks about the subject and his biography “Hickory Windâ€. Gram mentions something about Roger and Chris trying to blend their vocals on one song to try to sound like him. |
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Nicholas Cox
From:
California, USA
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Posted 25 Oct 2020 7:53 pm
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| Never mind the Roger versions are on YouTube. Just had to listen to a few different versions to find them. |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 25 Oct 2020 8:48 pm
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The original Gram Parsons vocals of those 4 songs that McGuinn replaced are bonus tracks 1997 Columbia CD. There's also a Lloyd Green / Clarence White instrumental track, actually a backup without the lead vocal, called "All I Have Are Memories".
I particularly love Gram's vocal on "A Christian Life". McGuinn's sounds phony and tongue-in-cheek by comparison, in my opinion. Lloyd's steel part is incredible on that song.
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scott murray
From:
Asheville, NC
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Posted 26 Oct 2020 12:38 am
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| Nicholas Cox wrote: |
| Gram mentions something about Roger and Chris trying to blend their vocals on one song to try to sound like him. |
that's 100 Years From Now.
there are no additional vocals by McGuinn other than what is on the original release of the album.
and I believe it's JayDee on Christian Life.
Lloyd played on You Ain't Goin Nowhere, Hickory Wind, 100 Years, and Nothing Was Delivered. JayDee did Christian Life, You Don't Miss Your Water, You're Still On My Mind, and Life in Prison.
they found the version of All I Have Are Memories with vocals and put it on the 2-disc Deluxe Edition released in 2003. it was written and sung by Kevin Kelley, their drummer at the time and Chris Hillman's cousin.
Sweetheart was the last thing Clarence White did before getting his B-bender installed.
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John Macy
From:
Rockport TX/Denver CO
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Posted 27 Oct 2020 4:23 pm
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And just in case you missed it, there is an excellent instrumental version of this record by Lloyd and Jay Dee that you can find at www.coastalbendmusic.com.
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John Macy
Rockport, TX
Engineer/Producer/Steel Guitar |
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Pete Finney
From:
Nashville Tn.
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Posted 28 Oct 2020 1:52 am
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| Any steel player who likes Sweetheart of the Rodeo should check out this album by Lloyd and JayDee, if they haven't already. It was a real labor of love for them as you can tell when you hear it, including John Macy who pulled it all together, hired the other players, and made it sound great. |
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Jim Fogle
From:
North Carolina, Winston-Salem, USA
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Posted 28 Oct 2020 5:04 pm
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Unfortunately the Coastal Bend Music link John Macy posted is broken. 
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Georg Sørtun
From:
Mandal, Agder, Norway
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