The Steel Guitar Forum Store 

Post new topic Gauged rollers question
Reply to topic
Author Topic:  Gauged rollers question
Gene White Jr

 

From:
Vermont, USA
Post  Posted 26 Mar 2019 2:14 pm    
Reply with quote

Anyone know if there is such thing as gauged rollers for a Fessenden S10 ?
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Gene White Jr

 

From:
Vermont, USA
Post  Posted 2 May 2019 5:43 am     Gauged rollers question
Reply with quote

No response in over a month, so maybe it's a silly question. How about this: I'm getting a fair amount of string buzz on my Fessenden S10, almost exclusively (or at least most pronounced) on the unwound strings, esp 3. This is what led me to ask about gauged rollers, thinking that the ungauged roller grooves, i.e., 'one size fits all' might be too wide or deep for unwound strings, thus allowing them to buzz. Ideas? Thanks in advance for thoughts on this buzz question. I also wonder if upping 3 to .012 might help--any experience with this?
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Dick Wood


From:
Springtown Texas, USA
Post  Posted 2 May 2019 5:50 am    
Reply with quote

You might try measuring the width,diameter and axle size and call a few of the guitar manufactures and see if they have something that will fit your guitar. I would call Bill at Williams as he makes gauged rollers and I'm sure he'd sell you a set.

Good luck.
_________________
Cops aren't paid much so I steel at night.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Jack Stoner


From:
Kansas City, MO
Post  Posted 2 May 2019 5:54 am    
Reply with quote

The Franklin's do not use gauged rollers. My Franklin is a late 81 (bought new) and never had a problem because they were not gauged.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Ken Metcalf


From:
San Antonio Texas USA
Post  Posted 2 May 2019 6:13 am    
Reply with quote

If they are worn out.. most new gauged rollers need to be custom made.
Best way is to probably mail the old ones in for measurement.
_________________
MSA 12 String E9th/B6th Universal.
Little Walter PF-89.
Bunch of stomp boxes
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Ron Scott

 

From:
Michigan
Post  Posted 2 May 2019 11:17 am    
Reply with quote

Sometimes moving the string over at the key head at more of an angle and not straight on tightens up the roller enough to take care of it.Hope that helps.RS
_________________
Franklin D10 Stereo - 8 and 6 - Black Box-Zum Encore 4 and 5 Nashville 400,Session 400, DD3 for delay ,also Benado Effects pedal.
Steeling with Franklin's..and Zum Encore
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Jack Stoner


From:
Kansas City, MO
Post  Posted 2 May 2019 12:08 pm    
Reply with quote

Some Sho-Bud's had string buzz on certain strings. The "fix" was to wind from under the tuning key instead of from the top. That put more pressure on the roller and eliminated the buzz.

I've seen this written about several times.

Back to the Franklin not having gauged rollers. Mr. Franklin told me the buzz was a problem when he worked for Sho-Bud. He worked on the problem and found instead of gauged rollers, he found one gauge roller nut (don't recall if he told me what gauge it was) that if used on all the strings eliminated the problem and he followed through with the same single gauge rollers on his Franklin guitars.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

William Holloman

 

From:
Florida, USA
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 5:17 am    
Reply with quote

Gene: To add to my old friend Jack's reply, my Sho Bud has occasional string buzz. The fix that usually works is to sand the bridge with 1500/2000 grit paper as over time, a "groove" will form. Hope this helps.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Jim Palenscar

 

From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 6:13 am    
Reply with quote

The reason that you have buzz on the 3rd string is most likely you also have the bar on the 1st and 2nd strings at the same time and both of them are thicker than the 3rd string (especially the 1st) and the nose of the bar gets raised up a bit causing the buzz. Try not covering more strings than you need with the bar on the treble side and hopefully the buzz will go away. I make gauged rollers for folks commonly.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Lee Baucum


From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 9:24 am    
Reply with quote

William Holloman wrote:
Gene: To add to my old friend Jack's reply, my Sho Bud has occasional string buzz. The fix that usually works is to sand the bridge with 1500/2000 grit paper as over time, a "groove" will form. Hope this helps.


William - I believe this discussion is about the rollers, over on the other end of the guitar.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

William Holloman

 

From:
Florida, USA
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 10:24 am    
Reply with quote

No Lee. The discussion is about string buzz !! Rollers can cause it, a rough bridge can cause it, a bad string, etc.
Even bar placement can cause it. READ JIM'S POST !!
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Ken Metcalf


From:
San Antonio Texas USA
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 2:02 pm     Re: Gauged rollers question
Reply with quote

Gene White Jr wrote:
Anyone know if there is such thing as gauged rollers for a Fessenden S10 ?


William - I believe this discussion is about the rollers, over on the other end of the guitar.
_________________
MSA 12 String E9th/B6th Universal.
Little Walter PF-89.
Bunch of stomp boxes
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Donny Hinson

 

From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 2:40 pm    
Reply with quote

We really need to know exactly where you're getting the buzzing. Is it only at the first couple of frets? Or, are you getting it all up and down the neck? Is it worse or does it change if you press down a little harder on the bar?

Sometimes, buzzing can be caused by the strings not being "formed" to the nut. Try pressing down firmly on each string just in front of the nut rollers with your finger. Another thing you can try is a drop of oil on the rollers to see if that reduces the buzzing.

I do not recommend wrapping the strings under the tuner shaft, or making them pull sideways to eliminate buzz. Either of these practices can increase hysteresis and cause tuning instability. Trading one problem for another is not a good idea.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Lee Baucum


From:
McAllen, Texas (Extreme South) The Final Frontier
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 2:52 pm     Re: Gauged rollers question
Reply with quote

Ken Metcalf wrote:
Gene White Jr wrote:
Anyone know if there is such thing as gauged rollers for a Fessenden S10 ?


William - I believe this discussion is about the rollers, over on the other end of the guitar.


William - I believe this discussion is about the rollers, over on the other end of the guitar.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Gene White Jr

 

From:
Vermont, USA
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 4:47 pm     Gauged rollers question
Reply with quote

Thanks for your replies! I'll bet I am indeed covering strings 1 & 2 with the bar when I'm playing 3 (and 4 and 5, probably, too). Another thing to work on! And, yes--the buzz is all up and down the neck, esp closer to the nut where the different string thicknesses are most pronounced, I'm guessing. With that in mind, I wonder if a .012 on string 3 might minimize the string gauge disparity? I'm looking for less sitar and more guitar!
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Jim Palenscar

 

From:
Oceanside, Calif, USA
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 5:12 pm    
Reply with quote

The sitar effect if you are hearing it is generally not related to the rollers but you can rotate the roller and see if it goes away. It is generally that a flat spot has developed on the changer finger and you can check that by moving the string on the finger a titch and see if it goes away.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Donny Hinson

 

From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
Post  Posted 3 May 2019 6:42 pm    
Reply with quote

Gene, are you using enough bar pressure, and are you muting the strings properly behind the bar with the fingers of your left hand? Also, you can eliminate the nut and nut rollers as a problem source by playing a chord at the 2nd fret while covering the entire nut with the edge of your hand. If firm hand pressure over the nut doesn't stop the buzzing, then (as Jim says), it's probably flat spots on the crown of the changer fingers, or it could simply a problem with your bar control technique.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Gene White Jr

 

From:
Vermont, USA
Post  Posted 4 May 2019 9:41 am     Gauged rollers question
Reply with quote

I thank you gentlemen yet again for your time and expertise. I am evaluating each recommendation and will post an update as warranted. In answer to a couple questions: Yes, I believe I am applying enough downward bar pressure, and No, I don't think it's a flat spot on the changer finger being as it's an almost-new Fessy. But I'll check. I shall leave no turn unstoned in my quest to reduce the buzz. Thanks, fellas!
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Jack Stoner


From:
Kansas City, MO
Post  Posted 4 May 2019 1:12 pm    
Reply with quote

You are close to Fessenden. I'd take the guitar to Jerry and let him check it over. That will tell if there is a guitar problem.
_________________
GFI Ultra Keyless S-10 with pad (Black of course) TB202 amp, Hilton VP, Steelers Choice sidekick seat, SIT Strings
Cakewalk by Bandlab and Studio One V4.6 pro DAWs, MOTU Ultralite MK5 recording interface unit
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Donny Hinson

 

From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
Post  Posted 4 May 2019 1:55 pm     Re: Gauged rollers question
Reply with quote

Gene White Jr wrote:
I thank you gentlemen yet again for your time and expertise. I am evaluating each recommendation and will post an update as warranted. In answer to a couple questions: Yes, I believe I am applying enough downward bar pressure, and No, I don't think it's a flat spot on the changer finger being as it's an almost-new Fessy. But I'll check. I shall leave no turn unstoned in my quest to reduce the buzz. Thanks, fellas!


Not to be critical, but I'd say that 99% of the time when you have a problem like this with a new (or nearly new) guitar, the problem is really improper playing technique. Gauged rollers are NOT a requirement on a 10-string guitar.

How long have you been playing?
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Alan Muir


From:
Colorado, USA
Post  Posted 6 May 2019 3:45 pm    
Reply with quote

I discovered that my left hand ring finger sometimes puts pressure downward on the strings behind the bar. This causes a buzz. Technique needed adjustment, not the instrument.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail

Gene White Jr

 

From:
Vermont, USA
Post  Posted 6 May 2019 4:54 pm    
Reply with quote

I have only been playing steel long enough to know that I don't know enough. And that every aspect of my home-grown technique is suspect. Left hand action behind the bar is a good comment, as is not barring strings 1 & 2 while I'm playing 3,4,5. All of the feedback here is helping me get to the buzz question, which started off as a gauged roller question (if only because I didn't know what to look for). But I'm getting with it now, and appreciate all of the suggestions and comments offered. And I'm going to try the .012 on string 3 to see if that helps.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail


All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Jump to:  

Our Online Catalog
Strings, CDs, instruction,
steel guitars & accessories

www.SteelGuitarShopper.com

Please review our Forum Rules and Policies

Steel Guitar Forum LLC
PO Box 237
Mount Horeb, WI 53572 USA


Click Here to Send a Donation

Email admin@steelguitarforum.com for technical support.


BIAB Styles
Ray Price Shuffles for
Band-in-a-Box

by Jim Baron
HTTP