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Topic: How to buy a Sho Bud? |
Charley Paul
From:
California, USA
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Posted 20 Feb 2019 2:29 pm |
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I have been playing psg for about six months and love it!
As I learn more, it seems psg players have a special love of Sho Bud guitars. I see a lot for sale and am intrigued. I am currently looking for another psg....
What do I look for in a Sho Bud? Are there good years, years to avoid? I would want a relatively maintenance free one, so what do I look for specifically in terms of restoration or work done?
Are these stable guitars that hold tube well?
Thanks in advance! |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 20 Feb 2019 3:01 pm Re: How to buy a Sho Bud?
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| Charley Paul wrote: |
I have been playing psg for about six months and love it!
As I learn more, it seems psg players have a special love of Sho Bud guitars. I see a lot for sale and am intrigued. I am currently looking for another psg....
What do I look for in a Sho Bud? Are there good years, years to avoid? I would want a relatively maintenance free one, so what do I look for specifically in terms of restoration or work done?
Are these stable guitars that hold tube well?
Thanks in advance! |
If you are looking for maintenance free, you probably should not be looking at a Sho bud...
As far as stable and holding tune is concerned,, good luck.. if you get a really GOOD original one, it might get you close, but chances aren't good... In your case, I would look for one that was rebuilt relatively recently with modern parts, or one thats in extremely good condition with minimal playtime.. they are lovely sounding, great looking, easy playing guitars, but they are NOT as reliable or as tuning stable as a modern steel.. They are good for guys that like to tinker around with steels , upgrade parts, and just don't mind maintaining a steel guitar.... Many guys have them and swear by them, and won't play anything else, but just look at how many top pros still use one on stage... Very few... I love them, but after having 12 of them in the 42 years I have been playing, i am done trying to find one that stays in tune... My most stable Bud, was a ProIII that I played for several years.. I had to keep the tuning wrench on it, and tweak a few times a night... My Carter/ MSA/ Marlen/Dekley/ Fessy/ Desert Rose/Fender/ ETS/MCI/GFI could all be played for weeks or months without ever being touched.. Sho Buds???.. Never had one that stayed in tune for very long at all, and I kept trying and trying year after year after year... Look, you might get lucky, lots of guys have... bob
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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Paddy Long
From:
Christchurch, New Zealand
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Posted 20 Feb 2019 3:15 pm
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If your specifically looking for the Sho Bud sound, you would be better off getting a Show Pro !!
About ten times better mechanics, much better finish, better sound and a slight tip of the hat to the ShoBud aesthetics.
And on top of that Jeff Surratt is a gem of a man, and has wonderful customer service.
I had 3 Sho Buds in my early steel playing days, they sounded great but everything else about them was rubbish ! Too heavy, poor mechanics, crap finish etc - and most are 40 + years old .... but you only had limited choices in those days !!
_________________
14'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
08'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
94' Franklin Stereo D10 9+8
Telonics, Peterson, Steelers Choice, Benado, Lexicon, Red Dirt Cases. |
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Ricky Davis
From:
Bertram, Texas USA
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Posted 20 Feb 2019 3:38 pm
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Well I will have to say that Bob Carlucci made completely ever valuable point and I totally agree with him. And this agreement coming from a guy that plays and owns ONLY A Sho~bud and I play and record with for over 20 years; but also that is my side biz; is I have restored them for hundreds of guys all over the world; so I know them well. And the hard part in looking around for one that you are describing you want...is incredibly difficult as Sho~bud had so many countless mechanical changes through the years; that I can describe 4 differences on a sho~bud just within each year....and that is NOT USER FRIENDLY.
Most of us that know how to make a Sho~bud play very consistent and user friendly have passed away. Me and a small handful of guys are left, that do; and only one machinist left that machines original parts for sho~bud and most all pedal steel models old and new...that is Michael Yahl>>> www.psgparts.com
So take heed and choose a user friendly pedal steel for a long while until you have become friendly with it> meaning you can fix anything you want; adjust anything you want...then you can venture into something that needs care.
Ricky
_________________
Ricky Davis
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com |
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Johnie King
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 20 Feb 2019 5:33 pm
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Tone of the Sho Buds I believe is worth a little twist of the nylon tuners or the keys
Last edited by Johnie King on 22 Feb 2019 7:33 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 20 Feb 2019 6:00 pm
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Sho~Buds sound great but I hate working on them. Mechanically, every one I've seen was really crude compared to today's brands. You have to really love that sound to put up with the idiosyncrasies, in my opinion.
Ricky is one of the very few professionals who still performs on a Sho~Bud. You can go to a steel show and never see one on stage. There's a reason for that.
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
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Jack Turlington
From:
Toccoa, GA, USA
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Posted 20 Feb 2019 6:18 pm Sho Bud
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| Wow! Sho Bud is being thrown under the bus! Personally I have had Sho Buds since the 70’s and had virtually no issues at all with any of them. In fact, my LeGrande III has had more problems than my 1973 Sho Bud Professional. I say, if you like Buds, get a Bud. |
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Paddy Long
From:
Christchurch, New Zealand
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Posted 20 Feb 2019 6:23 pm
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I think if I was going to get a ShoBud and restore it, I would get Jeff Surratt to completely replace the mechanics with his Show Pro stuff ... then you would have the best of both worlds !!
_________________
14'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
08'Zumsteel Hybrid D10 9+9
94' Franklin Stereo D10 9+8
Telonics, Peterson, Steelers Choice, Benado, Lexicon, Red Dirt Cases. |
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Johnie King
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 20 Feb 2019 6:30 pm
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Sho Bud what made country music Famous.
Last edited by Johnie King on 22 Feb 2019 7:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Sandy Inglis
From:
Christchurch New Zealand
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 2:29 am
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Hi Charley
I have one of Paddy Longs old ShoBud's. It's a lovely machine but as he said, heavy etc. It doesn't stay in tune that well.
I also have one of Paddy's Zumsteel's and love it! it is light, portable, stays in tune and easy to play.
I have the ShoBud set up at home for practice and use the Zum for gigs. If I can play a song on the Shobud,(which is heavy and 'clunky') I know it will be easier on the Zum. It is similar to learning to snow ski on old heavy narrow skis then trying modern carvers! I am more relaxed when playing the Zum.
Sandy
_________________
01'Zumsteel D10 9+9; Sho Bud D10 SuperPro; 6 String Lap Steel (Homemade); Peavey Nashville 1000; Fender Deluxe 85;
1968 Gibson SG; Taylor 710 CE; Encore Tele Copy; Peterson Tuner; HIWATT T40 C 40W/20W Combo |
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Dan Beller-McKenna
From:
Durham, New Hampshire, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 3:47 am
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My 1981 Sho Bud Super Pro is as stable, light, and smooth as any other "modern" steel I've had come through my hands (and a heck of a lot lighter and smaller than some of the vintage brands that have been listed in this thread as better choices than Sho Buds). It does not have the classic "Sho Bud tone" like the round fronts I've owned, but it does have a great vintage tone of its own.
I'm in awe of people who own steels and don't have to touch the tuning machines or nylons for months at a time. Either I've been unlucky or I am too sensitive to tuning; every steel I've owned needs a little nudge here or there at least once in a while, if only to account for changes in temperature or playing with different six-string guitarists who tune their 3rd string slightly off to compensate for the first fret issues on a six-string. Yes, older round-front rack-and-barrel Sho Buds need attention more often than the Super Pro, but I played plenty of gigs on them and recorded an entire CD on my last one, all without having to stop and tune.
If you want a Sho bud and are concerned about it being too heavy, clunky and hard to keep in tune, consider a post 1976 model which should have the Super Pro mechanism. Mind you, there are issues with these guitars too:
1) pot metal knee lever brackets can break. That's never happened on my Super Pro, but I upgraded to Michael Yahl's excellent replacement parts. (And I did have a knee lever drop to the floor while I was playing at home on a modern steel.)
2) The pot metal fingers will eventually develop a notch and need to be addressed. Hasn't happened to my 1981 Super Pro yet, but when it finally does, there are several known fixes, and some people are making replacement parts out of better metal (not Michael Yahl, yet).
I am not a pro player, but I gig several times a month and need a guitar I can count on for three or four hours at a pop. My Super Pro is my go-to guitar. |
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Bob Carlucci
From:
Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 5:32 am
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I'll say this again, and I've written it on these pages before.. I am NOT a Bud hater, in fact I adore them... I WISH I had found the "right" one.. For years I played other brands I didn't like near as much, because I was on stage, with GOOD musicians that took me and my playing seriously,, and staying in tune and not breaking strings mid song constantly was paramount to me..
. A lot of guys have them, and still play them, and have "good ones" .. My point is that they are not typically as stable as a modern steel, with some exceptions..
On most Buds, you are tweaking those nylons a lot.. In may case, several times a night, depending on environmental conditions,lights, cold, humidity etc.. Everything on a bud is screwed into wood.. Everything on most modern guitars is set in a rigid frame or subframe, and just doesn't shift as much.. Buds are lovely guitars, but they are not as stable as most modern brands.. They are a lot better when gone over by someone that REALLY knows them, how to set them up, and where to get the best parts.. If I bought a Bud today, I would talk it over personally with ricky d first, before buying,... He knows a lot more about them than most...bob
_________________
I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 6:15 am Re: How to buy a Sho Bud?
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| Charley Paul wrote: |
I have been playing psg for about six months and love it!
As I learn more, it seems psg players have a special love of Sho Bud guitars. I see a lot for sale and am intrigued. I am currently looking for another psg....
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I agree with the statements made above. 'Buds are pretty and can have a lovely sound, but they're quirky and crude, mechanically (except for the ones that have been totally and professionally restored). While you may think it's nice to have an old guitar with some "cool factor", you're probably better off playing something reliable and just working on your playing skills for now. Your emphasis should be on getting good enough to play with a band, and a band is likely to be more interested in "how" you play, rather than "what" you play. |
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gary pierce
From:
Rossville TN
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 6:24 am
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I must have had a good one, 1980 Super Pro I played for 30 years, and broke one knee lever bracket.
Pedal steels have evolved over the years, and yes some are more stable, with better mechanics, but I still like the old Buds. |
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Dan Beller-McKenna
From:
Durham, New Hampshire, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 6:49 am
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| Having made my pitch for Buds above, I would nevertheless agree that a beginning player should get a modern guitar without any potential issues to get started. Once one knows one's way around the mechanics of the instrument, the little nuances that are necessary to make an older steel happy will be easier to deal with. |
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Richard Sinkler
From:
aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 7:34 am
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I owned 2 Buds. A Professional (rack and barrel) and a Super Pro. Loved the Professional. Hated the Super Pro (worst guitar I ever owned). The rack and barrel was definitely "clunky", but the tone was to die for. I don't remember it having tuning issues. I would love to have that beautiful blue Professional back.
_________________
Carter D10 8p/8k, Dekley S10 3p/4k C6 setup,Regal RD40 Dobro, NV400, NV112 . Playing for 54 years and still counting. |
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Brian Gattis
From:
Georgia, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 9:39 am
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I sure don’t understand when people say they don’t have to tune anything on their guitar for a month?! Not sure I believe that. Tempermental by nature is the pedal steel. If you want the Sho Bud sound buy a Sho Bud. Love mine!
Brian Gattis |
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Ricky Davis
From:
Bertram, Texas USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 10:09 am
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Yes I certainly don't want to listen to anyone that says they never have to tune their Pedal Steel....OUCH!!!
They might be meaning to say: "not having to tune the nylon tuners"....but yes the open tuning notes move daily.
Here's my latest recording on my Sho~bud LDG and the new Weldon Henson Video which I recorded on the new CD with Lloyd Maines EARS producing this new "Texas Made" Honky Tonk CD and if you know Lloyd; you can't even have a breath of a out of tune note ANYWHERE.....!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Z77MRjU-IA
Ricky
_________________
Ricky Davis
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com |
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b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 12:04 pm
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| Ricky Davis wrote: |
Yes I certainly don't want to listen to anyone that says they never have to tune their Pedal Steel....OUCH!!!
They might be meaning to say: "not having to tune the nylon tuners"....but yes the open tuning notes move daily.
Here's my latest recording on my Sho~bud LDG and the new Weldon Henson Video which I recorded on the new CD with Lloyd Maines EARS producing this new "Texas Made" Honky Tonk CD and if you know Lloyd; you can't even have a breath of a out of tune note ANYWHERE.....!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Z77MRjU-IA
Ricky |
Right. I tune the strings often. But when the pedal tuners need readjustment, it's probably time to change strings! (I don't play a Sho~Bud.)
Beautiful recording, Ricky! 
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
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Bob Muller
From:
Oregon, USA
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Ricky Davis
From:
Bertram, Texas USA
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Johnie King
From:
Tennessee, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 1:57 pm
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Bob Muller that’s what I’m talking about tone to the bone beautiful.
Know we all can’t play like Loyd but at least we can have A Bud almost like his.
The great Dick Overbey
Ricky Davis
Jimmy Day on an on Pro after pro managed to record an tour with these Buds.
You just can’t achieve the beautiful tone of these old Buds maybe come close with a lot of effort on todays new crop of steels. Sho Pro would come close or equally.
It’s worth a little tweaking on these old Buds know An then.
Last edited by Johnie King on 21 Feb 2019 6:04 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Damir Besic
From:
Nashville,TN.
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 3:23 pm
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I love Sho Bud... period...
if you like Sho Bud concept, then Show Pro si the way to go ... I love Show Pro too 
_________________
https://steelguitarsonline.com/ |
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Jack Turlington
From:
Toccoa, GA, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 5:37 pm
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| Those are two gorgeous old Sho Buds Bob Muller! |
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W. C. Edgar
From:
Iowa City Iowa, Madison CT, Nashville, Austin, Phoenix
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Posted 21 Feb 2019 6:39 pm
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I play a 1980 Pro II
No, it's not the 'desired' Sho-Bud undercarriage and changer but I tune it at the beginning of the night and unless I break a string (once every month playing 5 nites a week) I never touch it.
What these guys need to realize is that 99% of your tone comes from your attack and technique and the rest from the guitar.
My guitar was 'willed' to me by my mentor from Atlanta Ga when he passed away.
Truthfully, any all pull guitar is pretty easy to adjust or tweak if needed.
I've had 3 66 D-10 Emmons, 71 Emmons 73 Emmons 75 Emmons and then a slug of new model D-10 Sho Buds including the Professional, Pro II & Pro III & Super Pro plus 3 LDG's
Deckley
MSA
JCH
2-Fessenden
3-Marrs
Fender (borrowed)
Jackson (borrowed)
and Zumsteels
All were playable and I sounded the same no matter what I played.
Look me up and listen.
WC Edgar
Update!
Just drove to the gulf and bought a Pro 1
Hadn't been out of the case in over 20 years, other than one string it was in tune LOL
_________________
First owner of Steelseat.com
1980 Sho-Bud Pro II & 1977 Sho-Bud Pro l
Lawrence 610 Pickups
1979 Peavey LTD
1980 Peavey Nashville 400
Goodrich L-120
Toured with Tim McGraw, Alan Jackson & more
wcedgar.com
Last edited by W. C. Edgar on 7 Sep 2023 10:46 am; edited 1 time in total |
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