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Author Topic:  New Player Buying advice
David Nugent


From:
Gum Spring, Va.
Post  Posted 11 Jul 2019 3:35 am    
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As with other Forum members, my first steel guitar was an 'MSA' from this era. Purchased it used and sold it after a few years when I ordered my first new guitar (Mullen D-10 pre-RP). The party to whom it was sold was still playing and earning money with it last I heard. "Built like a Sherman tank" is an apt description for these instruments.
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Gene Tani


From:
The Pacific NW,
Post  Posted 11 Jul 2019 5:52 am    
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Can you go try it, get lots of pix of undercarriage etc and serial number per https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=2220308

You can also look at *asking prices* of MSA's at 4sale forum here and at https://reverb.com/marketplace?query=msa%20pedal%20steel&show_only_sold=true
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Donny Hinson


From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
Post  Posted 11 Jul 2019 6:38 am    
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Mike Perlowin wrote:


Cons: Weighs as much as a Sherman tank. The undercarriage uses round cross rods, which make changing your setup much complicated and difficult. Newer steels have square crossrids, which make it much easier to work on the undercarriage.



IMHO, The MSA "Classic" guitars aren't all that difficult to work on. Yes, the disassembly required to make or add a change may require a few more steps, but that's just a little extra time. There's really nothing that I (or anyone with a little mechanical aptitude) would consider difficult or complicated about it.

Yeah, they're heavier than most, but that's usually only a problem for us old guys! Winking
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Andy Henriksen


From:
Michigan, USA
Post  Posted 11 Jul 2019 7:29 am    
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Gene Tani wrote:
Can you go try it, get lots of pix of undercarriage etc and serial number per https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=2220308

You can also look at *asking prices* of MSA's at 4sale forum here and at https://reverb.com/marketplace?query=msa%20pedal%20steel&show_only_sold=true

Yeah, unfortunately it's nearly 2 hours from me, so when I go look at it (tomorrow morn) it will be with cash in pocket, and I'll have to make the call on the spot.
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Andy Henriksen


From:
Michigan, USA
Post  Posted 11 Jul 2019 7:33 am    
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Mike Perlowin wrote:
This is not a "supersustain." It's an MSA. One of the best steel guitars on the market. This one appears to be from the very late 70s or early 80s.

Pros: Better than excellent quality. Built like a Sherman tank. Will last forever.

Cons: Weighs as much as a Sherman tank. The undercarriage uses round cross rods, which make changing your setup much complicated and difficult. Newer steels have square crossrids, which make it much easier to work on the undercarriage.

It's a great instrumernt, but 99% what you play will be on the E9 neck. Unless you plan to play C6, I'd say you should get a single neck.


I thought it was an MSA (make) Supersustain II (model), but maybe it's called something else. There are no pics of the front, so I'm not sure...

Anyway, I have played C6 lap steel for several years and right now, with my band, I end up playing E9 PSG on half my songs and a separate lap steel (in my lap) on half. I am thinking with the C6 neck, I'd be able to play everything on one guitar, which would be much more convenient - I'd be able to reach the volume pedal much better for one thing...
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Mike Perlowin


From:
Los Angeles CA
Post  Posted 11 Jul 2019 8:47 am    
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Donny Hinson wrote:


IMHO, The MSA "Classic" guitars aren't all that difficult to work on. Yes, the disassembly required to make or add a change may require a few more steps, but that's just a little extra time. There's really nothing that I (or anyone with a little mechanical aptitude) would consider difficult or complicated about it.


Hi Donny, Actually, I think the Millennium is harder to work on than the old classic, because it's more complicated and the parts are so small. I can work on an old classic, but not on my Millies.
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Gene Tani


From:
The Pacific NW,
Post  Posted 11 Jul 2019 12:57 pm    
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I think the seller should be willing to send pix/serial # or talk about it over the phone. Ideally, also weight in case but not everybody has bathroom scales. If none of above, I would shy away when there's so many knowledgeable /conscientious sellers in the forum..

Andy Henriksen wrote:
Gene Tani wrote:
Can you go try it, get lots of pix of undercarriage etc and serial number per https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=2220308

You can also look at *asking prices* of MSA's at 4sale forum here and at https://reverb.com/marketplace?query=msa%20pedal%20steel&show_only_sold=true

Yeah, unfortunately it's nearly 2 hours from me, so when I go look at it (tomorrow morn) it will be with cash in pocket, and I'll have to make the call on the spot.

_________________
- Rukavina and Sonny Jenkins laps, stage 1
- The secret sauce: polyester adidas sweatpants to buff your picks on, K swiss sneakers, Diet Mountain Dew
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Donny Hinson


From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
Post  Posted 11 Jul 2019 3:26 pm    
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Mike Perlowin wrote:


Hi Donny, Actually, I think the Millennium is harder to work on than the old classic, because it's more complicated and the parts are so small. I can work on an old classic, but not on my Millies.


You may have a point, Mike. Guitars should have either 2-piece pullers, or slotted pullers. But having slotted, 2-piece pullers is silly and overkill, IMHO. The bad thing about the 2-piece puller is that it normally adds another part to the works, the purpose of which is to hold the pin or rod in the puller. The old design pins did that just fine with the 4-hole pullers.

All designs have problems and issues. That's what goes with not having standardized parts on an instrument.
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Andy Henriksen


From:
Michigan, USA
Post  Posted 12 Jul 2019 8:00 am    
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I passed on the MSA. To the right player/fixer, it is likely a great deal. He was willing to take $1000 for it, but what I found was that the left knees were way too far right to play the AB pedals without really contorting. I thought it looked that way in the pics, but was hoping it was just the camera angle or something. I have no idea why its set up that way. It seemed very weird.

Also, the Es were on the right, so I'd need to swap those around (I was hoping for a copedent very close to my other guitar). As I've never worked on ANY PSG, I wasn't up for any of this.

It did work, and seemed to sound nice, and just raking across the C6 neck made me even more excited about getting a D10. So the search continues.

Here's the ad. https://toledo.craigslist.org/msg/d/bryan-msa-dbl-neck-pedal-steel/6908894037.html

He was willing to take $1000 for it. He bought the thing years ago, gave up learning after a bit and packed it up. It was in a case for the last 8 years. Seemed to be in very good condition. No rust, etc. undercarriage looked pretty clean. No idea if he'd be willing to ship, but I suspect probably not.

And yeah, it weighed a ton.
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Mike Perlowin


From:
Los Angeles CA
Post  Posted 12 Jul 2019 11:33 am    
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In my opinion, if you want to play C6, you should have bought it. $1,000 is a real bargain. And you can always have the copedant altered.

But as I previously said, 99% of the music you will play will be on the E9 neck, and unless you have your heart set on playing C6, you would be better off buying a single neck.
_________________
My steels are Magnificent! Stupendous! Awesome!
-----------
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin
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Leo Grassl


From:
Nashville TN
Post  Posted 12 Jul 2019 1:39 pm    
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Andy Henriksen wrote:
Mike Perlowin wrote:
This is not a "supersustain." It's an MSA. One of the best steel guitars on the market. This one appears to be from the very late 70s or early 80s.

Pros: Better than excellent quality. Built like a Sherman tank. Will last forever.

Cons: Weighs as much as a Sherman tank. The undercarriage uses round cross rods, which make changing your setup much complicated and difficult. Newer steels have square crossrids, which make it much easier to work on the undercarriage.

It's a great instrumernt, but 99% what you play will be on the E9 neck. Unless you plan to play C6, I'd say you should get a single neck.


I thought it was an MSA (make) Supersustain II (model), but maybe it's called something else. There are no pics of the front, so I'm not sure...

Anyway, I have played C6 lap steel for several years and right now, with my band, I end up playing E9 PSG on half my songs and a separate lap steel (in my lap) on half. I am thinking with the C6 neck, I'd be able to play everything on one guitar, which would be much more convenient - I'd be able to reach the volume pedal much better for one thing...


Andy,

I would identify that MSA make as a "Vintage XL" or possibly a "Classic XL" both absolutely great guitars. I am a proud owner of a Vintage XL SD-10 myself. If the guitar works I wouldn't hesitate to buy it. They are solid in every way and mechanically far better than the guitar you already own. Below is a picture of my guitar



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Chuck Miller


From:
Newton, Iowa, USA
Post  Posted 13 Jul 2019 11:01 am    
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Yep that looks like a well kept Classic XL D-10, a little newer than my 76 Classic. I believe MSA used to put the E's on the right usually back then, which means this a relativity unmolested guitar. Worth more than he is asking, IMO.
Chuck
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Mike Perlowin


From:
Los Angeles CA
Post  Posted 13 Jul 2019 11:42 am    
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Chuck Miller wrote:
I believe MSA used to put the E's on the right usually back then...


For whatever it's worth, in 1979, when I bought the green MSA shown in my avatar the E raises and lowers were on the left. I don't know if that was the way they were all set up or not.

At one point I moved the E lowers to the RKL. After a while I moved them back to the LKR.

I played that guitar for 25 years, till I upgraded to a Millennium. It never let me down. I probably should have kept it.
_________________
My steels are Magnificent! Stupendous! Awesome!
-----------
Please visit my web site and Soundcloud page and listen to the music posted there.
http://www.mikeperlowin.com http://soundcloud.com/mike-perlowin
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

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