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Topic: Lady Bird. Eharp / Alkire tuning |
Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Jean-Sebastien Gauthier
From:
Quebec, Canada
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Posted 4 Apr 2018 4:55 pm |
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| I think the problem with those 12 strings fancy tuning is that you can feel the player thinking and you don’t feel the music. I’m sorry I don’t want to be negative and don’t want to say I’m better or have the answers but I just can’t understand why those tuning exist! |
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Rick Abbott
From:
Indiana, USA
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Posted 4 Apr 2018 5:30 pm
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I have to admire your serious undertaking of a very complex endeavor!!
It appears that even the kitchen sink is included in that tuning.
Keep us posted. You are helping us to remember a piece of our history. Some of it is rough, but some of it is right on. Very cool!
Also, I now know what that particular Eharp sounds like...I want one!
_________________
RICK ABBOTT
Sho~Bud D-10 Professional #7962
Remington T-8, Wakarusa 5e3 clone
1953 Stromberg-Carlson AU-35 |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 4 Apr 2018 5:39 pm
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I got a nice private message to repost this. Yeah, its' rough. It sounded a lot worse a few days ago. Sounds better now. As far as thinking: yeah, definitely thinking. First time I tried to play this tune and improvise with the eharp tuning after having moved from dobro to steel a few months ago. Only those who can see the intent need bother listen. For those who can: this is my first attempt to document my progress on both steel and this tuning. Those that don't get it, probably not going to like it.
And it is a 10 string tuning, not 12.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU2tZvSj4lk
_________________
Check out the Steel Guitar Union Hall Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@steelguitarunionhall |
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George Piburn
From:
The Land of Enchantment New Mexico
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 4 Apr 2018 7:17 pm
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First chorus is the roughest. I'm okay with what I played going into the second go round. Hope it inspires some others.
_________________
Check out the Steel Guitar Union Hall Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@steelguitarunionhall |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 5 Apr 2018 4:27 am
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In my opinion, every single E-Harp player (save one) sounded stiff and I think that is a result of the pianistic approach of the tuning where heaven and hell are adjacent to one another. The Byrd diatonic tuning is another where string grips matter and the tuning is not a strum tuning. I found that I made more music when I reduced my strings down to six and I'm comfortable there. But, while my personal mantra is "less is more", I say keep following your muse, Bill.
There's a lot of potential in the E-Harp tuning to make great music and even to rediscover a style and approach to steel guitar playing that got lost and went practically extinct after the advent of pedals. Alkire clearly put so much work into this approach that it deserves to live on and I'm sure you are inspiring people to whom this approach to the instrument feels right. Lady Bird is a fun tune to play and I admire you for tackling such a bebop warhorse. So keep picking!
_________________
Steel Guitar Books! Website: www.volkmediabooks.com |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 5 Apr 2018 4:39 am
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Thanks Andy. It is really uncharted territory. What I liked personally about this exercise is that i learned the tune a few days ago, from the sheet music (no tab obviously). this was literally about the 5th time playing through the tune. For me, it has opened up a method for me to move forward. need to work on intonation issues and my improvisation, but I feel a world just opened.
"There's a lot of potential in the E-Harp tuning to make great music and even to rediscover a style and approach to steel guitar playing that got lost and went practically extinct after the advent of pedals."
Sounds like your next book Andy. 
_________________
Check out the Steel Guitar Union Hall Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@steelguitarunionhall |
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Jim Davies
From:
Charlottesville VA
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Stefan Robertson
From:
Hertfordshire, UK
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Posted 5 Apr 2018 4:58 am
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I commend you Bill.
I get you. continue to dare to tread where other's haven't before. Well at least you have a guide. I am in the Abyss and loving it. Slow gains but I'm pretty darn sure that when I am ready one day it'll all make sense.
I do love the line about Heaven and Hell with your close intervals. Wait we have nearly the same intervals . LOL.
Keep it up which makes me think maybe I should share some discoveries and vice versa. I did say one day we would have a catchup. I think its soon that time. 
_________________
Stefan
Bill Hatcher custom 12 string Lap Steel Guitar
E13#9/F secrets: https://thelapsteelguitarist.wordpress.com
"Give it up for The Lap Steel Guitarist" |
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Doug Beaumier
From:
Northampton, MA
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Posted 5 Apr 2018 6:22 am
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I like the "heaven and hell" on adjacent strings analogy too! I think of it like walking through a minefield. You have to proceed (pick) very carefully to avoid a disaster. Those six-in-a-row strings tuned in half steps mean... no strumming and very selective picking of the strings. Much of the "smooth and flowing" sound of the steel guitar is lost, unfortunately. But the tuning is certainly worth exploring. Eddie Alkire dedicated his life to it and his hard work earned him a spot in the steel guitar hall of fame.
_________________
My Site / My YouTube Channel
25 Songs C6 Lap Steel / 25 MORE Songs C6 Lap Steel / 16 Songs, C6, A6, B11 / 60 Popular Melodies E9 Pedal Steel |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Posted 5 Apr 2018 6:40 am
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Sounds like your next book, Bill!
One of the problems with steel guitar is the reliance of so many players on tab alone and the Alkire method's focus on standard notation helps push steel guitar closer toward the mainstream of musicianship on all instruments.
It'll be interesting to see where you take this. Just avoid the crossroads - you know what happens there!
_________________
Steel Guitar Books! Website: www.volkmediabooks.com |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 5 Apr 2018 6:56 am
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One of the things I love about the Alkire tuning is that it doesn't sound like anything else. Doesn't sound like a 6th or 9th tuning. Personally I don't think any of the smooth and flowing nature of the steel needs to be lost. Don't confuse the players limitations with the tunings limitations.
Standard notation is the thing. I learned Lady Bird from sheet music. Took me a day to learn the chords, and another day to figure out the melody from the sheet music. It really helps with learning a lot of tunes when you can just read straight notation.
_________________
Check out the Steel Guitar Union Hall Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@steelguitarunionhall |
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Jack Hanson
From:
San Luis Valley, USA
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Posted 5 Apr 2018 7:23 am
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You're a far braver man than I, Bill. From a basic Dobro setup to that 10-string electric monster tuned in half-steps is not for the weak of heart.
My journey has been nearly the opposite, beginning on a 3x4 pedal steel and progressing (some would call it regressing) to mainly 6-string instruments, both electric and acoustic. Personally, I guess I'm a "less is more" kinda guy.
Best of luck in your musical journey, Bill. I read your posts with curiosity and interest. Keep 'em coming. |
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Mike A Holland
From:
United Kingdom
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Posted 5 Apr 2018 9:59 am
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Bill, I would say all credit to you for having a go with this tuning. I would love to hear what you have after a couple of years getting to grips with it. I do hope you keep at it. I suspect it will be a lonely struggle for you but I think it will offer rich rewards in the end. I for one will be watching your progress. Great to see somebody keeping these instruments from extinction!
Mike |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 5 Apr 2018 1:24 pm
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Mike,
It has already offered rich rewards. There is no way I would have been able to play and improvise over a jazz tune like this in a few days if I was playing a dobro, or a 6th tuning. Everything is just under your fingers with this tuning. I'm currently working on Cherokee and you can practically play the entire tune on one fret.
I think it was Andy who mentioned the pianoistic nature of the tuning. Quite true. But that is also the thing that makes it a great steel tuning. The focus moves from the left hand to the right. That is a considerable shift in mindset, especially for a guitarist/dobro player.
Being able to play Cherokee with few left hand movements means frees me up to focus on improvisation.
Here is my goal. Play the head of jazz standards like I'd play a folk tune on fingerstyle guitar. Improvise over those changes. return to the head. Don't think I've ever found an instrument or tuning that makes that goal easier.
If nothing else, I hope this journey expands the possibilities of other, more talented people's, journey's. Friends: there is gold in this tuning that hasn't been mined yet. I sincerely hope that someone like Doug explores it
_________________
Check out the Steel Guitar Union Hall Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@steelguitarunionhall |
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Joe Breeden
From:
Virginia, USA
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Posted 6 Apr 2018 5:59 am
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| Bill, I admire you and your effort. Keep it up and just see how far you can take it.. Waiting. Joe |
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HowardR
From:
N.Y.C.-Fire Island-Asheville
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Posted 6 Apr 2018 9:31 am
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There are wonderful, very accomplished players who have posted some amazing videos that we have seen here over the years....but this, (your vid) is just as valuable as it is unique....it depicts the beginning of your learning journey which we don't really get to see here.....it's organic and there is good information in the rough spots as well as the smooth ones...it tends to make the viewer think as well as you while playing it...it's very realistic because it doesn't look easy......
I hope you continue to chart your journey & progress....
Something else I was thinking about....not to put the cart before the horse.....but I imagine that after you get your bearings, incorporating slants in the Alkire tuning may be an interesting new approach to the sound of this tuning....... |
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Rick Aiello
From:
Berryville, VA USA
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Posted 6 Apr 2018 10:18 am
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Thats a tough undertaking ... I'm with Howard, well done.
Mae Lang played an Eharp ... she was a regular at the HSGA conventions. She was everybit as smooth as Jerry Byrd on that 10 stringer ... reading the music as she played.
Her vibrato was to die for ... such a nice lady, too
Good luck on your adventure ! |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 6 Apr 2018 10:36 am
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I keep hearing about the wonderful Mae Lang. Just wish there were some recordings of her.
BTW, currently working on Cherokee. Decidedly more difficult than Lady Bird. But I'm getting there. I'll woodshed it for a few more days than try and get a video up.
_________________
Check out the Steel Guitar Union Hall Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@steelguitarunionhall |
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Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
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Posted 6 Apr 2018 5:17 pm
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I appreciate everyone's encouragement. I think when you hear cherokee, you'll get a better sense off the spirit of this tuning.
One of the advantages of the whole Alkire method is the speed I'm able to learn tunes. Before, sort of figuring them out by ear, and slowing down sections to learn a Mike Auldridge or Jerry Douglas passage. Gaining repertoire takes time, let alone learning how to improvise over it.
Using the sheet music helps a lot. But also, because of the chromatic nature of the tuning, you can pluck out the melody on most tunes on one fret, and the harmonies are just there. So learning the chords and the head are fairly quick . Then it is just a matter of figuring out pockets on the neck to improvise from. And you don't have to move far to find them. Cherokee is certainly the most difficult song I've tried to play fast. I could have never done it on my dobro without giving up. But I was able to play the melody and the chords up to 250 tempo and improvise at that speed after a couple of days of woodshedding it
There are certain passages that need to be hit just right, and I get them about 50% of the time. Biggest issue is I lose my place if I turn the melody off in BIAB.
the funniest part: not having anyone to compare myself to is very very freeing. I have nothing but the Alkire instruction and my own knowledge of music theory (and love of jazz) to guide me. As Bobby D said: when you ain't got nothing, you got nothing to lose.
_________________
Check out the Steel Guitar Union Hall Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@steelguitarunionhall |
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Stefan Robertson
From:
Hertfordshire, UK
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Posted 7 Apr 2018 12:06 pm
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| Bill McCloskey wrote: |
I appreciate everyone's encouragement. I think when you hear cherokee, you'll get a better sense off the spirit of this tuning.
One of the advantages of the whole Alkire method is the speed I'm able to learn tunes. Before, sort of figuring them out by ear, and slowing down sections to learn a Mike Auldridge or Jerry Douglas passage. Gaining repertoire takes time, let alone learning how to improvise over it.
Using the sheet music helps a lot. But also, because of the chromatic nature of the tuning, you can pluck out the melody on most tunes on one fret, and the harmonies are just there. So learning the chords and the head are fairly quick . Then it is just a matter of figuring out pockets on the neck to improvise from. And you don't have to move far to find them. Cherokee is certainly the most difficult song I've tried to play fast. I could have never done it on my dobro without giving up. But I was able to play the melody and the chords up to 250 tempo and improvise at that speed after a couple of days of woodshedding it.... |
Keen to compare your voicings to mine in Cherokee. PM me as I'm up for it.
_________________
Stefan
Bill Hatcher custom 12 string Lap Steel Guitar
E13#9/F secrets: https://thelapsteelguitarist.wordpress.com
"Give it up for The Lap Steel Guitarist" |
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