So...getting started -- U12?

James Winger · From: Washington, USA

hey guys, been a member for a few months.
just reading along
I'M originally a classic[al] guitarist (but I'm very rusty)
and have been playing around with a slide guitar extender nut which is neat

But I've had some times to jump on a PSG and just make sounds and it's freaking magical how the sounds cn just sort of float

and after some chatting with Susan Alcorn just about music and sound ...and life (super nice person and she seems to take the PSG to some pretty interesting places)

I'd like to give it a full shot.

I'm not really married to particular styles and don't have aspirations about playing out(I'm 48 and can't stay up late anymore anyway)

I'm not seeing a whole lot of teaching material on U12, but I may be looking in the wrong spot.

any advice would be appreciated. I guess I just need a push staart if that makes sense

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

The top 8 strings of U12 are the same as E9th. The bottom 10 strings of U12 (with the lever engaged) are B6th, the same as C6th but 1/2 step lower. E9th and C6th instructional material translates easily to the U12.
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John Swain · From: Winchester, Va

I feel there is a reason most "Pros" play D-10s. For a 10% savings in weight, the compromises are too great,IMHO !

Rick Abbott · From: Indiana, USA

Could that be because they started playing before the U12, or were influenced by people who became Pros before the U12?

Tradition is very influential in making choices. The U12 is not traditional in the truest respects.

I love the idea of the Uni. I hate the two lowest strings. I've have 2 U12 guitars and prefer a D10, only for the 10 strings. I love the Uni idea. My goal is to have an S10 Uni someday. Which is not very hard to do...unless you want a new Sierra Muttering

Which I do.
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Jeffrey McFadden · From: Missouri, USA

John Billings · From: Ohio, USA

U-12 or U-12 extended E9th. After playing a Kline for 20 years, my brain is a 12 string brain. There's such great stuff using those two low strings, although if you don't wanna use them, don't! But they're great to have!
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"74 Bud S-10 3&6
'73 Bud S-10 3&5(under construction)
'63 Fingertip S-10, at James awaiting 6 knees
'57 Strat, LP Blue
'91 Tele with 60's Maple neck
Dozen more guitars!
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John Billings · From: Ohio, USA

Famous guitarist (and my best friend) was going to hire a string trio for background. That is, until he heard my Kline playing the trio parts. I'm kinda hard to hear as I'm background/texture, but it's a Zaza cd not a JB cd;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Puov93SDltM
_________________
Dr. Z Surgical Steel amp, amazing!
"74 Bud S-10 3&6
'73 Bud S-10 3&5(under construction)
'63 Fingertip S-10, at James awaiting 6 knees
'57 Strat, LP Blue
'91 Tele with 60's Maple neck
Dozen more guitars!
Dozens of amps, but SF Quad reverb, Rick Johnson cabs. JBL 15, '64 Vibroverb for at home.
'52 and '56 Pro Amps

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Rich Peterson · From: Moorhead, MN

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Jeffrey McFadden · From: Missouri, USA

I particularly enjoy Joe Wright's blues and rock pedal steel. Like it says in my signature, I don't play what I'm supposed to. I started on lap steel because my hands were too crippled to play 6 string anymore, and found out I loved it better than I'd ever loved 6 string, and that led to the pedal steel, and so forth. But anyway - here's Joe's copedent, off his website. He says, "I approach this guitar as one big instrument with lots of possibilities," and that's what it looks like to me. I wouldn't be thinking of it as "an E9" and "a B6," I'd just think where I could find the notes I needed.

My D10 is currently set up E9 and A6 (it came that way.) If I can without breaking strings I'm going to raise the A6 neck to B6 so I can start living with the two tunings on one surface in front of me, double neck notwithstanding. I think I could learn useful things on the way.

I play a celtic harp. It has 33 strings. I like lots of strings. U-12 sounds great.
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Fred Treece · From: California, USA

12 strings and 45 pitch changes, plus 24+ frets. Wow thatâ€™s a lotta choices. I have trouble with paper or plastic sometimes.

James Winger · From: Washington, USA

James Winger · From: Washington, USA

Mr Perlowin;
I've been listening to your FBS for 20 years
(whew, glad I caught my typo, I almost dropped the F in FBS - that would have not been so good)

One thing I find unfortunate about the PSG is that, like an underappreciated actor with a breakout role, I think it has, to an extent, become type-cast. So I think it's really cool people like you will put the instrument in other contexts

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

Thank you James. I appreciate your kind words about my stuff. Since we're talking about copedants and setups, I must mention that almost everything on the CD was done on my version of the E9 side of my U-12. I did re-tune my 7th string to E to play the imitation harp parts on Afternoon of a Faun. Aside from that, Everything else is E9.

The late great Al Vescovo, who only played C6 once teased me about playing "the hillbilly tuning. "I answered him by calling it the Mozart tuning.

Here is my current copedant. The W is the wrist lever.

BTW, I made 2 more CDs, and I feel that both of them came out better than FBS. I think my Spanish Steel CD is my ultimate achievement. You can hear some stuff from all 3 CDs at the web sites in my signature.
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Christopher Woitach · From: Portland, Oregon, USA

I know that only .00001% of the Steel population uses it, but anyone going from C6 non pedal to pedal should always at least consider Maurice Andersonâ€™s Bb6 Uni, a fantastic tuning, in my opinion...

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www.affmusic.com

Richard Sinkler · From: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Douglas Schuch · From: Valencia, Philippines

"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice - in practice there is" Yogi Berra.

With that as a prelude, I will say that, in theory, I really love the idea of U-12. In practice, I did not.

Short answer: 12 strings significantly increased the odds of me hitting a clam - in theory, the increase would only be 20%, but in practice... see the above quote."

Long answer:

"ONE BIG TUNING". My feet could not hit the B-pedal, rock onto the A, then find pedal 8 for a boo-wah with any consistency. In fact, I have concluded my klutz-factor allows me 4 pedals only (and thus, 8 with a double-neck). So I moved pedal 5 to a knee lever (thanks Lane) and now can find the right pedal more often than not.

"All copedents are a compromise." Indeed. But, if you attempt to mash two different tunings into one, there are lots of conflicts as to which lever goes where! I honestly think some wise soul will some day soon come up with a tuning that does what the two tunings do without so many compromises - by drastically rethinking the whole thing. But I found the compromises of U-12 frustrating. I switched to D-10 where I could put the changes for each neck where I wanted them without it interfering with the other tuning.

But ultimately, see the short answer above: I just get lost with 12 strings way more often than I do with 10.

So, in short, it might work for you. It did not work for me. I fully realize it works fine for others.

Doug
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Ian Rae · From: Redditch, England

James, the first PSG I got my hands on happened to be a D10 so I started on that but I'm not sure it matters. You can start on whatever comes your way, as you're not going to learn everything all at once. The point about the Uni is that you can play E9 stuff or C6 stuff, so you can use the teaching materials for either or both.
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John De Maille · From: On a Mountain in Upstate Halcottsville, N.Y.

I've been playing a U-12 for about 12 years now and I like it a lot. The band I play in does mostly 75% country tunes, so, I usually stick to the E-9th side. But, for the rest, we play Western swing type songs. For those, I like to play the 6th tuning. However, I will switch in mid song to both phrasings just to change it up a bit. I'm also the only lead instrument, so, I like to vary my playing accordingly. I tried playing a D-10 and couldn't get comfortable reaching out over the inside neck. The U-12 fits me perfectly. My tuning is the basic Jeff Newman U-12 tuning, but, with ABC pedals not CBA pedals. My E lower lever is RKR and is quite easy to engage and hold in.

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