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Topic: No picks? |
Joshua Hicks
From: Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 14 Jan 2018 3:55 pm
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Hey yall. I’m about a year in to playing steel. I’ve played 6 string for 15 years and never used picks. Ive been trying to use my picks when playing steel and I have a really hard time. Mainly because I can’t feel the strings like I used to with six string. So Ive been slacking and spent the last 6 months playing with no picks. How many of y’all don’t use picks? Or should I suck it up and start learning how to play with picks? _________________ Them sad ole sounds coming out of those speakers was solid country gold. |
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Edward Rhea
From: Medford Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 14 Jan 2018 4:44 pm
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This seems to be a popular trend...I know at least two other steel players in Oklahoma, that don’t use picks and get along fine. I personally prefer picks, but I’ve got teenagers...so what do I know!? Enjoy your pedal steel journey! _________________ “TONESNOB†|
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Tim Russell
From: Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted 14 Jan 2018 4:59 pm
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I suppose playing without picks is fine, but there are times when you need to dig into the strings and get that "bite," that sharp sound, and I'm not certain if a person can do that without picks.
Paul Franklin "bites" into the strings here in some of my favorite work of his - a timeless classic! Around the 2:10 mark or so, he digs in on the upper register.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAHfcqzhag0
Then again, if you can achieve what you need to without them, I say "have at it!"
_________________ Sierra Crown D-10
Last edited by Tim Russell on 14 Jan 2018 10:52 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Larry Carlson
From: My Computer
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Posted 14 Jan 2018 5:00 pm
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................ _________________ I have stuff.
I try to make music with it.
Sometimes it works.
Sometimes it doesn't.
But I keep on trying.
Last edited by Larry Carlson on 16 Jan 2018 7:15 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Kevin Fix
From: Michigan, USA
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Posted 14 Jan 2018 5:20 pm Old Topic Here Over The Years!!!
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Use finger pics and a good thumb pic. No pics, no bite or tone. It is like what Tim said, their is times when you have to "dig in". I am some what of a aggressive picker. I could not imagine playing without pics. My choice of finger pics are the pics Jeff Newman sold years ago. Best finger pics I ever owned. I use a National, large thumb pic. I put the thumb pic on my thumb close to the knuckle instead of on the end of your thumb. Better control of my thumb close to knuckle. |
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Ian Rae
From: Redditch, England
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Posted 14 Jan 2018 10:40 pm
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Larry Carlson wrote: |
My opinion is if you like the sound, do whatever you are doing. |
I think it's more important that the customer likes the sound. History shows us that all commercially successful players past and present have used finger picks to get that classy glassy sound the world expects.
I came from playing bass and found finger picks impossible at first, but I sucked it up (as Joshua puts it). Newman picks and Right Hand Alpha set me on the right path _________________ Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Paul Sutherland
From: Placerville, California
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 12:58 am
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Jeff Beck gets along just fine on electric guitar without picks. He has a unique tone due to his muted fingertip attack. Brent Mason only uses a thumb pick and he's the hottest guitar slinger in Nashville. I suspect a hot steel player could make quit a name for himself by doing something different and sounding a bit different. It all depends on the tone you want to achieve. _________________ It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing. |
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Bill Moore
From: Manchester, Michigan
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 6:09 am
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Hey Josh, I hope you are doing well. Keep the picks on, you will get used to them, and you will sound better. Patience! |
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Lane Gray
From: Topeka, KS
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 6:36 am
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On pedal steel, there is exactly ONE major player who regularly played without them, the late Bobbe Seymour.
We can assume there's a reason why almost everyone else uses them.
BTW, I have gone with just a thumbpick on occasion (such as an encore at the end of the night when my picks were already in their bottle in my seat), and I've actually found a way to get the same sound as long as your nails are SHORT. Dig in to the strings with the meat of the fingertips, and release them with a snap. It's a noticeably longer release time, but not unmanageable. But I would hate to do it for a whole four-set night.
If you want to sound like the rest of us, the fingerpicks are an important, although not indispensable, part of the equation.
It's as important as strings so tightly stretched that they live near the edge of failure _________________ 2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects |
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Nic Neufeld
From: Kansas City, Missouri
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 7:03 am
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I was new to steel (at the time nonpedal) last year and I stuck with no fingerpicks for a while. I thought I preferred the tone but at the time it was actually more that I was clumsy with the picks and just didn't have the right touch with it, yet. I took advice of folks on the non-pedal forum and stuck with it a bit and now they feel comfortable/not awkward and I prefer the tone with rather than without. Of course, everyone is different and you may ultimately prefer to play "bare"...just sharing my own experience, coming from bass playing it was a lot easier to control muting with my bare fingers than when I had metal claws on my finger tips, so I thought, maybe I should just play without picks, but I kept at it and it became a lot easier. Your mileage may vary! |
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Donny Hinson
From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 7:16 am
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Just suck it up and do it! Some very famous players have occasionally tried doing without picks, but 99.9% of them went back to using them. |
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Ian Rae
From: Redditch, England
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 7:16 am
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Lane Gray wrote: |
they live near the edge of failure |
Don't we all. Nic, your mileage is identical with mine _________________ Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Bob Carlucci
From: Candor, New York, USA
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 7:32 am
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This plan is fool proof.. believe me, I have told several guys about this, done it myself and it works...
I was like you.. i was going to create a radical new trend, and be a great player using NO picks.. It doesn't work... I was just too lazy to get used to them, and was in denial..
So one day, many decades ago, I put my picks on, and never took them of.. I wore them eating, working around the house, sleeping, watching TV, driving.. Everywhere, all the time, where ever and when ever i possibly could.. After a few days or weeks, they stop feeling alien and uncomfortable, and you stop noticing you are even wearing them.. Serious, put them on and leave them on. Practice with them, and be single minded about it, do NOT give up..
Sure you can muddle along on pedal steel without picks, and maybe, you will join the tiny percentage of players that do well without them, but if you do, you are really restricting yourself by a huge margin.. Learn to love wearing the picks.. Its a commitment, but well worth it... bob _________________ I'm over the hill and hittin'rocks on the way down!
no gear list for me.. you don't have the time...... |
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Fred Treece
From: California, USA
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 9:44 am
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Long fingernails, short fingernails, no fingernails. When you are grinding them against taut metal strings for hours on end, the toughness of the nail is more important than the length.
You can get away with bare flesh on guitar strings, especially after you get calloused fingertips. I play thumb pick and bare finger guitar and I love the feel and the tone.
For steel, I will join the chorus here and strongly suggest learning how to use metal picks. I was in denial about for many weeks when I first started. I think it is a fingerstyle guitarist thing. I wonder what Jeff Beck or Brent Mason would do if they took up steel.
Use the picks. You will discover dynamic variety in tone and attack. Then you can switch back and forth at will, if that’s what you want. |
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Joshua Hicks
From: Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 11:20 am
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I appreciate all the replies fellas. I'll slap them back on and give them another shot. Another issue I was running into with using them was pick blocking. I can do it well with no picks but with picks I can't feel the string. I've tried to learn palm blocking but my wrist just doesn't bend that way. _________________ Them sad ole sounds coming out of those speakers was solid country gold. |
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Ian Rae
From: Redditch, England
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 11:27 am
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Aha - maybe you've exposed the real problem. Palm blocking requires no wrist movement if it's done right, and it is the primary method (some may disagree). Study Jeff Newman. Pick blocking lacks feel at first but you will gain it. Study Joe Wright. _________________ Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs
Last edited by Ian Rae on 15 Jan 2018 12:50 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Larry Carlson
From: My Computer
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 12:39 pm
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............... _________________ I have stuff.
I try to make music with it.
Sometimes it works.
Sometimes it doesn't.
But I keep on trying.
Last edited by Larry Carlson on 16 Jan 2018 7:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Ian Rae
From: Redditch, England
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 12:59 pm
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Sure, Larry - if you play solely for your own entertainment, you are the customer!
I play mostly for my own amusement (and to keep the brain sharp - I don't believe there's anything better!) - but I take care that when I pitch up to my weekly jam session I sound plausibly commercial. _________________ Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Jeffrey McFadden
From: Missouri, USA
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 4:51 pm
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I'm not yet into pedal, having been lap steeling for a few years now & am moving toward pedal now.
I've played bare fingered all along, and have finally come to the conclusion that I've just been mistaken, plus maybe lazy and chicken.
I'm a week and a half into finger picks. I am *not* going back. I'm already getting better note accuracy and tone control than I had. What pushed me over the edge was a little gig - I just couldn't cut through the noise.
Jeff |
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Dick Wood
From: Springtown Texas, USA
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 5:06 pm
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I played Bass for several years before switching to steel and thought I could play without picks. I couldn't hit the strings cleanly at all so I just dug in and they felt right in a very short period.
Keep at it and you'll be fine and I bet,happy you did in the end. _________________ Cops aren't paid much so I steel at night. |
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Bob Sykes
From: North Carolina
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Posted 15 Jan 2018 5:14 pm One man's experience
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When I first started PSG a little over 6 years ago, I took a few lessons from fine forumite here to get off the ground. During our first pre-lesson phone conversation, I told him that I had been a pretty good 6-string finger-picker for decades, and didn't feel like I needed or wanted finger picks. Besides, they were uncomfortable.
He replied "I'm not going to teach you if you don't wear finger picks."
There's lot's of old threads on here debating picks vs. none. One of them contains something like....
"It is better to be able to play with finger picks and choose not to occasionally than to not be able to play with them at all."
Those two gems convinced me to learn how use them. I'm still learning. I sometimes play without them at home, by myself, at lower volumes and feel like my blocking is better without them.
I cannot play a gig without them. Tried many times. The guys I play with are loud. Finger picks are like power steering in that setting. YMMV _________________ Carters Starter, D10 8+7, SD10
ISO Sustainus Ad Infinitum |
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Roy Carroll
From: North of a Round Rock
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Posted 17 Jan 2018 8:33 am
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HI Josh,
If you go to the website for the Paul Franklin courses, there is a trailer that explains his theory on pick blocking. He basically says that his model is using the last 3 digits on the right hand to block, so it is not really pick blocking. I would say that his method is pretty good! Click through until you see it. Good Luck! Keep Pickin'
https://modernmusicmasters.com/announcement-and-sales-page-pfm/ _________________ Just north of the Weird place, south of Georgetown |
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Joshua Hicks
From: Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 17 Jan 2018 1:53 pm
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Thank you for all the replies fellas! I've been playing with them this week. Also I had a forum member contact me and face timed me to look at my left hand positioning. Turns out I was pretty far off form where I should be. Which adjusting to the proper has left my hand cramping. Maneuvering the picks is easier because my thumb is wayyyyy out there now. This leaves room for my pointer and middle finger to work. _________________ Them sad ole sounds coming out of those speakers was solid country gold. |
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Joshua Hicks
From: Oklahoma, USA
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Posted 17 Jan 2018 1:58 pm
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Bill Moore wrote: |
Hey Josh, I hope you are doing well. Keep the picks on, you will get used to them, and you will sound better. Patience! |
Hey bill! I'm doing good! Yes patience patience! I am trying so hard to learn it with steel haha. I've come to the realization that I can't cheat a pedal steel like I could an electric guitar.
Again, thank you so much for the Zum. I love it and it still plays like a dream. I have a Nashville 112 and a Hilton pedal to go with it now _________________ Them sad ole sounds coming out of those speakers was solid country gold. |
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Chris Templeton
From: The Green Mountain State
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Posted 17 Jan 2018 5:07 pm
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The nice thing about playing with no picks is that after a while calluses build up on the fingers, giving a great variety of tone. People probably go back to picks because of the quicker attack. _________________ Excel 3/4 Pedal With An 8 String Hawaiian Neck, Tapper (10 string with a raised fretboard to fret with fingers), Single neck Fessenden 3/5
"The Tapper" : https://christophertempleton.bandcamp.com/album/the-tapper
Soundcloud Playlist: https://soundcloud.com/bluespruce8: |
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