How can I get that warm sweet tone on a Fender Custom?

Philip Garcia · From: California, USA

Hello, newbie here. Forgive me if there is an existing thread with the answers. Please redirect me if so. Or perhaps this my be a great refresher?
I have a 1952 Fender custom triple console with trapezoid pick ups ( not a string master ) and a Princenton '65 and Strymon pedals.
I've been playing for about a year and just a big fan of the instrument. So I love western swing, country, jazz, Hawaiian, Bluegrass, pretty much everything.
My question: besides technique and touch, hardware wise: what can I do to get that warm sweet tone out of this console? I seem to mainly get a thin, twangy and harsh trebly sound. I'd like to be able to get more of a warm, sweet tone. More of a thicker Hawaiian/jazz tone. Warm and fat but still bright.
I mean there must be certain "go to" pedals or settings.
From what I've read, this console is twangy by nature. And since there are a lot of experienced players on this forum, I thought I would just put it out there again .
Any ideas would be much appreciated
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1952 Fender Custom / Princeton '65 / National Tricone / Strymon pedals / Logic X /

Chris Bauer · From: Nashville, TN USA

Never being one to avoid the risk of asking the obvious... Have you tried simply rolling off the treble a bit on the guitar? If they're working correctly, those trapazoid pickups are some of the warmest and thinkest-sounding pickups ever made.

Aaron Jennings · From: Montana, USA

Welcome to the forum Philip!

Those trapezoid pickups when functioning properly should not come through as 'thin', with the age of these guitars and the unique design of the trapezoid pickup it is highly likely that your pickups need some attention - and that the magnets may need to get 'zapped'

There have been many posts about similar issues with these guitars - they all seem to need some love after 60+ years.

Here are some interesting threads that might be helpful:

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=2315033#2315033

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=270712

Good luck!

Philip Garcia · From: California, USA

Hi Chris, thanks I tried rolling off the treble, and it just gets muffled, but very badly. The mid and treb just dissapears. But if you say the trapezoids are some of the warmest and thickest ever made. That gives me hope.

Aaron, awww! Thank you! you pointed out some great links. I'm so grateful for this forum. And I think this baby needs some good TLC from an experienced tech. Now is there anyone in California?
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1952 Fender Custom / Princeton '65 / National Tricone / Strymon pedals / Logic X /

Chris Bauer · From: Nashville, TN USA

Lest I forget again to say it, welcome to the forum, Philip!

Yes, I would get your guitar to someone who knows those pickups well. Unfortunately they aren't always easy or inexpensive to make right but worth every penny when they sound like they should. Those trapazoid pickups, when working right, sound amazing.

I'd also have the rest of the electronics checked out just to be sure there aren't problems elsewhere either in addition or instead. I'd be surprised from what you're describing if there are other issues but I certainly wouldn't rule it out without having a competent tech give the whole guitar a look.

(BTW - when working right, they can still be a little trebly so, once again, rolling some treble off may once again be helpful at that point.)

Norman Evans · From: Tennessee

At 0:27 seconds in this video, look at Chris Scruggs settings on a Fender Deluxe Reverb amp.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuAchSYA6Xo

Philip Garcia · From: California, USA

Thanks Chris, you said it right. This is my darling and my first real steel guitar, I'll be sure to take her to the right experienced doctor to get the full physical.

Norman, thanks for the Chris Scruggs link. I probably watched that video 10 times this year. Love his tone.

Now after the maintenance is done. I'm sure you guys aren't just plugging in straight? Or maybe you do. What kind of pedal compressors do you recommend to even out the dynamics? Or am I just getting lazy now. ha.
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1952 Fender Custom / Princeton '65 / National Tricone / Strymon pedals / Logic X /

Rick Bernauer · From: Kansas, USA

Norman - thanks for that link to the interview with Chris Scruggs. (Interesting amp settings). Philip welcome to the forum. At 6:25 in the interview Chris plays with great tone and slant precision that is inspiring and depressing all at the same time. Enjoy

Jack Hanson · From: San Luis Valley, USA

Chris Bauer · From: Nashville, TN USA

The sound you're after is fully in a 'pedal-free' zone.

Guitar -> volume pedal -> amp. Maybe a little amp reverb if you like. I know a few players who use a little delay BUT that's never a factor in their tone. In fact, most will tell you that the like their tone better without the delay but would rather gain a little more depth or thickness by using it.

I'm not sure who the non-pedal players are that you admire but - if they're traditional players as opposed to modern rockers - I'd give a good listen who whomever they are and my money says that most or all used no effects and certainly not compressors.

Joe Burke · From: Toronto, Canada

Hi Philip - I'm going through the exact same thing! I play a custom triple through a reissue Princeton, and find the higher notes are too piercing/trebly. After watching the Chris Scruggs video, I rented a deluxe reissue and found I got a much warmer/mellowerer sound. Maybe your steel is fine, it's just not paired with the right amp?

Bill Creller · From: Saginaw, Michigan, USA (deceased)

I have a '54 Dual Pro with that same trebly tone that I really hate !
Several amps to use it in, including a Fender Vibrosonic Reverb. It's about the same in all my amps.
Just had one pickup re-wound, and that one sounds exactly like the other one, so that part is likely OK.
I'll have to experiment some more...
Actually I would like to sell it ! I'm not a Fender guy, but had a Stringmaster that was OK, & should not have sold it !

Stefan Robertson · From: Hertfordshire, UK

I think most importantly

Roll the tone down - until it sounds jazzy
Try basil's Ezee slide bar - apparently its smoother sounding and warmer
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Stefan
Bill Hatcher custom 12 string Lap Steel Guitar
E13#9/F secrets: https://thelapsteelguitarist.wordpress.com

"Give it up for The Lap Steel Guitarist"

David M Brown · From: California, USA

Blake Hawkins · From: Florida

If your Custom T8 still has the original factory wiring, then the position of the volume control will affect the tone. It is similar to an old Rickenbacker circuit.
Try this: With the tone control in the full treble position and the volume on the guitar wide open,
adjust your amp for flat response and a comfortable volume. Listen to the sound and then decrease the control on the guitar to a half then a quarter, using the amp volume to keep the level constant. You should hear a change in the sound.
When I first got my T8, that upset me a lot.
There is a simple modification, moving one wire which will improve the volume control action. If desired.
Also check the value of the original tone cap. On mine plus some others that I've worked on, the value of the cap has increased over the years with a resultant change of tone.

Philip Garcia · From: California, USA

Thank you all for the input and sharing your pain, along with great solutions for getting the best sound out of this lovely instrument in combination with amp and hardware maintenance. I see that I'm not the only one.
I've been involved in music all my life, but never felt this much family love from the steel pickers here. Thank you all.
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1952 Fender Custom / Princeton '65 / National Tricone / Strymon pedals / Logic X /

J Fletcher · From: London,Ont,Canada

Hi Philip
It's a struggle to get a nice sound out of any steel guitar , especially if you have only been playing a year. You might need to concentrate on left and right hand techniques to bring out that sound you are looking for.

Don Kona Woods · From: Hawaiian Kama'aina

Rather than a steel bar try a TriboTone Bar or a non steel bar. That will also soften the tone.

Rick Aiello · From: Berryville, VA USA

"I seem to mainly get a thin, twangy and harsh trebly sound. I'd like to be able to get more of a warm, sweet tone."

Check the DC resistance with a multimeter ... each should be around 10 kOhm

What you are describing sounds like capacitance coupling ...

Those old string thru units have a couple of serious flaws ... One of which is the cardboard "bobbin" warping and breaking the magnet wire somewhere in the coil ...

DC signal won't get through ... But because of capacitance coupling ... An AC signal is still produced ... Albeit thin and trebly ...

If that is indeed the case ... Have it (them) rewound /rebuilt (If bobbin is faulty) by someone who knows how to do those ... they are tough to do correctly .. a remag won't hurt either ... Mr. Green

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

Jerry Byrd's answer was don't play a Fender.

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