How Many People Use Sneaky Pete's Copedent?

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

in another topic, Jim Sliff wrote:

Jerry Hayes · From: Virginia Beach, Va.

b0b, I use pretty much the same tuning as that but, I use it on a lap steel, no pedals. I don't think I'd ever have a pedal steel with just that tuning, it'd have to be on a double neck, maybe a Fender 1000. As a single neck only, it'd be much to limiting to cover all the bases.......JH in Va.
_________________
Don't matter who's in Austin (or anywhere else) Ralph Mooney is still the king!!!

Connie Mack · From: phoenicia, new york

i've been going through another sneaky pete session over the last two weeks where i keep listening to his playing over and over again. not because i'm trying to learn anything but just cause it is so enjoyable. just totally from left field but ever so tasteful and interesting. i have often wondered about playing it. i've got too much on my plate to attempt it these days, but maybe one day. i hope more folks chime in on this.
_________________
82'sho-bud u-12, frankendekely u-12, bride of frankendekley u-12, a whole mess of other instruments...finger still messed up but getting better...

Kevin Hatton · From: Buffalo, N.Y.

The man was a genius.

Don Walters · From: Saskatchewan Canada

Oklahoma Stomp has always been one of my favourite instrumentals for steel. When I first heard it by Sneaky Pete it blew me away! Awesome timing and control at a breakneck speed.

ebb · From: nj

i think you left out the reference that it was in the context of 8 string fender pedal steels.
in any case what is your point?
i think any artist who has had the undeniable success of sneaky pete should have their tools examined.
after all emmons tool has dominated where his discography hasnt in comparison to sneakys unless you intend to limit yourself to a specific genre.
i love emmons too but what are you trying to prove?

Russ Tkac · Posted 29 Mar 2009 7:03 pm

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

ebb · From: nj

ebb · From: nj

if you analyze copedents in terms of harmonic functionality rather than key bases you will see very little difference and very little reason to have a lot of these discussions

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

OK b0b, I'll bite.

I'm surprised to see the webmaster start a thread with such baiting comments. Is there some kind of dire need to prove it to be a wrong statement, or call me a liar? Just like calling it a "reverse universal, which got your undies twisted because "universal" in pedal steel context has "rules" - and adapting the term breaks the rules. Heavens! Can't have that, can we?

b0b - I run the Fender steel forum. It's a small forum with limited activity, but growing nicely. I get 5-10 emails a week from members (or Steel Guitar Forum members) looking for advice on 1) finding playable Fender steels, and 2) setting them up once they have them.

2/3 of the setup questions concern B6, not at my prompting, although when I am asked, I DO suggest it to 6-string players transitioning to steel via a Fender...because they have a thing for vintage instruments...and for a 6-stringer it's an easy tuning to grasp, as is the copedent. Most E9 players I recommend various E9 or D9 versions since they're used to them, although many of those are specifically asking about B6 and "shorthand" versions for 4 or 6 pedal guitars.

Other players seem to send folks to me for advice on these guitars - not because 'm any great shakes as a player, but because I've built 3 from various loose parts and modified half a dozen of so others (plus serviced a few personally and "talk-teched" my way through repairs or mods with a couple dozen players by phone or email).

So I think I have a decent handle on what's out there, including many players who have never visited either forum (there are many, many guitar players and other musicians that do not frequent internet forums) but have been referred to me.

B6 is *one* of the popular tunings, and simply because of Sneaky Pete, whose name is pretty familiar in the country-rock and alt-country circles, plus in much of the classic rock world. To many players in those genres, he's the only player's name they are familiar with, and I can't count how many times I've corrected the impression he played the steel parts on the Byrds Sweetheart of the Rodeo (all the members of my current band, guys in their 40's & 50's thought that was the case).

So what I've found is Fender players coming from traditional steel usually want some type of E9 or D9 - if not that, they want B6 and very rarely "normal" C6.

A few try the A6 in the Fender manual but don't stay with it long.

Players coming TO steel for the first time via Fender seem to gravitate to B6, some instead choosing E9. Many of those players, though, get run off by 10-string E9 players who insist they are "crippled" by the lack of chromatic strings, the need for modification to add absolutely critical knee levers, the lack of double-raise and lowers...so if they stay with the Fender they switch to B6, usually because they can find guys who can support them with it (many of us on the mechanical/setup/mod end, and the absolute genius Ed Bierly who posts tab in B6 pretty much on request.

Ben Jones · From: Seattle, Washington, USA

I am trying B6th with Sneaky Petes copedant out now on a fender 1000. Its pretty cool Cool

edit: not my "main axe" tho

Sneaky Pete counts for a couple dozen players just buy himself dont he?

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Are all B6th players so touchy? Winking

I'm asking a serious question here. I think that if beginners are asking "How do you tune a Fender 400?" and B6th with E9th pedals is being represented as a "popular" choice, there should be a lot of responses from people who play B6th.

To me, it looks like a very powerful, versatile copedent. Perhaps it is the wave of the future - I don't know. All I know is that I've never seen a guitar tuned to it, or heard anyone other than Sneaky Pete play it.

Compare that with the perennially "unpopular" Bb6th advanced in the same era by Maurice Anderson. Reece is hardly a household name - he doesn't have nearly as many recording credits of Sneaky Pete - but I know several pro players who use a variation of his copedent on their main axe, for all kinds of music.

There must be more than a few people using Sneaky Pete's copedent. So far, how many have chimed in? Three? Jim Sliff, Ed Bierly and Ben Jones. That's a good start.
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

ebb · From: nj

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

J Fletcher · From: London,Ont,Canada

I seem to remember a post from Tommy Spurlock saying he was switching over to Sneaky Pete's B6th tuning. A few years ago as I recall. Mr Spurlock played on the great Arthur Alexander's last recording. "Lonely Just Like Me" I think it's called. A plug for a great CD...Jerry
Oh..I see that EBB mentioned Tommy Spurlock

Russ Tkac · Posted 30 Mar 2009 5:14 am

Hi b0b,

I'm no player but use the B6 Fender tuning with the 9 pedals and no knee levers. You can hear Yesterday in the B6. I also have a version of Sneaky's song Sister but it was done with my modified E9 tuning. I'll have to figure out how to post it. Three guys or more who cares? It is the player that makes the tuning and Sneaky did that better than most.

Ben Jones · From: Seattle, Washington, USA

Sneaky sounds really unique to me. I know alot of that is the player but surely some of that uniqueness comes from the tuning and the instrument. As you all said, no one else tunes like that right?

In the context Jim used the word popular, i think it applies. Its a popular tuning for fender 400 users. In a literall sense? maybe not, but thats kinda just nit picky semantics to me.

Jerry Hayes · From: Virginia Beach, Va.

Nitpickin' and touchy thread here, eh? Anyway, Russ T, what did you get by posting that list of folks Pete recorded with? I probably have the same list somewhere and it doesn't have anything to do with what I said about his setup being too limiting...

I guess I should have added "In my playing situations" it'd be too limiting. I was a working lead guitarist when I took up steel and have always looked at the steel guitar from a six stringer's position. I've always wanted to be able to do most things I do on lead guitar on pedal steel and Pete's copedant won't do it for me. How would you do "Pretty Woman" (the opening riff) with it, or "Memphis", or even Together again with the correct voicings?

In one band I even had to do the notorious "Smoke On The Water" lick with distortion. Do that on Pete's guitar, it's not there. Pete's setup is OK if you've got other lead instrument(s) in the band to cover what your limited range can't.

All that said, I am a fan of his playing and have been for more years than I'd like to count. He was a great player and played like no one else. I loved his work on "Blackbird" on the Suite Steel album. That was beautiful in it's simplicity which IMHO was one of Pete's talents. As Earnest B. said, "It was in the notes he played" which really says it all. His entrance into the SGHOF was long overdue and I just wish he'd made it earlier so he could have enjoyed it before he passed away.....

Some have compared B-Bender Teles to someone trying to sound like a steel guitar but ol' Pete had that ability to make his Fender sound like Clarence White, Bob Warford, or other Bender players. He had that distict touch to play what the song needed.

But once again, it wouldn't work for me as most of my playing over the years and to this day is usually as the only lead in the band so with my 12 string with 8 & 5, I can get all the low or high notes needed............JH in Va.
_________________
Don't matter who's in Austin (or anywhere else) Ralph Mooney is still the king!!!

Russ Tkac · Posted 30 Mar 2009 7:48 am

Jerry,

I just find it funny that B6 lap steel is fine but add 9 pedals and 2 KLS and it's too limiting. I'm glad your 12 string works for you and please forgive me but if I had to play "Smoke on the Water" on steel I'd have to find something else to do with my time. Smile

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Okay, not counting Jerry's non-pedal tuning, I now know of 5 people playing this popular copedent: Jim Sliff, Ed Bierly, Ben Jones, Russ Tkac and Tommy Spurlock. There are probably a lot of people who have it on a 2nd or 3rd guitar that they play now and then.

Thanks for pointing to that song, Russ. It's a lovely rendition, and it really showcases the "baritone" nature of Sneaky Pete's B6th copedent.
_________________
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video

Mike Bagwell · From: Greenville, SC, USA

b0b

Your buddy Steve Gambrell plays a 400 tuned to B6 with 9 pedals. I think it was set up by Jim Sliff. He falls into that guitar player/steel player area that Jim mentioned.

Mike

ebb · From: nj

i often tune the bottom string down to E for particular tunes

Forum Index > Pedal Steel	Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4 Next	Next oldest topic :: Next newest topic