GFI players,..come on in...Again (New vid, pg. 4- 4/25/10)

Dale Hansen · From: Hendersonville,Tennessee, (USA)

I've noticed lately that there is a whole new crop of GFI'ers on the Forum.
About a year ago, I posted a little performance enhancer that is an easy, inexpensive "do it yourself" project. And, even better,.. you don't have to take anything apart to do it.

I bought a GFI guitar, about a year ago. It always was a very good playing guitar to begin with, and I don't want to risk offending Gene by giving a false impression that his product is lacking, in any way.
but, me being me, it's not in my nature to leave anything alone, if I see an opportunity to make a small modification to better suit me.

The one thing that I did notice, is that it did clatter, and rattle underneath, a bit more than I would have liked. My main concern was that this might transmit to a recording. At first, I tried the foam finger route. That worked very well on my Emmons, but tended to drag on the rods too much for the GFI, not allowing everything to operate smoothly. And besides, it didn't help the noise.
When I realized that the majority of the rattle was coming from the brass connectors at the bellcranks, I found some small nylon washers to eliminate some of the play in them. Not only did they work well for quieting things down under there considerably, but they also improved the already great feel of the guitar, by eliminating wasted motion in orienting the rod, to the direction of the pull. The pulls are all more positive, and direct, therefore greatly enhancing the performance.

The materials needed are: Roughly 20 nylon washers per neck. a side cutter. and a small forceps.

These are the washers. They usually come in packs of four, and can be found at Home Depot, or Lowe's. They are smaller than a dime, and a little thinner too. The hole in the center should be 1/4 inch. (You can test it for size, with a 1/4 inch bolt.)

Then, take a side cutter, and take a "slice of pie" out of them, so you can just clip them right on.
The forceps will be a great help in the tighter spots, cluttered with rods.

(Special thanks to my neighbor, for the loan of the dime.)

Now, with guitar flipped, you'll notice that the brass connectors, where the rods thread through, are kinda shaped like little shotgun primers. You want to place the nylon washer between the flared end, and the bellcrank. Not on the rod side.

If one is too tight, and doesn't allow any play at all, remove it, and sand it down with some 400, or 600 grit. Even a fine flat file will do it. Make sure that things don't get too tight, or it'll bind things up.

There were a couple places that had enough play to receive two of these nylon washers. In one instance I used about a nickle sized, thicker washer to do the job. (1/4 inch hole, again)

(This one has two)

(larger, thicker washer)

I have a one time offer for somebody who acts quickly.
I've got a set pre-cut, and ready to go,(enough for 1 neck) that I'll give you for the asking. I can send them for the price of a single stamp, so it's no big deal. It's a set that I had made up for Charlie Whitten, and had been carrying them in my glove compartment to give to him. When I called him a week later,( last spring) he'd already gone out and bought a bunch, and installed them. I forgot that I still had em' until just today.

Good luck to all of you lucky GFI'ers.

Your pal, Dale

Curt Langston · Posted 26 Apr 2008 1:26 pm

Well Dale, I'd love to have them, if nobody has beat me to the puch!

Dale Hansen · From: Hendersonville,Tennessee, (USA)

obsolete...

Dale Hansen · From: Hendersonville,Tennessee, (USA)

Just another quick, fun little thing here.
I always have had colored fretboards on all my other guitars.
When I began playing the new GFI last year, I had some trouble with staying oriented on the neck, because of the all white fret markers. I took some colored highlighter pens and colored in the white patterns. If you ever need to do so, they'll wipe right off with a little alcohol, and return to their original pristine white. I used green on all of the clovers, yellow on the horse shoes below the 5th, and 17th frets, and blue on the horse shoes just above the 8th, and 20th frets.
You may have to go over them a few times to get a good depth of color. This does help a lot to make things very visible, and easier, (for me, at least) to keep tabs on where I'm at.

Steve Norman · From: Seattle Washington, USA

how do the fret markers show up under stage lights? I wanted to color mine,, but was worried I wouldnt be able to see mine on a dark stage..
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GFI D10, Fender Steel King, Hilton Vpedal,BoBro, National D dobro, Marrs RGS

Richard Damron · From: Gallatin, Tennessee, USA (deceased)

Dale -

Took your advice concerning the nylon washers when you originally posted it. Silence is golden! However, I didn't cut a notch in the washer but, rather, just made a single cut on the radius. Takes more effort to install them but I feel better with the washer completely surrounding the brass connectors. Don't be bashful about any other neat ideas you may have!

Your blue instrument is certainly beautiful but I'm naturally partial to the elegance of my black and gold. Does it play any better? NOT WITH THESE HANDS!

Respectfully,

Richard

Brett Day · From: Pickens, SC

Dale, I love my red & gold GFI Ultra D-10. I nicknamed the steel "Redgold Beauty" because the colors make the steel beautiful and my GFI sounds wonderful through a Peavey Nashville 112.

Brett

Curt Langston · Posted 27 Apr 2008 3:59 am

Many thanks, Dale!
I sent you an email.

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

I have not noticed any looseness or other issues with my Ultra, but the nylon washer looks like a great idea. I'll probably put them on mine as well when I can get time to make them.
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No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional

Dale Hansen · From: Hendersonville,Tennessee, (USA)

I've got some catching up to do here.
We've got a problem with too many horses, and not enough pasture, so I've been out grazing them all day.

Steve Norman:
I honestly don't know. I've always run across a problem with certain lighting situations, and color combinations washing out the colors on the fretboard of the Emmons that I played previously. These highlight colors seem to stand out a little bit more to me, and although I haven't had this guitar under any colored lights, I still feel like some chance, is still better than no chance at all.

Richard Damron:
I'm thrilled to know that you even tried it at all. I didn't know that anyone had even noticed that old thread. One other fella, Bob Tuttle, in San Angelo, TX put them on his guitar, and reported back to me with a very good result.
Did you also note a better feel, and more deliberate action on the pulls?

Curt Langston:
May you be blessed with many, many good years of playing with your new GFI. I hope that the mod kit gives you an added benefit. It's on the way to you.

Brett Day:
What can I even say to you. Your now infamous "Redgold beauty" has joined the ranks of notoriety, such as Buddy's "Blade", and Jimmy Day's "Blue Darlin'." You are a great contributor to the Forum, and we all appreciate your efforts. You are well known for being able to give the accurate facts on who plays what, on what equipment, with who, and whatever they ate for breakfast on the morning that they played an outstanding steel ride on a record.
I think that it's high time that you had a nickname around here. I kinda like "Wickie", for Wikipedia. Or, we could just call you "Wick" for short. Doesn't that have a nice roll, and ring to it? (voice of Dewitt Scott) "And now folks, here he is, in the flesh, "Wick" Day!..., from Greer, S.C.!" (roar of applause)
I just bought a Nashville 112, as a matter of fact. If I'm lucky, I'll meet up with you somewhere, and get you to autograph it for me.

Jim Sliff:
You scare the hell out of me, quite frankly.
I've always liked the fact that you speak your mind openly, but I do worry at times, about inadvertently getting put on your hit list.
Just kiddin'. I really hope that you find a benefit from trying the bushings.

Thanks to all of you for jumping in here.

Your pal, Dale

Richard Damron · From: Gallatin, Tennessee, USA (deceased)

Dale -

I had those washers on my D10 within a week of reading your original post. I apologize for not having given you at least a modicum of feedback.

For those contemplating Dale's oh-so-simple addition/modification, here's my assessment: There is a certain amount of "free-play" in the area of the pullrod/bushing/bellcrank interface. It manifests itself in just a smidgen of "oh-my-gosh, nothing is happening" accompanied by an almost imperceptable, but annoying "click". No offense, Gene, cause I LOVE your guitar. The insertion of the washers and at the location Dale specifies virtually eliminates any semblance of the above described condition. And yes, there is an immediate positive feel to the action of pedals and levers. Understand, everyone, the phrase "manufacturing tolerances" and know that Gene Fields has settled upon tolerances that are quite acceptable for the purpose at hand. To attempt to approach true precision would add considerably to the cost of the instrument - assuming that precision were truly necessary - which it is not. Dale's simple mod reduces the tolerances in favor of a smoother and more "accurate" action. The upshot of my "assessment" quite succinctly is: Don't hesitate - do it! It only costs a couple of bucks and a little time to eliminate a minor irritation.

Brett -

What can I add to that which Dale has already written. Not a thing. Should we ever meet, I'll ask you to autograph the underside of my "Blackgold monster" - unless we can find a white magic marker! In the meantime, I'll join Dale in coming up with an appropriate and acceptable nickname for you. You're a treasure to the forum.

Respectfully,

Richard

Dale Hansen · From: Hendersonville,Tennessee, (USA)

Richard,

I think that it's a terrible thing that we live so close, and have not met yet. We need to remedy that. Thanks so much for your bold endorsement of the mod kit. I was really worried about offending Gene, by promoting the idea, and perhaps giving a mistaken impression that these guitars that he builds are less than satisfactory. They're not, at all. After all, I'm a push-pull convert. Gene was even kind enough to bring to Nashville, and hand deliver to a local dealer, a set of 1" inch shorter legs, and rods just for my guitar. I will never speak poorly of him, or his guitars.

Regarding your experience, I'm so glad to hear of your good results with it.

Please give me a call, I'll either come over there, or, you're more than welcome to drop by here. I'm over on Long Hollow Pike.

Your pal, Dale
(615) 618-0776

Charlie D Whitten · From: Mt.Juliet, TN.

Hello Dale, Thanks again for making them for me. I'm glad someone else will recieve the benefit of your effort. This is a great idea. Thanks, Charlie Whitten

Richard Damron · From: Gallatin, Tennessee, USA (deceased)

Dale -

Thanks for the note. We WILL remedy the situation about our meeting.

I live on Brazier Lane, just above the cemetary off of 109. I think this is just great. We're neighbors after all.

Richard

615-451-2030

We will be in touch!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Twayn Williams · From: Portland, OR

I'm trying this mod as soon as I get a free afternoon! I've got to admit, I just got used to the slight amount of "clack" and stopped hearing it.

Does anyone have any experience with adding pedals and knee levers to an Ultra?
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Primitive Utility Steel

Ernie Pollock · From: Mt Savage, Md USA

I bet that would help quiet the Economy model down a little bit, might try that on one of those guitars.

Ernie Shocked

Dale Hansen · From: Hendersonville,Tennessee, (USA)

Charlie, you're always welcome. I hope you can get freed up enough to come out again soon.

Richard, I enjoyed our phone visit, and look forward to meeting you too.

Twayn, I did move some things around under there, and it is easy to do on these guitars. I swapped out the knees on the 3rd, and 4th strings on the C6th neck, because I'm used to the C lowering on the RKR. When I did that, I also engaged the 1/2 stop with it in order to improve the feel on my E9th 1/2 stop, making it more positive. Now, my 3rd on the C6th is lowering fully for the usual change at the 1/2 stop, and I can take it to a full step if I want to.
It sounds odd, but there are some real neat possibilities with lowering a full tone on that string. As far as adding levers, what did you want to add? A vertical? That will be fairly simple and I can give you a measure for placement of the lever. You'll need two long rods, about 25 in. one at about 10 in., three bellcranks. Unfortunately, you may need to install another crossrod near the 6th pedal, if its not there already.

Ernie, I'll bet that the "econo" models all have the same guts as the rest of em'. Send me a shot of your undercarriage, and I'll tell you for sure. I'll bet it does.

Thanks,
DH

Steve Norman · From: Seattle Washington, USA

This may be off topic, and not trying to highjack,,

On my ultra my rkl comes back sharp, and hitting the B ped will pull it back close to in tune. Did any of you guys encounter this? I wonder if the washers might fix this or if they would make it worse.
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GFI D10, Fender Steel King, Hilton Vpedal,BoBro, National D dobro, Marrs RGS

Brint Hannay · From: Maryland, USA

Steve, what does your RKL do?

If it's a sixth string lower that comes back sharp, that happens on almost every guitar. There's been some debate about the precise reason(s) for it, but I think it's safe to say that it's not a mechanical issue, but an inherent foible in the physical properties of the string being bent over the nut that can't be eliminated if it's there.

If it's something else, never mind! Smile

Len Amaral · From: Rehoboth,MA 02769

Hi Dale:

On the picture of your blue Ultra, is that a music stand clipped to the front of the guitar and if so where did you aquire it? Looks cool!

Lenny

Steve Norman · From: Seattle Washington, USA

Thats it Brint,,glad to know its not just me!
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GFI D10, Fender Steel King, Hilton Vpedal,BoBro, National D dobro, Marrs RGS

Dale Hansen · From: Hendersonville,Tennessee, (USA)

Steve,.. Yup, mine does that too. The bushing won't help for curing that, but it won't hurt either. I'd better qualify that. The bushing could cause a problem if it's too tight of a fit, and creates a bind on the assembly. I need to remind everybody here once again, that a tiny amount of play is crucial, for the best results.
I think that Brint is right on with this one. It's a common annoyance, for many players, on many types of guitars. Its usually not very obnoxious, at least for me. If your guitar is returning extremely sharp, you might try giving the spring at the changer one turn, and see if that helps. It's possible that there isn't quite enough tension on it. I'd also check it with a tuner before, and after tightening the spring, and see if there's any difference.
Keep us posted on your findings, and progress, ok?

Your pal, Dale

Steve Norman · From: Seattle Washington, USA

Thanks Dale,,will do,,

I think I need one of those music holders also
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GFI D10, Fender Steel King, Hilton Vpedal,BoBro, National D dobro, Marrs RGS

Bent Romnes · From: London,Ontario, Canada

Dale, This seems like a brilliant and simple idea to me.
I have a steel buddy in Norway, Gustav Haugedal is his name. He plays a GFI Ultra. I will get hold of some plastic washers and cut them to shape and bring them with me when I go to visit him in July...just in case he needs them.

I love great ideas like this one.
Thanks for sharing
Bent

Tim Konecky · From: Lincoln, Nebraska, USA

Will this only work on the Pro GFI models? I've got a GFI SM-10 on the way and may end up trying this if it turns out that it "clanks" alot.

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