CMA Awards--Big & Rich

Mark Metdker · Post by **Mark Metdker** » 11 Nov 2004 8:29 am

I'll tell you what I hate. We will go play a dance hall where the there is a younger clientele. When the live bands play, you will see some people dancing, but not everyone. But, when the band takes a break, the DJ will immediately play rap songs, and the dance floor is packed! Everyone is dancing to that crap. It's enough to make you want to go hock your guitar and amp and start working on cars in your spare time.

Bill Terry · Post by **Bill Terry** » 11 Nov 2004 9:14 am

I didn't see Big and Rich on TV the other night, but an old friend James Pennebaker is currently playing steel, guitar, fiddle and banjo (and maybe some other stuff).

Say what you want about their music, but they sure know how to hire a sideman.. James is one of the best players and nicest guys you'll ever work with.

Janice Brooks · Post by **Janice Brooks** » 11 Nov 2004 3:36 pm

I watched the other version of reality on FOX where the president of Virgin had a tea party on top of an air balloon.

As for what we hate we must consider folks on this forum who work for Big and Rich.

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Janice "Busgal" Brooks
ICQ 44729047

Don Joslin · Post by **Don Joslin** » 12 Nov 2004 5:17 am

Amen Janice! I've said it before and I'll say it again. I would wager that most of the people flaming B&R haven't taken the time to listen to their entire CD. Their only impression is 'Save a Horse' or maybe the first single 'Wild West Show' which is not a bad country rock tune. Whether you believe it or not B&R are pretty fair songwriters. They write with/for Martina McBride, Gretchen Wilson (John Rich co-wrote 'When I Think About Cheatin'), and a number of others. Listen to the whole B&R CD (called 'Horse of a Different Color' - that should tell you that this ain't your Daddy's country music) and then show me something YOU have written that is on par with 'Holy Water' (just released as a single) or 'Deadwood Mountain' and I'll eat every one of my words. Sheesh...everybody's a critic.

Don

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My favorite baseball team is the Minnesota Twins...
-------- ...my second favorite is whoever is playing the Yankees!

Delvin Morgan · Post by **Delvin Morgan** » 12 Nov 2004 5:24 am

Tim Harr, hit it right on the head. They have the nerve to call this new crap "country". I have listened to country music all my life, 50 some odd years, but I quit tuning in the so called "country stations" about 5 years ago. At least the marketing people haven't screwed up the steel guitar sound,YET.

My $.02
Del

Jerry Hayes · Post by **Jerry Hayes** » 12 Nov 2004 5:33 am

Well I guess I'm in a minority here as I think Big and Rich are pretty cool. I'm not a kid either, I'll turn 65 in January. I agree with what someone said about the category. I think it's time that country started being categorized like rock music is ie. Classic, Heavy Metal, Country, New Wave, Punk, etc. It'd be great to have radio stations such as Classic Country, New Country, Rockin' Country, Rappin' country, etc. I love that Big & Rich cut "Why Does Everybody Want to Kick my Ass". That's about as country as anything out there right now. Isn't John Rich a fiddle player, it seems as I've seen him playing for some major star but I can't remember who it was. All in all, I like those guys and enjoyed their performance and most of the CMA show. The thing I really didn't agree with was Kenny Chesney winning the Entertainer of the Year Award against that other competition. He was my last choice of all the nominees...Have a good 'un, JH

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Livin' in the Past and Future with a 12 string Mooney Universal tuning.

James Pennebaker · Post by **James Pennebaker** » 12 Nov 2004 9:20 am

My better judgement tells me to keep my trap shut and not chime in on this subject. However, I will wager that those of you who bash Big & Rich have not heard the entire CD. And I am pretty certain you won't rush out and buy it. (Not to worry. Almost two million other people already have.) When I got the call for the job, all I knew about them was "Save A Horse." What the hell was I getting into, I thought. Then I listened to the whole record and it's cool! But I grew up with The Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Hendrix, the whole "Woodstock Generation." as well as Buck Owens, Merle Haggard and Milton Brown and Bob Wills (I'm from Ft, Worth, TX. Swing is in my blood). Not to mention that I studied classical violin for 12 plus years of my youth. It all made me pretty musically non predjudiced. Now, I must say this Big & Rich gig is a blast as it has elements of all the aformentioned stuff I grew up on (with the exception of classical music). I'm having a ball. I wake up in a different town every day while some who would criticise are still at home in their bedrooms trying to play "Mansion On The Hill." And that's fine. I'm still learning too. And everybody is entitled to their own opinion.

Just so you'll know, the song with the "rapper" that was performed on the CMA show was chosen by the CMA. They specifically requested that we do that selection. Big & Rich CD's are flying off the shelves and they realize that. There's a lot of young people (teenegers) who are buying those CD's and those are the record buyers of the future. Like it or not, B&R are bringing new record buyers to the country market. Maybe, just maybe, some of those kids will discover Merle, Buck or Bob Wills. If there's enough of them, some of them definitely will. Some of you closed minded people can't see that. All you know how to do is bitch about what you don't like.

JP[This message was edited by James Pennebaker on 12 November 2004 at 09:23 AM.][This message was edited by James Pennebaker on 12 November 2004 at 10:17 AM.]

Gaylon Mathews · Post by **Gaylon Mathews** » 12 Nov 2004 10:32 am

While I sit in a dressing room right next door to James Pennebaker and John Rich who are currently reading all these posts about Big & Rich, I wonder how many of you know who Mike Johnson is. I also wonder for those that do know who he is, would it change your mind and cause you to run out and buy their album when you find out that he played some of the coolest steel on this album that I've heard in a while? Probably not. You don't know what you are missing. OK, Now on to the real reason I'm replying to this post...Jesse Harris, I'm not sure what you're getting at with the slam on "The Dwarf" on stage, but his name is Fred...Two Foot Fred to be exact, and he is one of the nicest, coolest guys you'd ever want to meet. He's not forced to do this by any stretch of the imagination. He is as big of a celebrity to some of these fans as Big Kenny or John Rich. Last night he was out in the cold riding his electric wheelchair back and forth in front of the busses signing autographs for folks that included several children in the 10-15 year range who loved him. As little as he is, there are those that look up to him as he is a great inspiration to everyone who comes in contact with him. I don't think his presence on stage is meant to be comic as you have implied but to be entertaining, which he does well. I hardly ever post to a thread that is controversial in nature and never would have posted to this but I find it hard to swallow when someone demeans another because of a physical handicap. NOT COOL.

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Gaylon's Homepage
www.geocities.com/nashville/1064

Gretchen Wilson
www.gretchenwilson.com

Don Joslin · Post by **Don Joslin** » 12 Nov 2004 10:54 am

Gaylon, James & John (Big Kenny too if he's around) - Howdy from one of your biggest fans!!!!!

Don

Edit - It ain't just teenagers that are buying the CD. I turned 51 last Friday. The day that 'Horse of a Different Color' was released I was waiting at the door when the store opened. I probably bought the first copy sold in Minneapolis. Think I'll go listen right now!

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My favorite baseball team is the Minnesota Twins...
-------- ...my second favorite is whoever is playing the Yankees![This message was edited by Don Joslin on 12 November 2004 at 11:27 AM.]

Jesse Harris · Post by **Jesse Harris** » 12 Nov 2004 11:48 am

hey Gaylon, why is the dwarf there?
its a freak show right?

does he play or sing or anything?

He's there because for some people, he is entertaining to look at due to his physical differences......right???????

whatever the choice of word it still amounts to freak show right????

I guess it would be the same thing as having dancers on the stage or something like that, but this just struck me to be in much poorer taste, its just the way it hit me man, I didnt invent my reaction so i could come up with this post. And lets be honest here, read my post again I wasnt slamming him at all, I was slamming the people who put him up there.

I listen to a wide array of stuff, I am a young guy, I love radiohead and a lot of stuff that would make a lot of people here cringe, and thats fine, but what i like have 2 things in common, some emotional connection musically, and also writers who come from a place of not thinking that they are kick ass!!!, I am sorry, that attitude just personally turns me off, especially in country music, I am turned off by the attitude of a lot of the newer country guys, the in your face, you cross me and ill kick you ass kind of attitude, I guess that has its history in country, waylon and such, but that attitude always turned me off. I think thats a prevailing attitude in this country and it bothers me. It seems to me that B&R are incooporating a lot of the rock stuff form the last 10 years, like Limp Bizkit and stuff like that. And that **** sold for days, but I always found it really obnoxious. And as others have said in this thread, this is a place to discuss music and its peripherals and thats what I am doing. And I am really tired of people claiming records sales as some defense of a certain group, all you have to do is look at the list fo people who generate big sales, Like Hillary Duff and Brittany Spears etc to know tht sale dont equate to good music. I don't claim to be any expert, I am just here venting my dissapointment and disbelief in how bad I felt B&R were, and even more so Montgomery Gentry, whoa what was that crap.....thats all, and I should have place to do that, and I thought this might be it, but if I am wrong about that them someone can let me know and we can go back to talking about copedants and spent strings.

Dale Bessant · Post by **Dale Bessant** » 12 Nov 2004 11:56 am

By the sounds of this thread Im glad I missed the show......!!!!!

Gaylon Mathews · Post by **Gaylon Mathews** » 12 Nov 2004 12:03 pm

Jesse,

Fred is here because he wants to be. He's not being forced.

"why didnt they just put someone up there that had thier arms and legs blown off and let em float in a kiddie pool, that would have been hilarious".....This is the statement that bothered me. However, if you meant nothing by it, then it's dropped. Hopefully it will make Fred feel a little better to know that you were not slamming him since all the Big & Rich guys are now watching this thread very closely in the next dressing room. I've had my say and I'll leave it alone now in hopes that this thread will not get heated and cause any hard feelings. Have a great day.

Oh, by the way, Fred does dance during the show.

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Gaylon's Homepage
www.geocities.com/nashville/1064

Gretchen Wilson
www.gretchenwilson.com

[This message was edited by Gaylon Mathews on 12 November 2004 at 12:05 PM.][This message was edited by Gaylon Mathews on 12 November 2004 at 12:07 PM.]

Bill Terry · Post by **Bill Terry** » 12 Nov 2004 12:31 pm

..some who would criticise are still at home in their bedrooms trying to play "Mansion On The Hill."

Ouch!!!! ...

Mark Metdker · Post by **Mark Metdker** » 12 Nov 2004 12:38 pm

James and Gaylon, you boys just made some pretty dang good points. You are right, the only judgement call I have made on Big and Rich is that one rap tune. I have not heard the rest of the CD. To judge a band on one tune probably ain't fair! I'm gonna listen to the rest of the cd.

I wish you boys nothing but the best. Hope ya'll are having fun out on the road. Gaylon, I am on my way to the American Airlines Center right now. We'll try to get 'em warmed up for you!

Rick Garrett · Post by **Rick Garrett** » 12 Nov 2004 12:50 pm

Hey man, Im one of those guys struggling to play mansion on the hill in my pool room BUT that don't make one bit of difference concerning my right or ability to give an opinion of a show that's supposed to be country! I also admit I formed my opinion of Big and Rich based on that one rap song. I haven't heard anything else (that I'm aware of) that they did. They may all be fine musicians and they may both be big and rich but the show I saw was not my kind of music. Now the dwarf was funny......oops, I meant to say entertaining!

Rick

Jesse Harris · Post by **Jesse Harris** » 12 Nov 2004 1:15 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>
"why didnt they just put someone up there that had thier arms and legs blown off and let em float in a kiddie pool, that would have been hilarious".....This is the statement that bothered me. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

i think I could have probably said it better than that, but my point was, how far would you have to go for the majority of people to find it in bad taste, and I am sure he isnt forced to do it, and i'm sure he is probably having a great time. i could find plenty of examples of people being knowingly exploited, maybe its a bad thing maybe not, hes the one who has to live with it, and I wont sit here and specualate about how this might have offended other dwarves or whatever, becuse that would just seem rediculous to me. And I wasnt really concerned for the dwarf himself I just thought I was super cheesy, but that was in line with my opinion of the music. I love the fact that these guys could be following this thread and probably laughing thier asses off, right to the bank, they obviously knew what would work and they ave cashed in on all the suckers that have, well let me say it this way, all the people that have tastes that are far different than mine, and in reality if they get enjoyment out of it then they arent suckers I guess, I mean it's really only the fanatics of music, which is a small minority, that would type this much about a band that they despise, i wonder if I would be as motivated to type this much about a band I liked?

Gaylon Mathews · Post by **Gaylon Mathews** » 12 Nov 2004 1:20 pm

Rick,

You are right. It has no bearing on your ability to judge whether or not a band is country. However, we are in Dallas at the American Airlines Center tomorrow night. If you'd like to be my guest and see the Gretchen Wilson-Big & Rich show first hand and meet 2 foot Fred, just drop me an email. According to my calculations, it's 97.67 miles and 1.53 hours from Tyler to Dallas. I'm not sure of show time. I understand that the Gretchen Wilson show is not in question but we are on the same show with Big & Rich and if you still don't like Big & Rich when it's over, perhaps you will enjoy Gretchen and all is not lost.

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Gaylon's Homepage
www.geocities.com/nashville/1064

Gretchen Wilson
www.gretchenwilson.com

[This message was edited by Gaylon Mathews on 12 November 2004 at 01:23 PM.]

Rick Garrett · Post by **Rick Garrett** » 12 Nov 2004 1:59 pm

Gaylon, thanks for such a generous offer. I appreciate that. I'll talk to my bride about that and send you an email.

Rick

Frank Parish · Post by **Frank Parish** » 12 Nov 2004 2:21 pm

It seems I read in a similar post just a week or so back that you may have the right to voice your opinion (free country and all of that) but you also have the right to keep your mouth shut.

Rick Garrett · Post by **Rick Garrett** » 12 Nov 2004 2:32 pm

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[This message was edited by Rick Garrett on 12 November 2004 at 02:35 PM.]

Lee Baucum · Post by **Lee Baucum** » 12 Nov 2004 3:25 pm

James & Gaylon - I understand you guys will be playing here in the southern tip of Texas. You'll be about a three minute drive from the Mexican border.

Stay on this side of the river!

By the way, I believe you'll be playing at Dodge Arena, which is a hockey arena. Don't forget your skates.

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"Once the game is over, the king and the pawn go back into the same box."

Lee, from South Texas
Down On The Rio Grande

Gaylon Mathews · Post by **Gaylon Mathews** » 12 Nov 2004 3:34 pm

Lee,

Yes, we will be in Hidalgo next week. Are you serious about "this side of the river"? We were thinking of crossing over just so we could say we've been to Mexico.

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Gaylon's Homepage
www.geocities.com/nashville/1064

Gretchen Wilson
www.gretchenwilson.com

Janice Brooks · Post by **Janice Brooks** » 12 Nov 2004 4:04 pm

For the record I have not bought the Big and Rich album but commend the folks making an honest living in its support.

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 12 Nov 2004 4:35 pm

I've heard the comment that we should hear the rest of B&R's album before we pass judgement on what we think of their music style. Well, I guess I'm missing something here. Few of us have even heard of Big and Rich. (Alot of us do not listen to new country very much anymore. I know, I know, I need to go to town once in awhile! HA!) Our first impression of them is a couple rap type songs on the radio, and this CMA show. Anyways, most people are not going to go spend $16 to see if the rest of the album is rap or not, or MAY have country on it. I think they have the cart in front of the horse.
A person would think that at a Country Music Awards show, they would have B&R put out a country song or two to show us the country goods, if that's what they are about. After all, isn't this a country show? I wouldn't tune in a rap show hoping to hear a country song, would you? So why the rap on a country show?(though it may be coming) I don't fault B&R for this, they are only doing their job to the best of their ability, and they are acomplished musicians. So how about it, higher-higher? What's the scoop?
As for me, after this thread, I will reserve my opinion as to whether I like B&R's music or not---after I hear the rest of the album! I'm a HUGE fan of the older style country. I am liking some of the newer acts that do new old style country. Two foot Fred is a part of their show. If the band likes him and their fans do, Fred earns his paycheck. It would be cool if Fred took up lap steel, though!

Don Joslin · Post by **Don Joslin** » 12 Nov 2004 6:09 pm

James -

You won't hear a lot of traditional country on the B&R CD. You will hear it's influences sprinkled throughout. What you will hear, in my opinion, is a successful effort to blend many different influences. There's even some classic jazz progressions ('Drinkin' 'bout You'). You will hear some soulful lyrics about the human tragedy ('Saved'). There's a haunting ballad called 'Live This Life'. All of this is mixed in with some playful and tongue-in-cheek humor. Make sure you read the lyrics while you listen.

Don

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My favorite baseball team is the Minnesota Twins...
-------- ...my second favorite is whoever is playing the Yankees![This message was edited by Don Joslin on 12 November 2004 at 06:10 PM.]