Watch out for this string popper!

Jim Phelps · Post by **Jim Phelps** » 27 Jun 2006 3:11 pm

And we are talking about the 3rd string G#'s tension and breaking points.

The 3rd string G# doesn't have a different set of physics than the other strings, Curt.

Rick Batey · Post by **Rick Batey** » 27 Jun 2006 3:14 pm

Thanks Curt, it's been a while since I broke out the Parsons/White Tele! Hang in there my friend

Ron ! · Post by **Ron !** » 27 Jun 2006 3:19 pm

Curt,I cannot see the benefit you will have by taking this to the max.You like Keyless and there are a lot of people that don't.Everybody has his own taste for things.I think it's best to respect people for what they want and know(I don't say that you disrespect people).
We are here on this forum to learn and teach about the steelguitar,because there are a lot of people that want to learn to play steel guitar.

Most of them don't want to pay a lot of money for something they might not ever learn.I understand when people say...let me try on a cheap one first.
BMI guiatrs are very well build and play great.The price is something that a newbie can afford.Your comments might scare people in buying a steel.

"Our steelguitar community is getting smaller every year"

We should do everything in our powers to encourage to pick up steel playing.Wether for fun or try to become a Pro.

Ron

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David Doggett · Post by **David Doggett** » 27 Jun 2006 3:44 pm

Thanks for trying, Rick. But it looks like we are still up against a brick wall of ... well of something. Curt, your "authority" Mike seems to have the same misguided ideas about string tension you do, with no better physical explanation. Can't say I agree with everything else he says either. Sorry, it sounds like the blind leading the blind. I trust the violin maker. He seems to know some real physics, and even suggests the proper experiment to settle the issue. Hang a force scale over the changer and see how much force it takes to pull the 3rd string up to G# (or any other string up to a given pitch). Check it out, and eat the crow your own self.

[This message was edited by David Doggett on 27 June 2006 at 04:45 PM.]

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 27 Jun 2006 3:45 pm

everything in our powers to encourage to pick up steel playing. Wether for fun or try to become a Pro.

Amen to becoming a pro musician! Music is a much safer vocation than civil engineering for someone who thinks that there is less string tension on a keyless guitar.

Damien Odell · Post by **Damien Odell** » 27 Jun 2006 3:57 pm

I have a BMI the same as that one, and I've never had a problem with string breakage.

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 27 Jun 2006 5:18 pm

Michael Johnstone. Ha, ha. Thats supposed to be an authority? Ever heard of Duane Marrs or Paul Franklin Sr. ?[This message was edited by Kevin Hatton on 27 June 2006 at 06:20 PM.]

Curt Langston · Post by **Curt Langston** » 27 Jun 2006 5:33 pm

Kevin:

Who said Michael was an authority? He is just a great player who happens to have a lot of knowledge, coupled with common sense, about pedal steels.

Ed Packard is another fine example.

Don't let this BMI keyhead ruin your day!

Duane who?..... Paul who?
LOL

Brett Anderson · Post by **Brett Anderson** » 27 Jun 2006 5:38 pm

I tend to always go with what the molecular biologists say.

David Doggett · Post by **David Doggett** » 27 Jun 2006 7:55 pm

Brett, you're crackin' me up, man.

I just wish they had taught me the right stuff in gradgit school. Then I wouldn't have to think so hard on my own.

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Student of the Steel: Zum uni, Fender tube amps, squareneck and roundneck resos, tenor sax, keyboards

Duane Reese · Post by **Duane Reese** » 27 Jun 2006 8:48 pm

Curt, whats the point ?

Just to see everyone's reaction.........

That, my friends, is the whole point right there. Curt is wasting your time. Hopefully people will stop paying attention to these redundant keyhead debates, and b0b will close this thread.

Jerry Roller · Post by **Jerry Roller** » 27 Jun 2006 8:48 pm

We have been fortunate enough to have a few real honest to goodness genious'come along to provide us with great steel guitars inovations. Zane Beck was such a man. I had a D10 that Zane built for me and it was a fine guitar and I never had any more problems breaking strings on it than any others I have owned. He was a wonderful person who built great instruments and was a great friend to me and I still miss him very much.
Jerry

Hans Holzherr · Post by **Hans Holzherr** » 28 Jun 2006 3:04 am

David is exactly, precisely right.

Of course he is. I have several years of university physics under my belt, but I almost feel silly stating that because the physics involved is more highschool level or lower....

Hans

Curt Langston · Post by **Curt Langston** » 28 Jun 2006 4:08 am

You guys are getting way too serious here. My original observation was that the BMI keyhead will have a tendency to break the 3rd string more often than a standard keyhead, where the tuning key is in the normal position.

I have several years of university physics under my belt, but I almost feel silly stating that because the physics involved is more highschool level or lower....

Wow!..........

Very interesting.

BTW Jerry, I too liked Zane Beck and this is not a slam on him, but just as technology evolves, so does the steel guitar. For instance, what builder still uses a cable pulling system?

Yes, the longer headed guitars will have a tendency to break strings more often, than the shorter headed ones. (Not talking about keyless) Just by the very design. That is my point here.

And it does not takes years of university physics to realize that.(I would hope not!)

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I'd rather be opinionated, than apathetic!

[This message was edited by Curt Langston on 28 June 2006 at 05:09 AM.]

John Fabian · Post by **John Fabian** » 28 Jun 2006 4:52 am

[quote]Our steelguitar community is getting smaller every year[quote]

Your opinion based on .....?????

Ray Minich · Post by **Ray Minich** » 28 Jun 2006 5:06 am

The obituaries?

Bruce Blackburn · Post by **Bruce Blackburn** » 28 Jun 2006 5:38 am

Just to change the direction here as it seems to have degenerated to wise cracks and slams, keyhead length for me is not about string breakage or tension or the science of 6th grade lab experiments. To me it is about overtones and the effect they have on the true tone of the guitar.

I have had string breaking guitars before, witnessed them, seen them returned to the manufacturer, traded them off, and never once gave a thought about the "science" that caused it to break the string. Probably because I didn't REALLY care about that.

As a customer once told me as I was trying to re-position the blame assosciated with a failure our company experienced. ( actually the customer themselves created the situation ) " I DONT WANT TO HEAR ABOUT YOUR LABOR PAINS.....I JUST WANT TO SEE THE BABY"

So, if I were building a guitar I would care, but since I play a guitar, "I JUST WANT TO SEE THE BABY"

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 28 Jun 2006 5:42 am

Closed as the initial premise was false and admitted to be flame bait.