Big & Rich/Musik Mafia

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 21 Jun 2007 1:44 pm

I guess you would say something like that if you lived in the middle of no where like New Foundland. Dale Watson sold out here in western, N.y. three months in advance! They are moving him to a bigger venue here and doing two shows in the fall. Pedal steel obsolete? There are there are six of us here who work every weekend playing real country music. Plenty of places to play, good pay, and its never been more popular here.

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 21 Jun 2007 1:59 pm

Edit.

Mark Eaton · Post by **Mark Eaton** » 21 Jun 2007 2:25 pm

Here's a quote from John Rich from 2005:

“We know what we do is freaky,” John Rich says. “We know we’re combining stuff in the chemistry set that in the instructions say `Don’t combine these things or they might explode.’ We say fine, let’s combine them anyway. We’ll just wear a helmet. That’s our whole attitude toward music.”

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 21 Jun 2007 3:09 pm

I don't know about 'obsolete', but the steel guitar has always been, and will probably always be a very small, little known, and little understood corner of the music industry. It was probably most popular during the Hawaiian craze of the 1930s and '40s. The pedals have so complicated the instrument that the general public can't relate to it, although many people like the sound.

I think Chris was trying to say that the PSG is not relevant to today's pop music, pop culture. And things of "quality" are few and far between in todays world of disposables and instant gratification.

A couple of years ago I posted a topic in the no-pedals section asking if the lap steel is "obsolete", and I quoted a popular vintage guitar site that said lap steels have been rendered 'obsolete' since the advent of the pedal steel guitar. I did not agree with that idea, but I wanted to hear what the lap steel players thought about it. You can imagine the ton of bricks that came down on that post!

As far as B&R, yes, they are mixing some strange chemicals. I don't think we'll have to worry about it much longer. Their flame should burn out soon.

Henry Nagle · Post by **Henry Nagle** » 21 Jun 2007 5:55 pm

I played with a band opening for Big And Rich last month. I don't listen to country music radio and I was fully prepared to hate them. They were actually alright. There were some songs that really repulsed me but for the most part, I thought they were a really good rock band. They seemed like they were genuinely having fun and everyone that I spoke to in the band were very nice.

I'm not going to go out and buy an album but I do feel that I learned a lesson about being overly cynical.

Brint Hannay · Post by **Brint Hannay** » 21 Jun 2007 8:13 pm

I don't know what happened here between Chris and Kevin, because I came in late, after Chris had deleted the substance of his post at the end of page one, whatever it was. Chris, I'm not taking any side (couldn't take yours 'cause I don't know what it was!), but I wish people (you're not the first) wouldn't delete entire posts that have elicited replies and render portions of threads incomprehensible.

But as there has been some discussion in this thread about whether steel guitar is "obsolete", or whether it is "relevant to today's popular music", I thought I'd mention something I heard today (a bit off the original topic, but what the hey).

I was sitting in the local Baja Fresh eating my burrito, when my ear was caught by the music they were playing. At least around here, they always play a mixture of salsa-style Latin music and contemporary Latin pop stuff that often sounds stylistically pretty much like any pop music you'd hear in a Bennigan's or something, except that the lyrics are in Spanish. I eat at Baja Fresh fairly often, and have learned from that that there is, not surprisingly, given the growing Latino population in this country, a lot of this Spanish-language pop/light rock stuff, which I find often has more musically creative content than most of the English-language pop I hear. Anyway, what got my attention was a medium-slow pop song in Spanish with a pedal steel prominent in the mix throughout! It was arguably the dominant lead instrument on the song, playing nice, tasteful pads and some fills--nothing overtly "country" about the song or the steel playing--getting to contribute much more than on almost any mainstream "country" song coming out of Nashville these days.

I bet few of us would have expected that there might be an opening into Latin pop for the pedal steel! Who knows where it might go next?

"Obsolete"? I don't think so!

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 21 Jun 2007 9:57 pm

Hi Brint,

I love your posts and you know we see eye to eye on almost everything, so I regret deleting my original post for that reason. But once I was faced with a prejudicial comment about where I come from, I just lost heart in the thread and my argument, and deleted it. My basic argument was that classic country and pedal steel have been relegated to a selective audience status, and to expect good ole country music to reign again on radio and video is a futile hope. Yes, the pedal steel does surface from time to time in a dominant mode, but by and far people do not have a clue about the instrument. There were pedal steel players getting record deals in the 70's..........just as there were outlaw country singers and other "true" country stars selling millions of records. It's no more, and likely will not change.

That was the basis of my argument.

Theresa Galbraith · Post by **Theresa Galbraith** » 22 Jun 2007 7:09 am

The new single "Lost in the Moment" by Big & Rich has steel accompanied by John Legend. Not to shabby, again this helps steel in other musicial areas.

Obsolete, nah!

P Gleespen · Post by **P Gleespen** » 22 Jun 2007 5:16 pm

Chris LeDrew wrote: But once I was faced with a prejudicial comment about where I come from, I just lost heart in the thread and my argument, and deleted it.

Hey Chris, don't take Kevin too seriously. From what I can tell, he's basically a good guy who sometimes says totally outrageous things without thinking about it.

I don't know if you've ever been to the Buffalo area, but I can assure you that it's better to live "in the middle of nowhere" when that nowhere is beautiful than in the vicinity of somewhere when that somewhere is Buffalo. Living in the Cleveland area, s-hole that it is, I sometimes can make myself feel better about it by remembering this: At least I'm not living in Buffalo.

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 22 Jun 2007 10:33 pm

Thanks for the encouragement, P.

Alan Rudd · Post by **Alan Rudd** » 24 Jun 2007 1:40 pm

In the words of David Preston of BMI, "It's a Big & Rich world out there" of which I answered, "largely the reason I don't listen to the radio anymore." I do however like a few of their songs, but only a few.

Dave Ristrim · Post by **Dave Ristrim** » 18 Jul 2007 4:03 pm

Yeah, I know we all have opinions, and that's cool. Since working for Big & Rich this year, I think I understand what they are doing. They just want to make good music that moves people. People buy their records and respond well at their shows, so I'd say they have done what they've set out to do. "Good" music to some, not-so to others. Country or rock or whatever it is, it appeals to some obviously.
I don't feel the need to really defend them since they have the #1 song on the country charts as I'm writing this.
The past four months have been a blast with them and I look foward to more and more shows. I get to rock out more than I have in the past and I think I needed that. So far, I'm playing steel, electric guitar, banjo and mando with them. I was also playing weissenborn with Cowboy Troy until he changed his set list. He opens the show for Big & Rich and the same band backs him up.
Peace to all,
Dave

Theresa Galbraith · Post by **Theresa Galbraith** » 18 Jul 2007 4:22 pm

I love the new single.
Whose playing steel Dave?

Russ Tkac · Post by **Russ Tkac** » 18 Jul 2007 5:17 pm

Dave,

Your picture looks a bit Jaundice.

Glad things are working out for you. You need to get that ZB out on the road.

Take care,
Russ

Dave Ristrim · Post by **Dave Ristrim** » 18 Jul 2007 6:01 pm

Hi Theresa, Mike Johnson played steel on the Cd.
Russ, the picture was taken on a hazy morning after a long night. I swear, after looking at it again, it doesn't even look like me - most days.

Joe Casey · Post by **Joe Casey** » 19 Jul 2007 7:20 am

B+R. They have the young rock audience appeal and they do whatever they have to do to cover up the talent they don't have..They are what today is commercial and money making, its the trend and the age of electronic enhancements.....recently I heard Montgomery Gentry sing (well thats what they called it) a real country song, no real vocal talent there better than a barroom sit in...But they sell out to crowds that drown out the S**T they do... Girls with voices unaltered would make finger nails scratching on a blackboard sound good however some look so good with the sound turned off they are not that bad...There use to be a saying "If it smells ,it sells".Certainly it fits this era of the now Country....One thing for sure in all the talent search shows like "Nashville Star" for example lets one know they are not looking for the next,Merle Haggard,George Jones or Ray Price or Gene watson ect. The genuine thing is still around and tho they haven't aged gracefully some can still sound great as do Watson,Hag and Price... There have been some real good young Country voices in Nashville but they make them record material that makes them not fit the songs they sing... What about Mark Chestnut,Joe Nichols,Daryle Singletary certainly great country singers and no one writting good Country songs... It goes back to "If it Smells it sells" I just wish they'd revert back to the old Studio rule. K.I.S.S. "Keep it simple stupid".

Michael Douchette · Post by **Michael Douchette** » 19 Jul 2007 9:32 am

Joe Casey wrote:B+R. They have the young rock audience appeal and they do whatever they have to do to cover up the talent they don't have..

You remember the old "Music Minus One" series of instructional material? Sometimes I feel like Nashville has just turned into a huge "Music Minus Talent" outlet...

Dave Ristrim · Post by **Dave Ristrim** » 19 Jul 2007 1:07 pm

Don't hold back guys.

erik · Post by **erik** » 19 Jul 2007 1:36 pm

Hey Dave, please don't assume these are the thoughts of all forum members. I do not like everything B&R has done but I agree with Theresa on their latest single...I like it very much. Those two also had a hand in writing Aldean's Amarillo Sky, which I love. I don't think there is any steeler on this forum that would turn down a gig with a major artist. It's always the outsiders and the retirees that complain.

Theresa Galbraith · Post by **Theresa Galbraith** » 19 Jul 2007 2:24 pm

Thanks Dave!
I know your having a blast backing them. Congratulations on the gig!

Scott Shipley · Post by **Scott Shipley** » 19 Jul 2007 4:21 pm

I've been fortunate enough to have been on many of the Muzik Mafia events, up to and including five episodes of Muzik Mafia TV a couple of years ago. I met artists from Mel Tillis (yes, Mel Tillis) all the way to Kid Rock. Are they bone country? No. They don't claim to be either. Is 90% of what you hear on country radio or see on CMT? No. The difference being that the industry tells us that it IS. "Rub-a-dub-dub." Now there's some musical meat for ya. Nothing changes guys, there's been fluff since there has been music. Point being, music is supposed to be FUN. If a few kids get turned on to steel guitar because they heard it on "Save a Horse," is that a bad thing? People complained about Bill Monroe using a "novelty" instrument in Hillbilly music back in '39........mandolin orchestras were a fading memory!
And for the record, I played mandolin, banjo, and pedal steel on all those MM shows. Btw, B & R use pedal steel on almost every song they cut. Can someone please tell me how that's bad for county music?

Joe Casey · Post by **Joe Casey** » 20 Jul 2007 7:09 am

Certainly its great for any musician to work with a popular act or to be working steady with anyone nowadays. Probably even better than ever financially then in the past when it was barely getting by with name acts. I don't think anyone is putting down any of the musicians. They certainly have to be more versitle to get the good jobs nowadays.

Dave Ristrim · Post by **Dave Ristrim** » 20 Jul 2007 8:29 am

No offense taken.

Michael Haselman · Post by **Michael Haselman** » 20 Jul 2007 9:19 am

I agree with most sentiments on the NCS, as b0b used to call it, and am in a cover band that plays a lot of it, and sometimes wish I had a bag over my head for some of it. BUT as erik said, if I was offered a gig by any of them...even Billy Ray Cyrus, who had the ultimate bag-over-head song, I'd consider it.

Ron Sodos · Post by **Ron Sodos** » 20 Jul 2007 2:29 pm

I was thinking about all of this the other day and all this makes me sad. I think what has happened is years ago even though country music was making money most of the people in the business were naive compared to the big boys in NYC and LA. Well the big companies have taken over and turned what used to be country music into plastic garbage. Bon Jovi and Van Zant on the opry. Give me a break.

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Big & Rich/Musik Mafia

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