Modernizing a Sho-Bud Crossover

[Pierce Arnold]

Hey folks!

Are there currently any Sho-Bud techs out there willing to convert an old Sho-Bud crossover to a modern all-pull D10 system? I am willing to pay the price! The tone and body of this guitar are an absolute dream, but the flaws in its design are an obvious disappointment.

Thanks

[Marco Schouten]

Jeff Surrat of Show-Pro will probably do it.

[Wayne Brown]

I just finished doing a rack and barrel guitar for a customer last year. I changed it over to an all pull guitar as per his request. Here is a couple of pictures. it's not hard to do but is very time consuming because you are basically re designing a new guitar



The main problem was the changer. We had to use 10 complete Marrs fingers in place of the stock Sho-bud ones. This was easier than trying to modify the original ones. Also, that way we could use the original Sho-bud aluminum changer housing.
thanks
wayne

[Marco Schouten]

Wayne, that looks really good!

[Lee Rider]

Nice clean work!

[Pierce Arnold]

I just finished doing a rack and barrel guitar for a customer last year. I changed it over to an all pull guitar as per his request. Here is a couple of pictures. it's not hard to do but is very time consuming because you are basically re designing a new guitar



The main problem was the changer. We had to use 10 complete Marrs fingers in place of the stock Sho-bud ones. This was easier than trying to modify the original ones. Also, that way we could use the original Sho-bud aluminum changer housing.
thanks
wayne

This rebuild looks fantastic, Wayne! Any interest in taking on my lil old crossover?

I contacted Jeff over at Show-Pro, but he told me that his style of Sho-Bud restores are incompatible with the crossover. I’ve seen a couple that Mike Cass has rebuilt, basically Professional systems within a Crossover, that look like they came right out of the factory that way, so I know it’s possible! I plan on making this my lifer guitar, so definitely worth whatever it takes.

[Wayne Brown]

Please send me some underneath pics of the complete guitar with the changer as well to
outwestcountry9@gmail.com
and i'll see what I can do
thanks
wayne

[Pierce Arnold]

Please send me some underneath pics of the complete guitar with the changer as well to
outwestcountry9@gmail.com
and i'll see what I can do
thanks
wayne

Just sent you an email buddy!

[Ricky Davis]

Best way to "Modernize" a ShoBud Crossover is to replace ALL PARTS and the way Fingers are mounted. So all those new parts will be about the same price as buying a Modern Pedal Steel that is already built....so just throw the worthless Crossover away and buy a Modern pedal steel as there are many great ones out there.
Ricky

[Ken Pippus]

Don’t hold back, Ricky, tell us what you really mean!

Coop and James said the same thing.

[Ricky Davis]

Don’t hold back, Ricky, tell us what you really mean!
Coop and James said the same thing

Yes Ken; even SHO~BUD said the same thing. Me and Coop and James were all partners in the "Shobud lives on quest";
course now I'm the only one left alive; so yes I will only say what I mean; and just get ready for the NEW SHO~BUD coming soon.
Ricky

[K Maul]

Best way to "Modernize" a ShoBud Crossover is to replace ALL PARTS and the way Fingers are mounted.
Ricky

Ricky,
I am curious about the problem with the way the fingers are mounted. Can you explain?
My Crossover, which I got last summer (for a very low price) sounds fantastic. It has a very simple setup. I use it for a specific project so it’s many design flaws are not an issue for me.

[Ricky Davis]

Ricky,
I am curious about the problem with the way the fingers are mounted. Can you explain?

Yes; the crossover had a wood wraparound neck because the fingers were mounted by axle to a bracket that mounted/screwed down to the body. The normal ShoBud had the axle going through a casted Tail Piece, screwed down to body, that the wood neck butted up against....that is a WHOLE Difference vibration/resonation between the two different Mountings.
Ricky

[Pierce Arnold]

Best way to "Modernize" a ShoBud Crossover is to replace ALL PARTS and the way Fingers are mounted. So all those new parts will be about the same price as buying a Modern Pedal Steel that is already built....so just throw the worthless Crossover away and buy a Modern pedal steel as there are many great ones out there.
Ricky

Hey friend,

thanks for your honest and severe truth!

Objectively you are correct. I could get a sweet, more modern guitar for the amount of money it would take to rebuild the crossover. Unfortunately the tone and appearance of this ol' anchor are exactly what I'm wanting out of a guitar. I've seen quite a few crossover rebuilds on this forum and elsewhere, so I know that there's somebody out there who can help bring my monster to life.

[Jerry Overstreet]

What is it you think the guitar needs to make it comfortably playable? I realize they were only 6+1, or none, and I'm aware of the sloppy crossover mech, but besides that what else is there?
Isn't there something that can be done to make that crossover linkage work better of just disabled and a few more KLs added w/changes/adds to the pedal pulls?

I played an x-over for a little while. As I recall, the pulling system is rack and barrel. It played and sounded just fine. The issue was it only had 1 KL.

The concern about modernizing the system with different parts, is that the guitar would probably lose whatever magic it has tonewise.

I did some adjustments on the one I owned but certainly no expert on these. I'm not being critical just curious...inquiring minds want to know, ya know

However, I defer to Ricky et al Sho~Bud experts.

[Ricky Davis]

Unfortunately the tone and appearance of this ol' anchor are exactly what I'm wanting out of a guitar

Cool Pierce; certainly understandable; so I will add a main thing that would give you part of what you want out of it...and it is those Fingertops of the Changer is why the Tone is that great. So DON'T let who ever wants to and can do updating; refinish...set up....ETC> But DO NOT CHANGE THOSE FINGER TOPS>.......
Good luck; and all the folks I would recommend have died already; unless you can talk Harry Jackson into it......yeeeehaaaa.
Ricky

[Jackie Anderson]

I haven't piped up here for a long time, but howdy, Ricky! I'm glad you're still around to pass on the lore!

I have an SD-10 3x4 built many years ago from a Crossover, I think by Al Brisco, using a non-wraparound neck, the later square cast changer mounting and 2 raise, single lower fingers with two-hole pullers and brass swivels in place of the original racks and barrels. Before making those changes, in addition to stripping out all of the original undercarriage, much of the central longitudinal rib in the frame was cut down to allow full width cross rods and knee lever placement closer to the rear apron.

I also have an original, unmolested (although currently disassembled) Crossover, with the wraparound neck/bridge combination, racks & barrels, etc. The crossover mechanism never held reliably, but something will eventually be done about that....

For "tonal" comparison, I have several other Sho-Buds (including a 6139 3x5 that you "Cooped" and signed long ago, Ricky), though nothing older than a "Universal" and nothing newer than a round front 2-hole puller/brass swivel LDG. I do not have, and have never played any more modern Bud.

That being said, this is completely subjective, and I am ignoring issues of playability and set-up versatility, BUT my favorite sound among all of my Buds is that of the two Crossovers, which I would say have much in common, sonically. A lot of that is, naturally, from some nice old pieces of straight-grain maple, and pickups (there has been a fair amount of pickup swapping among most of these Buds) certainly make a difference, too, but to me there is a particular, lively "zing" in the sound of the Crossovers which I really love, and which I am inclined to ascribe to the influence of the cast alloy frame in the mix. I can tell you that the bare frame rings like a beautiful bell!

Fender pedal steels, which also have cast alloy frames, also have a characteristic bit of extra "liveliness" in their sound, to my ears, although in comparing them with with Crossovers there is still the clear difference between the sound of maple and the sound of ash. And bare Fender frames, made from a very different alloy, don't ring as nicely (IMHO) as the Crossover frames, so I think the Fender sound (which I also love) is more wood-dependent. Now, I would love to hear the sound of something like my ex-Crossover rebuilt with ash....

[K Maul]

I have had a few Buds over the years single and double necks, Professionals, Permanents and Fingertips. The funky messed up Xover I have now has a certain growl that I really like.

[Pierce Arnold]

Well fellas,

After flipping the crossover switch back and forth, tuning, then back and forth, tuning, then back and forth... for about an hour and some change... it's finally staying in tune.

I've been playing E9 neck for 15 minutes, switching to C6 for another 15 minutes, and so on for a little over an hour. No falling out of tune. Success! For now... A total Jagwire restring may have something to do with it.

[Pierce Arnold]

Unfortunately the tone and appearance of this ol' anchor are exactly what I'm wanting out of a guitar

Cool Pierce; certainly understandable; so I will add a main thing that would give you part of what you want out of it...and it is those Fingertops of the Changer is why the Tone is that great. So DON'T let who ever wants to and can do updating; refinish...set up....ETC> But DO NOT CHANGE THOSE FINGER TOPS>.......
Good luck; and all the folks I would recommend have died already; unless you can talk Harry Jackson into it......yeeeehaaaa.
Ricky

I appreciate this knowledge, friend! I had wondered why this tone was so unique; I'd played an acquaintance's permanent a few months back, and although I was basically drooling over it, it didn't have a certain bite that this crossover has... it was more on the twangy side.