| Author |
Topic: Old ShoBud D10 steel guitar info |
Jim Trantham
From:
Wyoming, USA
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Posted 11 Aug 2022 1:54 pm |
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| Jim Trantham wrote: |
| Steve Waltz wrote: |
Jim,
Since you mentioned machining parts I'll post some photos of types of parts. I would really suggest making a whole plan now so that you don't have to move things later as I did. Choose a set up. I put F raises on left knee left, E lowers left knee right, 2nd string and 9th string lowers on right knee right.
Choose bell crank style: My guitar and Bob Mullers have what I call sho bud fingertip style. They work fine but sometimes can be in the way and you have to run rods for one change through the bell crank of another change. That can bind or it rubs and a slightly mcrophonic pick up will hear it. The rod for a single pull also sometimes can slightly bind in the bellcrank depending on how far the arch of the bell crank travels. Because of this I think the sho bud Pro 2 bell cranks and the MARlen versions are better. They hold the rod in a rotating brass piece attached to the finger. The emmons push pull cranks are similar. You can purchase the sho bud ones but I think they are $25 each and you are going to need potentially 12! So if you can make a version that might help.
I'm not a machinist so what I am showing is not what it could be but even as it is it works. Yours could be better.
Fingertip style
Sho bud pro 2 style. These won't bind and they stay out of the way of other rods.
MArlen style
You could start by changing your A B and C pedals so that the rods travel in a straight line. You create a rod across the E9 neck, mount bell cranks in line with the changer finger being used and lock down behind the bellcrank by eitehr a collar or threaded rod with a nut. This threaded issue will come up later because it is a method of tuning one of two changes.
This could get long winded so I'll stop unless this is the direction you are going. The best thing I can do for you is to show what I built that I made a mistake on or what I would have changed. |
Wow!! I really like your work. I’m deep into repairs now. I’ll send you pics when I get it redone. Then tuning will be my next learning experience… Thank you Steve for your patience, time and expertise helping me!! |
Steve, here are some pictures of my work so far. I’m having a very difficult time lowering my E’s to Eb… Hopefully you can see what I’m trying to do. What am I doing wrong. Especially on the 8th string. I have a conflict that I’m having trouble resolving.
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‘51 Gibson Super 300, Carter D-12, Carter D-10, Evans FET 500, ‘65 Fender Twin, ‘69 Martin D-35… Been performing for 60 years and counting…., |
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Jim Trantham
From:
Wyoming, USA
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Posted 6 Sep 2022 9:51 am MyOld ShoBud Permanent project
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Steve Waltz, here are some pics of my “almost finished” project.
The pups on both necks don’t seem to be uniform in sound…. The treble is extremely bright and weaker than the bass side.. Perhaps they need to be rewound… Can you refer me to someone reliable to do this? Thanks for all your ideas, expertise and help…. Jim
_________________
‘51 Gibson Super 300, Carter D-12, Carter D-10, Evans FET 500, ‘65 Fender Twin, ‘69 Martin D-35… Been performing for 60 years and counting…., |
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Steve Waltz
From:
USA
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Posted 6 Sep 2022 11:37 am
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Suggestions:
You might need a support on cross shafts in the middle of the guitar. Sometimes that rod can flex enough to cause some troubles.
It looks like you got rid of your earlier reversing method on the E9 neck. Good idea. The old one takes up too much room, bends the rods and will get in the way.
Is your C pedal raising both E's? If so that isn't normal and I would question doing that. That also creates a raise and a lower and a middle position, all needing a way to tune. The two E strings will not tune to the same pitch because of the gauge of wire difference. That is why I have threaded the rod behind the pullers and added a nut. That nut allows to micro tune each string where needed to make the two strings match. Let me know what exact problem you are having with your lower and I can try to help more. That raise on the lower E will cause problems which I can explain but it is related to leaving enough room to lower and raise.
Knee lever stops: It looks like you don't have them. They might seem redundant as the lower is tuned at the screws on the changer housing but it's more of a feel thing. You tune it up as you normally would but then add in a knee leer stop that engages just after the tuning screws engage. This keeps you from jamming the knee lever more than you need to and helps to tell your brain that the change is fully engaged because you feel the stop screw hit. I think some people call this a positive stop.
When ever you do things like the stop screw I mentioned above, you have to put a compression spring on it to hold that screw in place as things move around. Without the compression spring the screw can back out. This applies to the micro tuning nuts on the pull rods and other tuning like open E's.
Pickups: IF you need them rebuilt I would suggest you get a hold of Dawn at Jackson Guitars. She has been my contact for David Jackson who wound my pickups originally at sho bud and who did it again a few years ago. |
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Jim Trantham
From:
Wyoming, USA
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Posted 6 Sep 2022 12:57 pm
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| Steve Waltz wrote: |
Suggestions:
You might need a support on cross shafts in the middle of the guitar. Sometimes that rod can flex enough to cause some troubles.
It looks like you got rid of your earlier reversing method on the E9 neck. Good idea. The old one takes up too much room, bends the rods and will get in the way.
Is your C pedal raising both E's? If so that isn't normal and I would question doing that. That also creates a raise and a lower and a middle position, all needing a way to tune. The two E strings will not tune to the same pitch because of the gauge of wire difference. That is why I have threaded the rod behind the pullers and added a nut. That nut allows to micro tune each string where needed to make the two strings match. Let me know what exact problem you are having with your lower and I can try to help more. That raise on the lower E will cause problems which I can explain but it is related to leaving enough room to lower and raise.
Knee lever stops: It looks like you don't have them. They might seem redundant as the lower is tuned at the screws on the changer housing but it's more of a feel thing. You tune it up as you normally would but then add in a knee leer stop that engages just after the tuning screws engage. This keeps you from jamming the knee lever more than you need to and helps to tell your brain that the change is fully engaged because you feel the stop screw hit. I think some people call this a positive stop.
When ever you do things like the stop screw I mentioned above, you have to put a compression spring on it to hold that screw in place as things move around. Without the compression spring the screw can back out. This applies to the micro tuning nuts on the pull rods and other tuning like open E's.
Pickups: IF you need them rebuilt I would suggest you get a hold of Dawn at Jackson Guitars. She has been my contact for David Jackson who wound my pickups originally at sho bud and who did it again a few years ago. |
This is how I’ve got the E9 setup…. I will get to work on your suggestions… Thank you so very much. I’m getting more excited all along….Jim
_________________
‘51 Gibson Super 300, Carter D-12, Carter D-10, Evans FET 500, ‘65 Fender Twin, ‘69 Martin D-35… Been performing for 60 years and counting…., |
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Steve Waltz
From:
USA
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Posted 6 Sep 2022 1:41 pm
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| I wasn't being clear about what your C pedal was doing. It shouldn't raise string 8 as I think you had in your drawing. It should raise string 4.....and string 5 if you can do it. |
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Jim Trantham
From:
Wyoming, USA
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Posted 6 Sep 2022 4:04 pm
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| Steve Waltz wrote: |
| I wasn't being clear about what your C pedal was doing. It shouldn't raise string 8 as I think you had in your drawing. It should raise string 4.....and string 5 if you can do it. |
Ok… I’ll get to work on that change…. Thank you
_________________
‘51 Gibson Super 300, Carter D-12, Carter D-10, Evans FET 500, ‘65 Fender Twin, ‘69 Martin D-35… Been performing for 60 years and counting…., |
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Lee Dassow
From:
Jefferson, Georgia USA
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Posted 7 Sep 2022 2:12 pm
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Looks okay to me Jim. Good luck with your steel guitar!
Tenn,Lee
_________________
2015 Mullen D-10 Royal Precision 9x8,-1990 BMI S-10 5x5-1972 Silver face Fender pro Reverb amp,-1965 Fender Super Reverb Amp,- 1966 Fender Showman Amp Two 15" JBL speakers,- 2006 65 Fender Twin Reverb reissue Amp,- 1982 Peavey Session 500 amp,-1978 Peavey Session 400,Goodrich Volume Pedals,John Pearse Steel Bars, |
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Jim Trantham
From:
Wyoming, USA
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Posted 7 Sep 2022 2:36 pm
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| Lee Dassow wrote: |
Looks okay to me Jim. Good luck with your steel guitar!
Tenn,Lee |
I’m struggling with tuning this old beast… The setup is pretty straight forward, but getting it tuned up has presented some real challenges for a complete idiot novice….. LOL…. Jim
_________________
‘51 Gibson Super 300, Carter D-12, Carter D-10, Evans FET 500, ‘65 Fender Twin, ‘69 Martin D-35… Been performing for 60 years and counting…., |
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Ken Pippus
From:
Langford, BC, Canada
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Bob Muller
From:
Oregon, USA
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Posted 10 Sep 2022 11:49 pm
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| Jim Trantham wrote: |
| Lee Dassow wrote: |
Looks okay to me Jim. Good luck with your steel guitar!
Tenn,Lee |
I’m struggling with tuning this old beast… The setup is pretty straight forward, but getting it tuned up has presented some real challenges for a complete idiot novice….. LOL…. Jim |
Pm sent |
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