C6 Request: Josie by Steely Dan

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

I'm playing with some folks who want to do "Josie" by Steely Dan. Here's the chord chart I made, but I can't seem to find positions to make it through the chorus smoothly. Those changes go by really fast! Any help would be appreciated.

(I play D6th, so any C6th open or 1st fret positions are out.)

https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/userpix2203/1283_Josie_1.jpg
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b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

The only position I've found for the B+7#9 in this song is a 2-footer with P8 and a non-standard pedal (middle E to F) at the 14th fret. I know some people have that change on a knee but I don't - it's essentially my p4. Is there any way to get that B+7#9 chord with standard C6th changes?

In numbers, it's 1 3 #5 b7 #9.

In notes, it's B D# G A D.

It sounds like the exact right chord right when I play it with my P4 + standard P8, but it's hard to do. Too much foot dancing.
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J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

B0b and I worked on this back and forth via PM over the last days.

My findings on his question about that V7alt chord (B.aug.b7, #9) after having gone thru the whole array of chord sequences of this song, listening, watching youtube-videos on guitar and keys, are:

- 1. In most cases the chord is not played completely, often missing the root and often with EITHER the aug. 5th OR the altered 9th.

- 2. Often the altered 9th is b9th instead of #9th, but that also depends on the presence of the aug. 5th or not.

- 3. In lieu of a root (I) often both a b5 and a #5 can be found an octave apart.

- 4. In the two i-m (bII M7), II7, V.alt, sequences of the Chorus, the V7alt chord has a different "significance" or musical statement than the with insistence repeated V7#9 at the very end of the Chorus. That last one ist mostly played by guitarists as the 1,3,b7,#9 voicing known as the "Hendrix Chord" (which Django Reinhardt used too... long before JH).

-5. Most of the Maj7th/9th chords should be viewed as Triads-Over-Bass, because as Donald Fagan explains in the videos below, the BASS line was of essence. When you write a chord as Triad-Over-Bass, the triad "may" be in "any" inversion, but the BASS is SET clearly. Those sequences all have a clear bass-line (call it bass melody):
- Donald Fagen Video #1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWJ11H4TdbI
- Donald Fagen Video #2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V65t4GlgOh8

So, to "identify" the chord in question, I went about listening to the BASS first and then the top note... the later which like in Jazz's "lead note" is fairly constant. Everything else, "the chord" is captured in between those two extremes and found using the ears and looking at hands on piano examples found on videos.

I will later post the whole run in C6th.
It's playable with thumb with 2 picks, but evidently, ALONE thumb and 3 picks will be more closely replicating the chordal experience heard on the records.
IF you play with 2 picks and thumb, below examples can all be played using the same wide "fork" grip |xx|x| (-> bass-to-treble), which in the two positions involving P8 eliminates it's need.

So, HERE we go:

In the two 2,5,i-m sequences I found that either the P6/C-lower or the P8/C-lower TRI-TONE positions (both logically 6 frets up from their respective basic Dom7th(9th or #9th) positions) brings about the closest offering the degrees to formulate a pleasant version of the desired chord:

IF we take the i-m (Em) as a wide grip voicing off the 8th string rooted non-pedal-minor 7th position (Am at the nut)at the 7th fret, strings 8, 6, 5, 3
the II.alt7th could be played 2 frets above using P8 to raise the bottom m3rd to convert the ii-m7 located there to Mrd resulting in a II.7#9 on strings 8, 7, 5, 3.
moving down 1 fret (in between the two) still with P8 and adding the top C-to-B lower (lever) we get on the same string the Tri-Tone inversion of the P8-dom7#9 with will have the following degrees on stings:

St. 3(L): aug.5th
St. 5 : M3rd
St. 7 : b7th
St. 8(R): b5 BASS

The presence of the b5th may surprise, but it IS part of the Bass Run which, when you add the passing chord bII.M7 or call it #I.M7 and just really serves as a chromatic bass passage, as the bass goes E, F, F# back down F, E
That bII.M7 is best played on the 9th string M7th position (12th fret) with the same wide grip (strings 9, 7, 6, 4) or two frets below the 8th string rooted Em (i-m) with P7 strings, 7, 5, 4, 2.
So the bass, just walks up and down 2 chromatic semitones.

An alternate position for the B7.alt would be the P6/C-B-lower-TriTone inversion on the 12th fret (which offers a few more choices):

St. 1(D): #9th
St. 3: b9th
St. 3(L): root
St. 5 : aug.5th
St. 6(LL): #9th (m3rd)
St. 6(L-P6): M3rd
St. 7 :b9th
St. 8 : b7th
St. 9 : b5th

Evidently, strings 1, 2 and 3 are already outside (higher) of the played chord's
spectrum.
I am confident too that most will find that having playing both the aug.5th WITH the #9th does not sound all to pleasant in that order.

Guitarists mainly tend to use some version of the 5th-string rooted dom7,#9 (aka. Hendrix Chord) 1,M3,b7,#9 (but leaving the #5 which would easily be reachable by laying down the pinky holding the #9, out) or the more "Django style" 6th string-rooted dom7th,aug 1,x,b7,M3, #5, #9 by laying the ring finger down over the first 3 strings.

I HOPE I did not mis-write some of this.

While this is not "my" music, I found it a VERY interesting experiment and I learned a LOT about chords I already used and forced me to really investigate these TriTone substitutions beyond just playing them where I felt my ear calls for them.

I will try to elaborate a playing chart for the whole sequences down the line.

Thanks!... J-D.
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Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"

A Little Mental Health Warning:

Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.

I say it humorously, but I mean it.

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

J.D.'s post came in at 11:30 AM PST so I don't have time to properly digest it before band practice at 3 PM. I'm really looking forward to seeing his preferred positions for the whole chorus. Mr. Green

I'll make do with the awkward 2-footers I've come up with for this afternoon's practice.
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J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

just the end of the Verse (i-m to #I.M79) going into the repeated II,V,i-m of the beginning of the Chorus.

i-minor in red.

the #I.M79 in green can be played 2 frets below i-m with P7 OR 5 frets above i-m open.

the alternated pos. for the V7alt (blue) chord would be the P6 (Cflat-lever) inversion o the TriTone 5 frets above i-m. As described above, it has more options to choose from, but the depicted version with the P8+Cflat inversion of the TriTone sub, just flows easier to play, in my opinion.

... JD.
_________________
__________________________________________________________

Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"

A Little Mental Health Warning:

Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.

I say it humorously, but I mean it.

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Very good! Thanks, J D.
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J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

scott murray · From: Asheville, NC

I play a lot of Steely Dan on C6 and just started messing with Josie myself, this week coincidentally.

for the chorus, I'm playing:
F#7#9, fret 9 pedal 8
B7#5, fret 9 pedal 5, raise string 4 a half
Em7, fret 7 no pedals
C/F, fret 12 no pedals

F#7#9, fret 9 pedal 8
B7#5, fret 9 pedal 5, raise string 4 a half
Em7, fret 7 no pedals
A7, fret 7 pedal 5

Am7, fret 12 no pedals
D9, fret 12 pedal 5
G∆, fret 7 no pedals
C∆, fret 7 no pedals

F#7#9, fret 9 pedal 8
B7#9#5, fret 14 pedal 8, raise string 6 a half

the intro was a challenge but I got it worked out pretty well at frets 4 and 2, then those last 4 chords:
C/F, fret 12 no pedals
F#7#9, fret 9 pedal 8
D/G, fret 14 no pedals
G#∆, fret 15 no pedals
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J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

This is the Intro Chord Sequence on C6th as a "consolidation" of what I seem to see and "hear" off Key and Guitar players and which I've tested against various rhythm tracks and the original in Em (later versions are in Dm).

Example only requires P7, P8 and P7 with the 6th-string full tone lower ("LL").
The two last chords can be picked on top while raked up with the thumb.
Although I prefer to omit the Bass "G" on the second last chord (D/G) and just grab the D's 9th in the bass for more "definition/separation". That's why I put it in a dotted circle.

As with all examples, it's centered around the 8th-string-rooted Em fret.
Shown as flow-chart. So you see the relationships.

... J-D.
_________________
__________________________________________________________

Was it JFK who said: Ask Not What TAB Can Do For You - Rather Ask Yourself "What Would B.B. King Do?"

A Little Mental Health Warning:

Tablature KILLS SKILLS.
The uses of Tablature is addictive and has been linked to reduced musical fertility.
Those who produce Tablature did never use it.

I say it humorously, but I mean it.

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Frankly, I find tab easier to read. 🤪

Is the 7th string also lowered on the 3rd chord?

Why are some dots filled in?
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b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

scott murray · From: Asheville, NC

Also, you have 2 chords with no pedals at the same fret. Is that a typo?

scott murray · From: Asheville, NC

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Is this what you mean, J D? I had a hard time following your diagram, so I tabbed it out.

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

J D Sauser · From: Wellington, Florida

Roger Rettig · From: Naples, FL

I found B+7#9 spelled in b0b's second post on this thread: 1,3,#5,b7,#9 on my C6:

6th fret, pedal 6 (sorry, not P5 - edit), MKV (lowers my As), MKR (raises my Cs)

Strings 9,8,7,6,4. It's a tricky grip, though, even if it does contain all five parts of the chord. Engaging my central MKV and MKR is doable - just.

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

Roger Rettig · From: Naples, FL

JD:

I'm in complete agreement with your 'signature' quip but, having said that, it's a very useful tool for sharing suggestions in a thread such as this.

I don't know how to create the diagrams you and b0b have been using so my suggestion (above - B+7#9) had to be expressed 'longhand', as it were.

Where tab can trip a player up is when he plays a song by rote from someone else's work. A player learns nothing about the geography of the tuning until he recognizes sounds and and intervals; then his ears will guide him.

Oddly, it's a bit like the very best sight-readers who open a chart at a session or in an orchestral setting. The music on the page goes from their eyes to their hands like a reflex and, seconds later, they may have no memory of what they played.

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