| Author |
Topic: Touring musician pay scale |
Mike McBride
From:
Indiana
|
Posted 27 Dec 2021 11:15 am |
|
I saw some video of Kenny Vaughn playing with Lucinda Williams on Austin City Limits from 1998.
What could a sideman expect to earn for a 100 date tour in the pre-Covid days? |
|
|
|
Pete Finney
From:
Nashville Tn.
|
Posted 28 Dec 2021 6:22 am
|
|
deleted
Last edited by Pete Finney on 3 Jan 2022 9:54 pm; edited 3 times in total |
|
|
|
Bill McCloskey
From:
Nanuet, NY
|
Posted 28 Dec 2021 7:15 am
|
|
Interestingly, Miles Davis paid Herbie Hancock, Ron Carter, Tony Williams, Wayne Shorter, some of the best jazz musicians in history, $200 or less a gig. And on the My Funny Valentine and Four and More live records, they were forced to play for free because it was a benefit concert. They weren't happy. But the albums are classics.
_________________
Check out the Steel Guitar Union Hall Facebook group for you daily dose of Steel https://www.facebook.com/groups/steelguitarunionhall |
|
|
|
Fred
From:
Amesbury, MA
|
Posted 28 Dec 2021 9:57 am
|
|
| Bill McCloskey wrote: |
| Interestingly, Miles Davis paid Herbie Hancock, Ron Carter, Tony Williams, Wayne Shorter, some of the best jazz musicians in history, $200 or less a gig. And on the My Funny Valentine and Four and More live records, they were forced to play for free because it was a benefit concert. They weren't happy. But the albums are classics. |
$200 x 100 dates is $20,000. But thatβs a long time ago. |
|
|
|
Steve Hinson
From:
Hendersonville Tn USA
|
Posted 31 Dec 2021 7:06 pm ...but...
|
|
| Bill McCloskey wrote: |
| Interestingly, Miles Davis paid Herbie Hancock, Ron Carter, Tony Williams, Wayne Shorter, some of the best jazz musicians in history, $200 or less a gig. And on the My Funny Valentine and Four and More live records, they were forced to play for free because it was a benefit concert. They weren't happy. But the albums are classics. |
Those cats worked for Miles in the mid-60s...
The $200 per day they were paid,adjusted
for inflation,would be around $1650 now...
SH |
|
|
|
Michael Sawyer
From:
North Carolina, USA
|
Posted 1 Jan 2022 12:10 pm
|
|
I am not a touring musician,just a weekend hack.
The band i am in plays 2 four hour shows a month on average.
We spend about 2 hours setting up and tearing down,plus a 1/2 hour or more loading in and out at the band room.
Travel is anywhere from 30 minutes to 2 hours one way.
Our pay depends on the venue size...i generally take home "a cow and a calf"($150).
I consider it a hobby,like fishing or golf.
I will never break even cause i keep buying stuff π |
|
|
|
Tommy Shown
From:
Denham Springs, La.
|
Posted 1 Jan 2022 12:37 pm
|
|
I too am a weekend warrior. However, I don't make the big bucks like you do Mike. I have worked in some bands where the bandleader made the bucks while the musicians got the the crumbs. He paid each one of us on the level of work we put out while playing.some got more than others. After gas and eats at the venue I am lucky to have maybe $20.00 left and that don't cover expenses. Like what Ton Elliott told me once.
A musician is someone with $5000.00 of gear, puts it in a $500.00 car, drives 100 miles to a gig that pays $50.00.
Tommy Shown |
|
|
|
Michael Sawyer
From:
North Carolina, USA
|
Posted 1 Jan 2022 4:03 pm
|
|
Tommy,i feel you...
Lol,it surely won't braggin,hope it didnt come off that way.Might have been complaining a little...I am fortunate to be in an unselfish group and fortunate to have a few little bars that are fair with the pay,and patrons that appreciate live music,with the flaws and hiccups we have.
I couldn't pay my bills playing music,i figured that out 25 years ago.
Like i said its a hobby,i feel blessed to recoup a little of my investment here and there. |
|
|
|
Miles Lang
From:
Venturaloha
|
Posted 2 Jan 2022 6:55 pm Re: ...but...
|
|
| Steve Hinson wrote: |
| Bill McCloskey wrote: |
| Interestingly, Miles Davis paid Herbie Hancock, Ron Carter, Tony Williams, Wayne Shorter, some of the best jazz musicians in history, $200 or less a gig. And on the My Funny Valentine and Four and More live records, they were forced to play for free because it was a benefit concert. They weren't happy. But the albums are classics. |
Those cats worked for Miles in the mid-60s...
The $200 per day they were paid,adjusted
for inflation,would be around $1650 now...
SH |
$1650/day is about quadruple what I made per day as an attorney (base salary at 100k) It would be great if sidemen made that today, but I donβt think Miles Davis was being harsh at $200 per day fifty to sixty Years ago
_________________
Santo Fan Club - from the island of Coney to the sands of Rockaway
Jill Martini & The Shrunken Heads
All aloha, all the time |
|
|
|
Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
|
Posted 2 Jan 2022 7:44 pm Re: ...but...
|
|
| Steve Hinson wrote: |
| Bill McCloskey wrote: |
| Interestingly, Miles Davis paid Herbie Hancock, Ron Carter, Tony Williams, Wayne Shorter, some of the best jazz musicians in history, $200 or less a gig. And on the My Funny Valentine and Four and More live records, they were forced to play for free because it was a benefit concert. They weren't happy. But the albums are classics. |
Those cats worked for Miles in the mid-60s...
The $200 per day they were paid,adjusted
for inflation,would be around $1650 now...
SH |
I'd gladly work for $1650/day. If I played 300 gigs in a year, that would be half a million bucks per year. Heck I'd work for half of that and, yeah, I might even play the recording session for free to create the album we'd be touring on. Who's complaining?
(Of course I'd never get the gig anyway; they'd hire Steve Hinson. π )
_________________
www.JimCohen.com
www.RonstadtRevue.com
www.BeatsWalkin.com |
|
|
|
Karl Paulsen
From:
Chicago
|
Posted 2 Jan 2022 8:04 pm
|
|
This is a really interesting conversation.
Kind of makes me feel glad to have gotten $100 per gig on bass in my last group. It was 3-4 weekend (usually evening) gigs a month, 3-4 hour gigs. It was an average of an hour drive each way, but very minimal setup time (I could pull up 30 minutes before start) and no rehearsals. I was the first guy hired and BL looked to me to bring the "cool" and a little bit of of Musical Director type direction to the group, but nothing complicated.
Was a nice arrangement that lasted for a few years until the combination of the band growing in size and Covid made it so the leader could no longer meet my fee and we parted amicably.
It wasn't alot of $ in the scheme of things, and $ wasn't the whole motivation, but it was a vital piece that helped balance out the drive and regularly taking a weekend evening away from the family. Not that I'm looking but I doubt I'll be regularly making that much per gig anytime soon.
The cats who can make a living primarily by playing have my respect and then some. Almost all the professional musicians I've known who achieve any kind of middle class life have some sort of institutional music teaching gig as their prime income and insurance platform and gig/sub/etc and private teach along side that.
_________________
Nickel and Steel. Sad Songs and Steel Guitar.
https://www.facebook.com/NickelandSteel
Chicago Valley Railroad. Trainspotting and Bargain Hunting...
https://chicagovalleyrailroad.blogspot.com/
Last edited by Karl Paulsen on 3 Jan 2022 9:44 am; edited 7 times in total |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
Posted 3 Jan 2022 8:54 am
|
|
I imagine that professional musicians on the road, backing a "star", can make an average middle class income, but I'm not 100% sure. Those playing with acts that are struggling to "make it" certainly make less. It's a hard life, in any case.
In 1979 I spent a few months on the road for $500/week (if memory serves). Seemed like good money at the time, but family issues brought me back home.
_________________
-πππ- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
|
|
|
Steve Hinson
From:
Hendersonville Tn USA
|
Posted 4 Jan 2022 5:47 am Re: ...but...
|
|
| Jim Cohen wrote: |
| Steve Hinson wrote: |
| Bill McCloskey wrote: |
| Interestingly, Miles Davis paid Herbie Hancock, Ron Carter, Tony Williams, Wayne Shorter, some of the best jazz musicians in history, $200 or less a gig. And on the My Funny Valentine and Four and More live records, they were forced to play for free because it was a benefit concert. They weren't happy. But the albums are classics. |
Those cats worked for Miles in the mid-60s...
The $200 per day they were paid,adjusted
for inflation,would be around $1650 now...
SH |
I'd gladly work for $1650/day. If I played 300 gigs in a year, that would be half a million bucks per year. Heck I'd work for half of that and, yeah, I might even play the recording session for free to create the album we'd be touring on. Who's complaining?
(Of course I'd never get the gig anyway; they'd hire Steve Hinson. π ) |
Nah,he's too old now... 
SH |
|
|
|
Jim Cohen
From:
Philadelphia, PA
|
|
|
|
Steve Hinson
From:
Hendersonville Tn USA
|
Posted 5 Jan 2022 1:27 pm Re: ...but...
|
|
| Jim Cohen wrote: |
| Steve Hinson wrote: |
Nah,he's too old now...
SH |
Oh, you're in the 3rd stage of your career, then:
"Get me a young Steve Hinson." ππ |
...or maybe even the 4th:
"Who's Steve Hinson?"
SH |
|
|
|
Justin Emmert
From:
Greensboro, NC
|
Posted 16 Jan 2022 4:26 pm
|
|
As of Jan 9, 2022, the average annual pay for a Touring Musician in Nashville is $44,715 an year. Just in case you need a simple salary calculator, that works out to be approximately $21.50 an hour. This is the equivalent of $860/week or $3,726/month.
While ZipRecruiter is seeing salaries as high as $102,039 and as low as $11,176, the majority of Touring Musician salaries currently range between $28,182 (25th percentile) to $57,336 (75th percentile) with top earners (90th percentile) making $82,117 annually in Nashville. |
|
|
|
Bill Cunningham
From:
Atlanta, Ga. USA
|
Posted 16 Jan 2022 7:51 pm
|
|
Here is the AFM 257 scale for a touring musician FWIW as a reference. I have no idea what percentage of touring gigs are on the card. Maybe Hinson or someone in the know will chime in.
Iβd venture to say most βroad gigsβ these days are one or two days a week out on the weekends. Not a lot of groups out there 300 days a year like ET and The Troubadours used to do.
https://www.nashvillemusicians.org/sites/default/files/Live%20Road%20Scale%20April%2015%2C%202019.pdf
_________________
Bill Cunningham
Atlanta, GA |
|
|
|
Mike McBride
From:
Indiana
|
Posted 17 Jan 2022 3:33 am
|
|
| Great resource Bill! I am now glad I became an engineer instead. |
|
|
|
Steve Hinson
From:
Hendersonville Tn USA
|
Posted 18 Jan 2022 1:31 pm
|
|
Bill,the money fluctuates re:live stuff like it does for sessions, etc.,but generally it all
hovers around"scale"...unless you get in on the"good stuff",in which case it might be 3-4 times the"per day"scale...or more...
Hope you are well, my friend!
SH |
|
|
|
Samuel Phillippe
From:
Douglas Michigan, USA
|
Posted 19 Jan 2022 7:48 am
|
|
Happy to say in the early years of my playing I would only play fill in type gigs for whatever.....Made my living as an engineer.
Fast forward to late 1980's. Started playing small venues for $100 p/hr (playing time)
Never did this for a living , just to help me buy instruments and things. Now at 84 still only play for fill ins. |
|
|
|
b0b
From:
Cloverdale, CA, USA
|
Posted 19 Jan 2022 8:16 am
|
|
| b0b wrote: |
| In 1979 I spent a few months on the road for $500/week (if memory serves). Seemed like good money at the time, but family issues brought me back home. |
Yesterday I came across some records from 1979. That road work with an unknown band only paid $300/week. It was better than the $35/night I was making at home, but with 4 kids we were still struggling. The following year I abandoned the idea and took a day job building amps at Mesa/Boogie. I became a "weekend warrior" for the next 20 years. Guess I just wasn't cut out for road work. 
_________________
-πππ- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video |
|
|
|
Don R Brown
From:
Rochester, New York, USA
|
Posted 19 Jan 2022 1:58 pm
|
|
I've seen guys post on here something like "Back in 1980, I'd play a 3-set 4-hour gig, and they'd hand me $40. Now, these days, I play a 3-set, 4-hour gig and they hand me $40." 
_________________
Many play better than I do. Nobody has more fun. |
|
|
|
Roy Carroll
From:
North of a Round Rock
|
Posted 20 Jan 2022 7:06 am
|
|
Back in the 70's I was working the road and made $90 a night. Today, I work 2-3 nights a week and still make a $100 a night. I have no idea why the pay anywhere hasn't increased in 40 years. It seems that the clubs nowadays can't afford a full band. They want to use 1 guy and a guitar or a karaoke machine, but that is another story for another time.
_________________
Just north of the Weird place, south of Georgetown |
|
|
|
